American Politics 3.0 - Back to Brunch

[Reggie Dunlop]

Trump is just the front man for guys like Steve Bannon, Tom Cotton and organizations like the Claremont Institute, Federalist Society and Heritage Foundation.

If there's future elections, they will be of the Vladimir Putin variety. The Democratic Party will likely be banned and a nominal "opposition" party run as the proxy alternative in its place.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

EDIT: I think the "I'll be a dictator on day 1" quote is very similar. Watch the context - he's clearly joking. Yet it's a far more alarming joke coming from him than it would have been coming from John McCain or Mitt Romney.

I am obviously not a psychologist, but I am pretty sure Trump has some kind of pathological thought processes that make him very good at manipulating people to his will. I don't think he is overly intelligent or has a systematic plan, but I think it just comes naturally to him. I see the use of humour as a way to test support for ideas without having to seem committed to them and as a way to warm people up to ideas that would otherwise be quickly dismissed. Humour is a technique a lot of people use to make people more comfortable with ideas that are scary.

[Maritime Q-Scout]

Trump has a way about him that people think "is he doesn't mean it".

Yet, his actions show that he does.

Trump doesn't mean he's going to be a dictator when he says it

Trump doesn't mean this will be the last election if he wins

Let's say for a second that's correct. Why the bloody hell would someone running for President of the United States even say that?!

That, right there, shows Trump isn't equipped for the job.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by photon

I definitely didn't read the intention to end elections into Trump's "you won't have to vote anymore" comment, I think there's a bit of overreaction to it.

To me he's saying that he'll have fixed all the things Christians are concerned about so after he's done it won't matter who gets elected because things will be "fixed". Whatever that means, it's his typical promise everything even if it's impossible or undefined.

Does he really deserve the benefit of the doubt? How many hints about undermining the democratic process does the guy have to drop before people have had enough.

And then there was the time he actually undermined the democratic process (not conceding the last election) and stirred up the crazies for January 6th. Small details I guess.

Trump has been slowly boiling the frog and people keep brushing it off as nothing all the time. There was a time (probably a more sensible time) where any mention of any of this type of stuff would have had you laughed off the political playing field. Now it seems some people actually want it.

[MoneyGuy]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Trump has a way about him that people think "is he doesn't mean it".

Yet, his actions show that he does.

Trump doesn't mean he's going to be a dictator when he says it

Trump doesn't mean this will be the last election if he wins

Let's say for a second that's correct. Why the bloody hell would someone running for President of the United States even say that?!

That, right there, shows Trump isn't equipped for the job.

Because he wants to be dictator for life, and to make it multigenerational by passing it down the line.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by photon

I definitely didn't read the intention to end elections into Trump's "you won't have to vote anymore" comment, I think there's a bit of overreaction to it.

To me he's saying that he'll have fixed all the things Christians are concerned about so after he's done it won't matter who gets elected because things will be "fixed". Whatever that means, it's his typical promise everything even if it's impossible or undefined.

That makes absolutely no sense. Let's take it at face value for a second.

1) Trump wins the 2024 election.

2) American democracy is not harmed. Future elections still happen and are not rigged.

3) Trump "fixes" whatever the Christians want "fixed".

4) Democrats win the 2028 election and take the house, senate, and WH because Christian republicans didn't vote (they were told they didn't have to).

5) Democrats are unable to reverse the "fixing" Trump did.

Does this timeline make any sense to you? It shouldn't. Because it's impossible.

Literally the only way his comment makes any sense is if he means all future elections will be rigged to ensure Republican victory.

[CliffFletcher]

Do the people who comment online that they think the Republicans will ban the Democratic party and this will be the last free federal election in America genuinely believe what they say? If so, you’d think they would be doing more about it than posting a few comments online between binge-watching the Boys.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Do the people who comment online that they think the Republicans will ban the Democratic party and this will be the last free federal election in America genuinely believe what they say? If so, you’d think they would be doing more about it than posting a few comments online between binge-watching the Boys.

Is your memory so short as to forget what Trump desperately tried to do following the last election loss?

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

Does this timeline make any sense to you? It shouldn't. Because it's impossible.

Literally the only way his comment makes any sense is if he means all future elections will be rigged to ensure Republican victory.

If Trump wins, he will likely be able to replace Thomas and Alito (and potentially Roberts) on the Supreme Court with younger justices, effectively ensuring a 6-3 conservative majority for the next 15-20 years. So yeah, I think it's plausible that Trump could get evangelicals what they want on most of their issues without ending American democracy.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Is your memory so short as to forget what Trump desperately tried to do following the last election loss?

I don't think the question is "will he try to lie about the results and cheat to win wherever possible and enlist his supporters to that cause". No one reasonably doubts that he will. The question is how far down the authoritarian rabbit hole things go if he does get another 4 years. I think there are a wide range of outcomes on that front that I find plausible, and of course, none of them are good.

[photon]

Of course his comments don't make logical sense, he's a moron. He's just saying whatever he thinks in the moment will make people vote for him, he's not thinking any further than that.

"We’ll have it fixed so good you’re not going to have to vote" is the same kind of vague promise as "cheaper better health care for all Americans" that he promised. Or promising to fix infrastructure.

