American Politics 4.0 - Orangeyou Glad He’s Back?

[OldDutch]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

People from industry have weighed in, and everyone agrees the tariffs will be bad for both economies and especially the consumer.

What are you even talking about?

Exactly. Yet all we are hearing is bad for our economy.

What I am talking about is that this is a show we have seen before in the first Trump term. Where did that go? Right, they were removed once Trump made his political point, but after pressure from his own party.

He's latched on to this threat, basically because it works. Look at this thread. Very few are actually talking about the details. What I am saying is look at the facts. He's shooting himself in the foot Day 1. He has an agenda he needs support with. He will lose this support quickly if goes ahead.

So my point is, he knows what he is doing, we have seen how it plays out, yet here we are falling for it again.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by WideReceiver

A real senator would find that stuff fascinating.

Clay Davis would fit so well in this government. Secretary of Sheeeeeeiiiiiiitt.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by OldDutch

Exactly. Yet all we are hearing is bad for our economy.

What I am talking about is that this is a show we have seen before in the first Trump term. Where did that go? Right, they were removed once Trump made his political point, but after pressure from his own party.

He's latched on to this threat, basically because it works. Look at this thread. Very few are actually talking about the details. What I am saying is look at the facts. He's shooting himself in the foot Day 1. He has an agenda he needs support with. He will lose this support quickly if goes ahead.

So my point is, he knows what he is doing, we have seen how it plays out, yet here we are falling for it again.

I think any time you say Donald Trump knows what he is doing leads people to question your thesis. There is no evidence he ever knows what he is doing, or what the consequences of his actions are.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by OldDutch

Exactly. Yet all we are hearing is bad for our economy.

What I am talking about is that this is a show we have seen before in the first Trump term. Where did that go? Right, they were removed once Trump made his political point, but after pressure from his own party.

He's latched on to this threat, basically because it works. Look at this thread. Very few are actually talking about the details. What I am saying is look at the facts. He's shooting himself in the foot Day 1. He has an agenda he needs support with. He will lose this support quickly if goes ahead.

So my point is, he knows what he is doing, we have seen how it plays out, yet here we are falling for it again.

I'm not sure what your point is still. In his first term, Trump instituted a 25% tariff on Canadian steel & aluminum. Canada retaliated, targeting multiple US industries that equaled the total trade value of the steel & aluminum.

This time Trump is saying universal 25% tariff on Canada. The hope is that it doesn't come to fruition, but with six days to go all signs point towards that reality.

What 'facts' should we be discussing? The exact details of how the free markets will react is unpredictable.

[FlamesAddiction]

Is he still saying he is put blanket tariffs on everything from China as well, or has he back down from that? The media seems to be focusing on the Canada sanctions, but I believe he threatened the same thing against China, BRICS, the EU, and Mexico.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Is he still saying he is put blanket tariffs on everything from China as well, or has he back down from that? The media seems to be focusing on the Canada sanctions, but I believe he threatened the same thing against China, BRICS, the EU, and Mexico.

I thought he was going to do 15% for China. They still need too much of their goods.

Tariff Man! that's what he wants to be called. lol

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

I thought he was going to do 15% for China. They still need too much of their goods.

Tariff Man! that's what he wants to be called. lol

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgrwj0p2dd9o

He threatened 100% tariffs on BRICS, 25% on Canada & Mexico, but has been very vague about EU.

[puffnstuff]

And in other news...
'Insiders at a RFK Jr.-led nonprofit questioned why/how he funneled $67 million to a small environmental group he & a hedge-fund billionaire helped set up in the Bahamas. A board member resigned over this, noting he couldn't get RFK to explain it.'

https://www.motherjones.com/politics...bacon-bahamas/

[OldDutch]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I think any time you say Donald Trump knows what he is doing leads people to question your thesis. There is no evidence he ever knows what he is doing, or what the consequences of his actions are.

This is why Progressives continue to lose to him. He's not a superior opponent, but a clever one. You need to start to respect your opponent no matter how you detest him.

Flying off the handle maybe cathartic, but it fuels him. He wants that as it lowers the field to his level, and he'll never lose at that level. This has been shown countless times.

[OldDutch]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

What 'facts' should we be discussing? The exact details of how the free markets will react is unpredictable.

I don't think I can be more clear but will try. Let's look at the facts of the trade relationship between Canada and USA. Right now we are treating this as a simple black and white, tariff will hurt us not USA.

Its not that simple and Trump is welcome to try. He'll find out the nuance. Or we can panic and forget the man with the gun is pointing it at his foot and threating to pull the trigger.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by OldDutch

This is why Progressives continue to lose to him. He's not a superior opponent, but a clever one. You need to start to respect your opponent no matter how you detest him.

Flying off the handle maybe cathartic, but it fuels him. He wants that as it lowers the field to his level, and he'll never lose at that level. This has been shown countless times.

