12-19-2025, 01:18 PM
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#16641
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Owner
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Calgary
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Personally I think many on this site spend too much of their grey matter worrying about what could happen.
The Flames through Edwards clearly have a fear of losing the casual fan.
That's not a fact, but I think it's a logical assumption.
That has them avoiding saying certain things while clearly doing another.
But from my vantage point they will improve the franchise considerably if they continue to make prudent asset management decisions while continuing to draft and develop well.
All three of those facets have been very good in the last three years.
Will they win a Stanley Cup? I think that required the same three pillars but also a bunch of things going your way that are pretty hard to control.
But the obsession with Maloney's little face plant is way over cooked in my mind.
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12-19-2025, 01:19 PM
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#16642
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Powerplay Quarterback
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CFO
Flames need to draft well and hope on hits. Teams like Dallas are based on this. Get impact players within multiple rounds and every year there is always a big fish who becomes available for assets.
Rantanen.
Hughes
Eichel
Matthew k
Etc
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Agreed, but that's not a strategy though. It's just operational excellence that every team needs to strive for. No team goes up to the podium and picks a guy when they think someone else can be much greater.
Strategy would require the Flames pick a direction. However, the Flames strategy seems to be letting things play out and letting players choose to go or to stay and calling it "strong culture and being a place where players want to come and stay". They may think that Operational Excellence is a strategy - and that is the part that has some of us confused and 'enraged'.
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12-19-2025, 01:20 PM
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#16643
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Everyone's Favorite Oilfan!
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: San Jose, California
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Update from previous post:
Talks on hold for now. I wasn't given information if they couldn't agree on trade terms or if the player didn't agree to it, but there was interest but it didn't get to a level of a deal being done for now. Door isn't shut for now. Sharks are speaking with 2 other teams on a right shot defenseman as well. That's the biggest piece they want. 1 defenseman is from an Eastern Conference team and is already under contract.
Jeff Skinner is being benched for the 5th time in 8 games and he along with Ferraro and Liljegren are the pieces being explored. 2-3 teams have called on Liljegren.
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12-19-2025, 01:23 PM
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#16644
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Springbank
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macho0978
Best player in the league lol. I have always argued with people who don't give him enough credit for how good he is. I have said for years Point is good, but he isn't a high-end top line center without Kucherov.
But he is not the best player in the league. As a winger you just can't make the same impact as an elite center can. You just don't have the same responsibilities.
Wingers just don't impact the game defensively as much and Kucherov has 5 PK mins in the last 3 years. I would say Hedman is the best player on that team when it comes to winning games.
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You'd be wrong. Hedman is maybe 3rd or 4th in credit for their cup wins. Kucherov, Vasilevsky, Point, Hedman.
It is indeed harder for a winger to be in the top players. But there are some: Ovechkin, Howe, Hull, Lafleur, Iginla, Jagr, were all considered to be right at the top of the NHL at some point. More recently, Kucherov, Panarin, Kaprizov.
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12-19-2025, 01:25 PM
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#16645
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Franchise Player
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The toughest thing about any rebuild is that the difference between a successful one and an unsuccessful one can be really influenced by luck + timing. Luck is mostly due to the draft lottery and timing is mostly due to when the team bottoms out. It’s important to bottom out in drafts with elite centers to give your team the most important piece of any team that is a perennial contender. This is why I think San Jose and Anaheim are looking like successful rebuilds going forward. They bottomed out in drafts where they could get guys like Celebrini, Smith and Carlson. Compare that to New York bottoming out and getting Lafreniere and Kakko. Or Detroit who never really got any elite centers through their rebuild years.