Originally Posted by Igottago

Does he really deserve the benefit of the doubt?

No, but I don't think it helps anything to exaggerate what he's saying by dipping into what he *could* mean behind his literal words when there's already SO much that he's said with his literal words that should be focused on.

How much media play did him saying bombing Mexico is absolutely on the table recently? Or how his plan to jack up tariffs will cost the economy $Billions and jack up inflation?

With limited media time I just think there's already a ton of actual problematic and anti-democratic stuff he's said without vague promises sounding vaguely anti-democratic. They absolutely should report it when he says he'll be a dictator for a day.

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Let's say for a second that's correct. Why the bloody hell would someone running for President of the United States even say that?!

That, right there, shows Trump isn't equipped for the job.

Unfortunately everyone that sees he isn't equipped for the job has already decided to not voting for him so highlighting his nonsense has little impact.. I guess I can't blame the media for repeating the sensationalist stuff that'll get them $$.

EDIT: Should have said over-reacting to his nonsense, highlight his nonsense for sure, stuff he's actually said.

But for every independent that could be convinced that he's anti-democratic is there one that gets pushed away by the media over-reacting to his words? I would love to think not but how close this race is makes it hard to believe not.

[Itse]

Originally Posted by photon

I definitely didn't read the intention to end elections into Trump's "you won't have to vote anymore" comment, I think there's a bit of overreaction to it.

To me he's saying that he'll have fixed all the things Christians are concerned about so after he's done it won't matter who gets elected because things will be "fixed". Whatever that means, it's his typical promise everything even if it's impossible or undefined.

I don't agree with that interpretation at all.

He is very obviously saying that whatever he plans, he means to make the changes permanent in the sense that the Democrats can't get their way.

Sure, it doesn't necessarily mean that there literally won't be any more elections, he just means that it will be impossible to change anything through elections... But why would anyone care about that distinction?

Iran has elections. Russia has elections, Venezuela has elections, Cuba has elections. Even China has elections, but only within the party, so ordinary people don't "have to" vote.

We don't nees to know which system specifically he is talking about. It's quite likely he himself is fuzzy on the details. But he is very clearly talking about something in that style, and we know that his dear friend Vladimir will be happy to give him pointers on how to make that happen.

There is no democracy where things "stay fixed", and there is no candidate that doesn't aspire to authoritarism that says all the things Trump keeps saying. He says it all the damned time.

I feel that I'm in some bizarroland for even needing to point out something this obvious to people.

Why would anyone give him the benefit of a doubt, when that doubt requires you to ignore everything he's said and done during his political career?

[Itse]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Do the people who comment online that they think the Republicans will ban the Democratic party and this will be the last free federal election in America genuinely believe what they say? If so, you’d think they would be doing more about it than posting a few comments online between binge-watching the Boys.

The problem is that the Democrats are trying to defend Democracy with peaceful democracy, and that doesn't really give people that many things they can do, except to shout it from the metaphorical rooftops.

[photon]

I think looking at that much depth gives Trump too much credit. As far as he knows he can change the law himself to make it permanent, he has no idea how government actually works.

[photon]

I mean Trump literally called Harris "evil".

For the party that was complaining how Dem's "inflammatory rhetoric" caused the assassination attempt that doesn't qualify as inflammatory?

That seems more report worthy than Trump promising to do things for Christians.

[Inglewood Jack]

Originally Posted by photon

I think looking at that much depth gives Trump too much credit. As far as he knows he can change the law himself to make it permanent, he has no idea how government actually works.

Everyone knows Trump in isolation is a bunch of nonsensical hot air. Pay attention to the men behind the curtain.

[Itse]

...also:

Trump isn't big on metaphors, never has been. When he says he wants to shut the border by building wall, he literally means a wall. When he says he is the best, he means it absolutely literally. When he said he thinks that embassadors are pointless, he didn't appoint them. When he said he wants to "negotiate better deals for the US", he got into a lot of stupid and costly trade wars because he has no understanding of international trade and diplomacy, but he very obviously was trying to just literally "negotiate better deals".

He says a lot of weird nonensical stuff because he is weird and dumb, and he lies a lot, and throws around a lot of insults, but those are pretty much his three modes of talking. It's probably what people mean when they say he "speaks the truth". He just isn't a guy that does a lot of symbolic or metaphorical talk.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by photon

I think looking at that much depth gives Trump too much credit. As far as he knows he can change the law himself to make it permanent, he has no idea how government actually works.

He doesn't really need to if he unpacks Project 2025 and lets them do their thing. Whether or not it would succeed, I don't know.

[photon]

Agree, Project 2025 is tons of ammo and why Trump is trying to distance himself from it in public. They need to keep bringing Project 2025 and Trump's association with it up.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by opendoor

If Trump wins, he will likely be able to replace Thomas and Alito (and potentially Roberts) on the Supreme Court with younger justices, effectively ensuring a 6-3 conservative majority for the next 15-20 years. So yeah, I think it's plausible that Trump could get evangelicals what they want on most of their issues without ending American democracy.

If the Democrats get a trifecta in 2028 (WH/House/Senate), they will almost certainly expand the court.

It will be very hard for them to get the trifecta in this election, but it's possible.