It's amazing people think he's some cunning strategist. And of course he loses. He loses all the time. He's the biggest loser ever to be elected to the Whitehouse, which means he probably got there for other reasons, like, I dunno, the worlds richest man manipulating his social media platform and spreading misinformation, and well, straight up bull####, while claiming a neutral platform and banning views that didn't align with Trump getting elected. And now using that position to push his own agenda? It's almost like tricking the mentally susceptible is easy and works. Hrmmm.

[Mean Mr. Mustard]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cgrwj0p2dd9o

He threatened 100% tariffs on BRICS, 25% on Canada & Mexico, but has been very vague about EU.

So the plan is to decrease taxes for the rich and corporations, slash funding to social services, and increase the price of goods to the general population, of whom a large population are socially disenfranchised. The fact that this guy has been able to fool a significant portion of the population into voting for someone, against their own self interests is absolutely baffling

Even if you ignore all the personal failings, including sexual violence and all of his business failings such as not paying contractors and peddling absolut is junk to the masses... How does someone vote for someone who campaigns on the destruction of their quality of life.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Because you can't put a price on the joy that owning the libs brings. Owning the libs > owning a home.

[activeStick]

Originally Posted by senator clay davis

clay davis would fit so well in this government. Secretary of sheeeeeeiiiiiiitt.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1877390807839187434

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Owning the libs > owning a home.

Aren’t Republican voters getting both at this point?

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by OldDutch

I don't think I can be more clear but will try. Let's look at the facts of the trade relationship between Canada and USA. Right now we are treating this as a simple black and white, tariff will hurt us not USA.

Its not that simple and Trump is welcome to try. He'll find out the nuance. Or we can panic and forget the man with the gun is pointing it at his foot and threating to pull the trigger.

I've said in my posts (and others have) that the tariffs will hurt both US & Canadian consumers.

When my company sells product into the USA, the American will pay the tariff. Our customers will pass that cost along downstream, all the way to the consumer. In response, our US customers try to find domestic suppliers, thereby hurting my company (and Canadian consumers like me).

Same with Alberta crude that gets sent down there. The costs will get passed along until it meets the US consumer at the gas pump, or his heating bill.

[FlamesAddiction]

The tariffs will hurt us and the U.S., plus the tariffs Trump says he is going to impose on other countries will those countries and the U.S.

I kind of get the isolationist perspective. Large nations that have the territory and resources to be self-sufficient can benefit in some ways by going alone. But like communism, it's something works in theory, but breaks down in practice. There are always going to be somethings your country just can't produce economically, or even at all, necessitating trade and alliances. Especially in this day of age where products and supply chains have become very complicated. It's a much different world than it was 100 years ago. The other option is for isolationist nations to just appropriate what they need, which is what brought us things like colonialism and eventually world wars.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

The tariffs will hurt us and the U.S., plus the tariffs Trump says he is going to impose on other countries will those countries and the U.S.

I kind of get the isolationist perspective. Large nations that have the territory and resources to be self-sufficient can benefit in some ways by going alone. But like communism, it's something works in theory, but breaks down in practice. There are always going to be somethings your country just can't produce economically, or even at all, necessitating trade and alliances. Especially in this day of age where products and supply chains have become very complicated. It's a much different world than it was 100 years ago. The other option is for isolationist nations to just appropriate what they need, which is what brought us things like colonialism and eventually world wars.

Okay, I'll say this again. I'm unconvinced that the Tariffs are even remotely real.

Its typical Trumpy blowhard BS.

"Okay, okay! The Tariffs...the Tariffs were great! Great idea! But it was too much, so we made a better deal, we brought the Tariffs down, the Tariffs were great, but we had to bring them down and scrap some and we arranged a better deal, we got a better deal for America!"

Like...its just a few months of panicking other concerned parties prior to taking office in order to make them more willing to deal down the road.

Its like something a child would do when trying to trade their snacks at lunch. It is so obvious and transparent as to be borderline hilarious.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Locke

Okay, I'll say this again. I'm unconvinced that the Tariffs are even remotely real.

Its typical Trumpy blowhard BS.

"Okay, okay! The Tariffs...the Tariffs were great! Great idea! But it was too much, so we made a better deal, we brought the Tariffs down, the Tariffs were great, but we had to bring them down and scrap some and we arranged a better deal, we got a better deal for America!"

Like...its just a few months of panicking other concerned parties prior to taking office in order to make them more willing to deal down the road.

Its like something a child would do when trying to trade their snacks at lunch. It is so obvious and transparent as to be borderline hilarious.

Canadian premiers are all meeting today in person to plan how to respond. The federal government is planning to announce retalitory tariffs.

Sounds pretty goddam real to me.

We will find out in 5 days.

[activeStick]

Their meetings have finished and they've been on live for about 15 minutes now at a press conference taking questions. Reporter asked if Smith's absence was a concern, which worried me as she isn't at her seat at this press conference, but Trudeau clarified that she was at the earlier meetings and just couldn't make this press conference.

So far, it's been a united message going out which is not surprising, but still good to see. Haven't heard any specifics about the plan, which also isn't surprising since I'm sure they don't want to show Americans our plan.

Hockey analogy count so far: 1