My hope is that the flames get any of the top four players (McKenna, Stenberg, Lawrence or Verhoeff) in the 2026 draft. And then truly bottom out next year and get Alexis Joseph. Problem is that most of that working out is based on luck. Trading Andersson, Coleman and Kadri in the next 30 days would help solidify the odds that they at least get one of the top four players in the 2026 draft. Going into next season without any major adds to the group I think would solidify the likelihood of the flames drafting top 3 in that draft as well. The dream scenario is McKenna in this draft and Joseph in 2027. In that highly unlikely scenario, two years from now, the flames could be building a core group of forwards around McKenna, Joseph, Gridin, Coronato and Reschny… and a core defence around Parekh, Brz, Bahl, Kuznetzov and Mews.
Last edited by stemit14; 12-19-2025 at 01:28 PM.
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12-19-2025, 01:29 PM
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#16646
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Ate 100 Treadmills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GioforPM
Kucherov has been the best player in the league a couple years and in the top 5 every year except his injury year since 2020. He led the league in the last 2 seasons and was 3rd the year before.
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In 2019 he won the Hart, Lindsay and Art Ross. He was the best player in the league in 2018/19. Not just top 5.
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12-19-2025, 01:35 PM
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#16647
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Ate 100 Treadmills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saqe
Buffalo is the worst example ever and an outlier. You literally have to do everything wrong to get where they are: a meddling owner who wanted to cut corners and was cheap, horrible GM choices like Adams and same with coaching. Hiring constantly people with little or no experience.
Becoming Buffalo is really not something to worry about. Lacking top end talent is a much bigger problem.
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Buffalo is the worst example, but not the only one.
Also, bit of a moot point, as the Flames are in a rebuild. Hopefully, the do the obvious thing to complete that rebuild and move Andersson and Kadri (and also Coleman likely). They have moved their #1 goalie, #1 centre, multiple top 6 wingers, and multiple top 4 d-man. They are spending near the bottom of the league, after many years spending to the cap.
Hanging onto Andersson and Kadri seems like the right move, as both have likely maximized their value this year.
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12-19-2025, 01:39 PM
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#16648
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Crash and Bang Winger
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This org is looking at some very painful rebuild years ahead, if they don't start priotizes this year's draft. In all honesty not sure they have fully committed to a rebuild, for the life of me I can't understand why CC would not trade players like Andersson and Coleman ASAP, there priority should be securing a top 3 pick this year right now, holding on to Andersson and Coleman till the deadline is mistake, if the thought process is holding onto these players till the deadline to maximize their value, that is a huge mistake if it means this team crawls out of the basement to finish 20th in the league
Everything that CC does should be strategically centered around ensuring a top 3 pick, waiting till the deadline to get an extra 1st round pick in the 25-30, or a 2nd round ix completely useless if it means losing that top 3 pick. Teams do not trade top 3 picks, it almost never happens.
You have been given a gift CC, don't $#@$#@ blow it
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12-19-2025, 01:43 PM
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#16649
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Ate 100 Treadmills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by browntrout
This org is looking at some very painful rebuild years ahead, if they don't start priotizes this year's draft. In all honesty not sure they have fully committed to a rebuild, for the life of me I can't understand why CC would not trade players like Andersson and Coleman ASAP, there priority should be securing a top 3 pick this year right now, holding on to Andersson and Coleman till the deadline is mistake, if the thought process is holding onto these players till the deadline to maximize their value, that is a huge mistake if it means this team crawls out of the basement to finish 20th in the league
Everything that CC does should be strategically centered around ensuring a top 3 pick, waiting till the deadline to get an extra 1st round pick in the 25-30, or a 2nd round ix completely useless if it means losing that top 3 pick. Teams do not trade top 3 picks, it almost never happens.
You have been given a gift CC, don't $#@$#@ blow it
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Andersson's value was low last year. He's may be the highest value trade target in the league right now though. CC should look at maximizing value, instead of just forcing a deal.
If CC does not trade him before the deadline that is a major F-up. To be fair, it sounds like Andersson himself likely nixed a trade this summer. That, and Andersson playing out of his mind could be a massive windfall for the Flames.
