The Tesla Thread

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Another thing that's starting to annoy me with EVs is the constant flex on how fast they are. Yes, I get they blow ICE cars out of the water in terms of acceleration. But does a soccer mom or a teenager who just go their license really need that much speed? When do we hit a point where we think the average car is TOO fast?

Well, I think there are two different sets of drivers in this regard.

For enthusiasts, the speed is fun. And we will probably continue to see a little more of it, though we are getting close to the point where further improvements are essentially useless and dangerous. None the less, I expect the high end of the market to still maintain this aspect of the equation.

But for soccer moms, and more generally, the lower end of the market, cost is always primary - the market wants as many features and comforts as they can get, at minimal cost. In this segment, I expect speed will be a complete non-issue. Give people a solid mini-van, or a stylish SUV, and do so at about the same price as an ICE version, with good battery life, and most people would be open to buying one.

[Hack&Lube]

https://www.tesla.com/en_CA/support/...g-tesla-vision

For a short period of time during this transition, Tesla Vision vehicles that are not equipped with USS will be delivered with some features temporarily limited or inactive, which includes the features outlined in the table below.

Park Assist X
Autopark X
Summon X
Smart Summon X

I just took delivery of a Model 3 without USS. Thank god I didn't pay for autopilot, this is such a piece of garbage with no timeline or explanation of how the cameras are going to take over the role when they were never designed to image that low. The original engineers expected ultrasonics and radar in the bumper so the cameras are up high. My 15 year old car has USS so I know not to hit a curb but now the car can't see if an object is in front of the bumper since USS was removed.

In addition to this delete, there are the other well known ones such as delete of USB C data ports in the console, removal of mobile charging kit (buy separately), deletion of passenger lumbar support, standard connectivity is now time limited, etc.

[Mazrim]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

In addition to this delete, there are the other well known ones such as delete of USB C data ports in the console, removal of mobile charging kit (buy separately), deletion of passenger lumbar support, standard connectivity is now time limited, etc.

And I'm sure they're lowering the price of the car to account for all these things they removed?

[Wormius]

Are they removing features in vehicles that are supported by the hardware?? That seems incredibly lazy.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Mazrim

And I'm sure they're lowering the price of the car to account for all these things they removed?

Tesla already has by far the largest gross margin because the cost of their cars is based in what people will pay.


Sadly I don't see this denting demand and changing the way overpriced vehicles

[Enoch Root]

Demand will be dented when there are more alternatives. And when that happens, they will have to be more price competitive.

They have already lost market share in the higher end, Model S - Porsche sold more Taycans last year than Tesla sold S'es

The vast majority of their sales are in the Model 3s, which will be much more price sensitive.

[dino7c]

I don't think Musk going bat#### crazy and full Trump mode is going to help his cause

Tesla is losing its cool factor IMO

Maybe he has gained some rednecks but I highly doubt it

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Hack&Lube

https://www.tesla.com/en_CA/support/...g-tesla-vision

For a short period of time during this transition, Tesla Vision vehicles that are not equipped with USS will be delivered with some features temporarily limited or inactive, which includes the features outlined in the table below.

Park Assist X
Autopark X
Summon X
Smart Summon X

I just took delivery of a Model 3 without USS. Thank god I didn't pay for autopilot, this is such a piece of garbage with no timeline or explanation of how the cameras are going to take over the role when they were never designed to image that low. The original engineers expected ultrasonics and radar in the bumper so the cameras are up high. My 15 year old car has USS so I know not to hit a curb but now the car can't see if an object is in front of the bumper since USS was removed.

In addition to this delete, there are the other well known ones such as delete of USB C data ports in the console, removal of mobile charging kit (buy separately), deletion of passenger lumbar support, standard connectivity is now time limited, etc.

Pretty irresponsable to remove hardware before you have a workaround. As any Tesla owner already knows "temporarily" may as well coincide with the release of the Cybertruck. With all the weird stuff going on with Twitter you have to wonder if Elon is going to end up sabotaging both Tesla and Twitter.

[Fuzz]

Speaking of the cybertruck, it's been delayed until the end of 2023.

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-now-plans...e-e-1849726957

Guess I won my bet with my brother that the Lightening would outsell the Cybertruck by the end of 2023. He said they'd outsell it 10:1! LOL. This feels like it should be a lifetime of beer for that beating.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Tesla is losing its cool factor IMO

Losing? It was lost a long time ago, IMO.

There was a time I actually wanted the Model S or Model X... now I couldn't give a crap about either, and I don't care how fast they are; they and the rest of the Tesla line-up are entirely off my radar when it comes time to buy an EV. The build quality is woeful, the chargers are proprietary instead of the J1772 that pretty much every other manufacturer has standardized on that are proliferating across the country (just look at ChargeHub), and there is more interesting product in and on its way to the market from other manufacturers.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Losing? It was lost a long time ago, IMO.

There was a time I actually wanted the Model S or Model X... now I couldn't give a crap about either, and I don't care how fast they are; they and the rest of the Tesla line-up are entirely off my radar when it comes time to buy an EV. The build quality is woeful, the chargers are proprietary instead of the J1772 that pretty much every other manufacturer has standardized on that are proliferating across the country (just look at ChargeHub), and there is more interesting product in and on its way to the market from other manufacturers.