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12-19-2025, 01:44 PM
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#16650
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OILFAN #81
Update from previous post:
Talks on hold for now. I wasn't given information if they couldn't agree on trade terms or if the player didn't agree to it, but there was interest but it didn't get to a level of a deal being done for now. Door isn't shut for now. Sharks are speaking with 2 other teams on a right shot defenseman as well. That's the biggest piece they want. 1 defenseman is from an Eastern Conference team and is already under contract.
Jeff Skinner is being benched for the 5th time in 8 games and he along with Ferraro and Liljegren are the pieces being explored. 2-3 teams have called on Liljegren.
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If that's the case no wonder the talks are on hold.
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12-19-2025, 01:45 PM
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#16651
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
In 2019 he won the Hart, Lindsay and Art Ross. He was the best player in the league in 2018/19. Not just top 5.
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Probably true, and yet that wasn't good enough to stop the Lightning from being swept in the first round by Columbus. Doesn't mean that being the best player and a centre would have 100% gotten them further in the playoffs, though.
__________________
"9 out of 10 concerns are completely unfounded."
"The first thing that goes when you lose your hands, are your fine motor skills."
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12-19-2025, 01:45 PM
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#16652
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason14h
Here's the issue though - We arent very good right now, AND need to replace Andersson, Coleman and Kadri as we enter our competitive years (Either traded or just old and gone, etc)
Lets say Parekh ends up as good as Andersson (No guarantee) and Gridin as good Coleman. And let's even add in Reschny becoming as good at Kadri.
The chance at all 3 of those things happening is low, but for argument lets assume.
All we've done is replicated our current situation but younger. We still have no 1st line. We are still missing 2 top 4 D (And arguable 3 depending on Weegar and when we are actually competitive)
Maybe you get 1 more surprise out of the existing base, and a few 3rd / 4th line type guys.
We are still 4/5 stud prospects away from having a proper base IMO.
This year and next you need to be bad - ideally bottom 3 bad and see where lottery lands.
2017 you can be better as you are improving but prob still a top 10.
If you can get 2 top 5 picks (and maybe better with some lottery luck) and another top 10 over the next 3 years with your own picks, and then find one quality player with the late firsts from trades you have at least a decent base and a punchers chance.
If you could do all that AND have one of the high picks be a 1st/franchise player you are looking at a proper new core potential.
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I see it differently obviously. You are way more pessimistic than me. Does this make your point of view more valid?
Rasmus - was a 2nd round pick. Flames have a LOT of ammo, so what makes you believe that one won't turn into another Andersson? Parekh is WAY ahead of Rasmus in their respective ages, no? So why would it be a reach for Parekh to be as good as Andersson?
Griden vs Coleman. Interesting. I see Gridin as a top-line scoring winger with size, explosive speed, and skill. Coleman has always been a middle-six defensive winger. I absolutely LOVE Coleman, and I would actually welcome an extension for him as he is exactly the type of vet I want young kids to be around. However, Gridin is on another level, if not two, in terms of scoring.
Sure, I agree with you on Reschny vs Kadri, but Reschny is trending very well. I had him as a 2nd line winger when the Flames drafted him, even with his amazing playoffs. I now have him as a 2nd line C in the NHL. Will he get there? I obviously think so, but we will see.
However, Coleman and Kadri were both UFA signings. Maybe the Flames replace them through the market? Conroy will also have a lot of leftover prospects and draft capital - not hard to see some good prospects get shipped out for good players too, right?
There is also the college free agents - most are just middlle 6 and bottom 4 defencemen, but they fill holes and allow other pieces to be moved in trades.
What year are the Flames in? They have built a VERY nice and deep prospect pool, and are only now starting to bottom-out. This year and next year they are likely adding franchise players. Plus, they already added some - Sorry, but I have Parekh as a franchise player, Wolf is, and I argue that Gridin is. Wyttenbach has really opened my eyes, but I am not quite ready to put him there yet. So let's build a roster now.