I meant to the general public...obviously you have done your research

[ripTDR]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Losing? It was lost a long time ago, IMO.

There was a time I actually wanted the Model S or Model X... now I couldn't give a crap about either, and I don't care how fast they are; they and the rest of the Tesla line-up are entirely off my radar when it comes time to buy an EV. The build quality is woeful, the chargers are proprietary instead of the J1772 that pretty much every other manufacturer has standardized on that are proliferating across the country (just look at ChargeHub), and there is more interesting product in and on its way to the market from other manufacturers.

Isn't the J1772 adapter just for level 2 charging? You get an adapter for every Tesla you buy It's the CCS1 that's huge and clunky for level 3 charging. I find the Telsa charging to be sleek and easy to use, plus you can easily get the adapters for the CCS1 and CHADemo.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

Losing? It was lost a long time ago, IMO.

There was a time I actually wanted the Model S or Model X... now I couldn't give a crap about either, and I don't care how fast they are; they and the rest of the Tesla line-up are entirely off my radar when it comes time to buy an EV. The build quality is woeful, the chargers are proprietary instead of the J1772 that pretty much every other manufacturer has standardized on that are proliferating across the country (just look at ChargeHub), and there is more interesting product in and on its way to the market from other manufacturers.

Plus you dont have to fund a megalomaniac's fever dreams.

There is always that.

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Demand will be dented when there are more alternatives. And when that happens, they will have to be more price competitive.

They have already lost market share in the higher end, Model S - Porsche sold more Taycans last year than Tesla sold S'es

The vast majority of their sales are in the Model 3s, which will be much more price sensitive.

Audi's eTron options looks great at a competitive price. The only issue is the timeline for the wait.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by ripTDR

Isn't the J1772 adapter just for level 2 charging? You get an adapter for every Tesla you buy It's the CCS1 that's huge and clunky for level 3 charging. I find the Telsa charging to be sleek and easy to use, plus you can easily get the adapters for the CCS1 and CHADemo.

J1772 / CCS is somewhat interchangible terminology. Level 3 just has the additional lower ports for the DC connections.

The point is, the worlds car manufacturers have determined a standard for EV charging. Tesla even uses it worldwide.

Every Tesla sold now in north America is a vehicle that will require an adaptor to charge in the future - EVEN at tesla's own stations.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Speaking of the cybertruck, it's been delayed until the end of 2023.

https://jalopnik.com/tesla-now-plans...e-e-1849726957

Guess I won my bet with my brother that the Lightening would outsell the Cybertruck by the end of 2023. He said they'd outsell it 10:1! LOL. This feels like it should be a lifetime of beer for that beating.

This pretty much guarantees that the Cybertruck will always behind other EV trucks in total number sold.

An additional problem is that Cybertrucks aren't going to sell anywhere close to the promised $40k (starting). There's no way a cybertruck is going to sell for the same price as a model 3, never mind significantly cheaper. Fully expect them to be in the same price range as the Rivian, Ford, and GM alternatives.

I don't think anyone has even seen a production version cybertruck yet. Canoo might even be selling vehicles before the Cybertruck is available.

[afc wimbledon]

BMW plan on selling the heated seat feature on some of their cars as a subscription feature, it will cost you 20$ a month to have your seats heat up, if they get away with it I can see every feature on a Telsa costing you a separate fee, accelerator? 15$ a month to you, bluetooth? that'll be 10$, why not buy the package all the prime features plus your choice of 4 luxury items for 150$ a month.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

BMW plan on selling the heated seat feature on some of their cars as a subscription feature, it will cost you 20$ a month to have your seats heat up, if they get away with it I can see every feature on a Telsa costing you a separate fee, accelerator? 15$ a month to you, bluetooth? that'll be 10$, why not buy the package all the prime features plus your choice of 4 luxury items for 150$ a month.

Yup. They're all looking at the subscription model. It's only really come up because Tesla has done it already. The low range Tesla that was available on Canada when they could still get a subsidy was the same size battery just software locked out. The "self driving package" is already hardware equipped, just locked out. Then Tesla suggested they may offer subscribe packages for it and the other OEMs took note

[photon]

You can bundle your heated seats with a Twitter blue check, $27.50 for both.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

BMW plan on selling the heated seat feature on some of their cars as a subscription feature, it will cost you 20$ a month to have your seats heat up, if they get away with it I can see every feature on a Telsa costing you a separate fee, accelerator? 15$ a month to you, bluetooth? that'll be 10$, why not buy the package all the prime features plus your choice of 4 luxury items for 150$ a month.

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

Yup. They're all looking at the subscription model. It's only really come up because Tesla has done it already. The low range Tesla that was available on Canada when they could still get a subsidy was the same size battery just software locked out. The "self driving package" is already hardware equipped, just locked out. Then Tesla suggested they may offer subscribe packages for it and the other OEMs took note

I wonder if this will become the new norm in general. There's some upside to this type of pricing structure for both manufacturers and consumers. Manufacturers could streamline and simplify their assembly lines by reducing or eliminating the number of models they make for each vehicle. Consumers can select which features they want and perhaps be able to get things in combinations that are not currently available the way vehicle models are sold now.