I will exclude any vet that is on the team right now - including Zary and Pospisil. I will make the cut-off with Coronato as he is signed long term, and so is Wolf. I will include Klapka simply because. This is the roster that I see shaping up:
Gridin - X - X (Gridin shoots right, but likes playing the left side)
Honzek - Reschny - Coronato
Wyttenbach - Stocksellus - Suniev
Basha - King - Klapka
Bahl - Parekh
Kuznetsov - Brzustewicz
Morin - Jamieson
Wolf
Zarubin
Obviously some guys are less likely to make it, but there is still a lot of depth. Zary can solidify his long-term status on the team - maybe he is Stocksellus in the roster. Maybe the Flames draft someone better in the 3C slot. Maybe Reschny is the 3C, and the Flames add two more better centers in the next 2-3 drafts? Or they trade for one? Didn't mention a handful of players that are looking promising - Potter, Mews, Laing, Phillips, Battaglia, etc. Matveiko is a complete unknown.
Plus, the Flames are going to draft high this year and most likely next year. Plus they will trade some players and get more futures - picks and prospects, right?
Then in 2027-28, they will probably be a team on the rise. I doubt they draft outside the top 10 though - probably somewhere between 7-10th. That's still adding another good player - maybe a 2nd line center, maybe a 1B center, or maybe a top-pairing defencemen. Flames got Parekh 9th after all, right? Maybe that draft is just as good?
You talk as if the Flames are done drafting. I think all they have done is built-up a really good base, and it is significant to point out that I think they have at least 2, but perhaps up to 4 core players drafted already before they even bottomed-out. That's the difference between my outlook and your outlook.
There will still be more players traded out. This isn't finished yet this year, even if all of Kadri, Coleman and Andersson move. Does Frost move next season? What if Weegar wants to move? Who knows whom else?
Plus there will be UFA signings. There will be College UFA signings. There may be European UFAs signed as well (last time the Flames went through a rebuild, they narrowly missed-out on Panarin). There will be regular UFA signings - with the new building + a young and upcoming team, why wouldn't the Flames be able to sign another Kadri down the road, or another Coleman? Or another Tanev? I don't believe they will ever be a top-end destination that will sign 1st line centers and so on, but they most certainly should become a team that can at least equal their former attractiveness.
Flames have 3 more drafts to build most of a core. They are ahead of where I thought they would be. I am very optimistic thus far. My roster will have busts on it for sure, but it will also have prospects that exceed expectations.. but 3 more drafts to add. That's not optimism to me, that's simply expectation. I honestly don't understand the pessimism in your post. 3 more draft to go, plus signings and trades. This is just the base so far, and it is better than expected.
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12-19-2025, 01:53 PM
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#16653
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Crash and Bang Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
Andersson's value was low last year. He's may be the highest value trade target in the league right now though. CC should look at maximizing value, instead of just forcing a deal.
If CC does not trade him before the deadline that is a major F-up. To be fair, it sounds like Andersson himself likely nixed a trade this summer. That, and Andersson playing out of his mind could be a massive windfall for the Flames.
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Yeah...I agree....just getting something of fair value for the two, he does not need to hit some huge homerun, get some pics, decent prospects and be done with it.
With the lack of available right shot defenceman, I find it very hard to believe that a decent deal is not available right now.
Losing a top 3 pick this year when the team desperately needs star power( I watched that game last night, this team has no high end talent, that grind it out, honourable hard working mantra will eventually wear a team out, its too hard on the body), is incredible short sighted and prolongs the rebuild.
Eventually fans are going to tune out if it's the same crap year after year.
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12-19-2025, 01:57 PM
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#16654
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Ate 100 Treadmills
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Quote:
Originally Posted by browntrout
Yeah...I agree....just getting something of fair value for the two, he does not need to hit some huge homerun, get some pics, decent prospects and be done with it.
With the lack of available right shot defenceman, I find it very hard to believe that a decent deal is not available right now.
Losing a top 3 pick this year when the team desperately needs star power( I watched that game last night, this team has no high end talent, that grind it out, honourable hard working mantra will eventually wear a team out, its too hard on the body), is incredible short sighted and prolongs the rebuild.
Eventually fans are going to tune out if it's the same crap year after year.
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Watching a bunch of mid players throw pucks into goalies' chests is extremely painful. Having an exciting young top end talent would definitely make the game more exciting for me.
Ideal would be having McKenna and Parekh pulling some fancy moves. Even if the Flames are losing, that would be much better to watch than the current product.
Once again, if CC doesn't go full rebuild this year, it's definitely a major F-up. I think what he has done so far has been good though.
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12-19-2025, 02:01 PM
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#16655
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
Watching a bunch of mid players throw pucks into goalies' chests is extremely painful. Having an exciting young top end talent would definitely make the game more exciting for me.
Ideal would be having McKenna and Parekh pulling some fancy moves. Even if the Flames are losing, that would be much better to watch than the current product.
Once again, if CC doesn't go full rebuild this year, it's definitely a major F-up. I think what he has done so far has been good though.
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I definitely agree, and part of the reason why I still have McKenna ranked first. This is an entertainment business, right? Parekh + McKenna + Wolf will be very entertaining for a decade.
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12-19-2025, 02:01 PM
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#16656
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Crash and Bang Winger
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe
I see it differently obviously. You are way more pessimistic than me. Does this make your point of view more valid?
Rasmus - was a 2nd round pick. Flames have a LOT of ammo, so what makes you believe that one won't turn into another Andersson? Parekh is WAY ahead of Rasmus in their respective ages, no? So why would it be a reach for Parekh to be as good as Andersson?
Griden vs Coleman. Interesting. I see Gridin as a top-line scoring winger with size, explosive speed, and skill. Coleman has always been a middle-six defensive winger. I absolutely LOVE Coleman, and I would actually welcome an extension for him as he is exactly the type of vet I want young kids to be around. However, Gridin is on another level, if not two, in terms of scoring.
Sure, I agree with you on Reschny vs Kadri, but Reschny is trending very well. I had him as a 2nd line winger when the Flames drafted him, even with his amazing playoffs. I now have him as a 2nd line C in the NHL. Will he get there? I obviously think so, but we will see.
However, Coleman and Kadri were both UFA signings. Maybe the Flames replace them through the market? Conroy will also have a lot of leftover prospects and draft capital - not hard to see some good prospects get shipped out for good players too, right?
There is also the college free agents - most are just middlle 6 and bottom 4 defencemen, but they fill holes and allow other pieces to be moved in trades.
What year are the Flames in? They have built a VERY nice and deep prospect pool, and are only now starting to bottom-out. This year and next year they are likely adding franchise players. Plus, they already added some - Sorry, but I have Parekh as a franchise player, Wolf is, and I argue that Gridin is. Wyttenbach has really opened my eyes, but I am not quite ready to put him there yet. So let's build a roster now.
I will exclude any vet that is on the team right now - including Zary and Pospisil. I will make the cut-off with Coronato as he is signed long term, and so is Wolf. I will include Klapka simply because. This is the roster that I see shaping up:
Gridin - X - X (Gridin shoots right, but likes playing the left side)
Honzek - Reschny - Coronato
Wyttenbach - Stocksellus - Suniev
Basha - King - Klapka
Bahl - Parekh
Kuznetsov - Brzustewicz
Morin - Jamieson
Wolf
Zarubin
Obviously some guys are less likely to make it, but there is still a lot of depth. Zary can solidify his long-term status on the team - maybe he is Stocksellus in the roster. Maybe the Flames draft someone better in the 3C slot. Maybe Reschny is the 3C, and the Flames add two more better centers in the next 2-3 drafts? Or they trade for one? Didn't mention a handful of players that are looking promising - Potter, Mews, Laing, Phillips, Battaglia, etc. Matveiko is a complete unknown.
Plus, the Flames are going to draft high this year and most likely next year. Plus they will trade some players and get more futures - picks and prospects, right?
Then in 2027-28, they will probably be a team on the rise. I doubt they draft outside the top 10 though - probably somewhere between 7-10th. That's still adding another good player - maybe a 2nd line center, maybe a 1B center, or maybe a top-pairing defencemen. Flames got Parekh 9th after all, right? Maybe that draft is just as good?
You talk as if the Flames are done drafting. I think all they have done is built-up a really good base, and it is significant to point out that I think they have at least 2, but perhaps up to 4 core players drafted already before they even bottomed-out. That's the difference between my outlook and your outlook.
There will still be more players traded out. This isn't finished yet this year, even if all of Kadri, Coleman and Andersson move. Does Frost move next season? What if Weegar wants to move? Who knows whom else?
Plus there will be UFA signings. There will be College UFA signings. There may be European UFAs signed as well (last time the Flames went through a rebuild, they narrowly missed-out on Panarin). There will be regular UFA signings - with the new building + a young and upcoming team, why wouldn't the Flames be able to sign another Kadri down the road, or another Coleman? Or another Tanev? I don't believe they will ever be a top-end destination that will sign 1st line centers and so on, but they most certainly should become a team that can at least equal their former attractiveness.
Flames have 3 more drafts to build most of a core. They are ahead of where I thought they would be. I am very optimistic thus far. My roster will have busts on it for sure, but it will also have prospects that exceed expectations.. but 3 more drafts to add. That's not optimism to me, that's simply expectation. I honestly don't understand the pessimism in your post. 3 more draft to go, plus signings and trades. This is just the base so far, and it is better than expected.
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I think you are getting way ahead of yourself, players like gridin, Parekh, Reschny, suniev, Honzek, have not established themselves, and you have them penciled in opening line-ups, come back once they have put up consistent points in the NHL, until then, they are maybe's.
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12-19-2025, 02:06 PM
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#16657
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by browntrout
I think you are getting way ahead of yourself, players like gridin, Parekh, Reschny, suniev, Honzek, have not established themselves, and you have them penciled in opening line-ups, come back once they have put up consistent points in the NHL, until then, they are maybe's.
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Of course I am. This is an example of the 'base'. There will be 3 more drafts pushing some kids down and off the roster, some will outright bust, some trades will happen, some UFA signings will happen, and some other kids will exceed expectations.
Point is that there is genuine reason to be excited since the Flames are only bottoming-out and they have arguably 3 core pieces drafted + a lot of potential drafted already. That's exactly the point here.
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12-19-2025, 02:19 PM
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#16658
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Calgary, AB
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Flames have been rumoured to have interest in Ferraro for a while.
It would be very flames to do something like Ferraro + 1st for Andersson
I'd be pretty certain the eastern conference RH dman would be Hamilton who has been rumoured to have been on the block, has term, and could be a fit for San Jose
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12-19-2025, 02:24 PM
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#16659
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Macho0978
Buffalo and really Arizona are terrible examples of failed rebuilds. Both teams have other circumstances that caused the rebuild to fail.
Maybe Utah can pull out of it, but Buffalo is Buffalo and the Flames shouldn't have the same issues if they draft the talent Buffalo has over the years.
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As long as we don’t end up like Columbus or Seattle or the mushy middle Devils we should be fine. Don’t be Buffalo or Utah/Arizona either.
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12-19-2025, 02:26 PM
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#16660
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First Line Centre
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuperMatt18
Flames have been rumoured to have interest in Ferraro for a while.
It would be very flames to do something like Ferraro + 1st for Andersson
I'd be pretty certain the eastern conference RH dman would be Hamilton who has been rumoured to have been on the block, has term, and could be a fit for San Jose
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Ferraro is a good player, but I don't think he would be good return in the package you outline. Unless the Flames are interested in moving Weegar, who I assume has pretty low value now based on his play this season.
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