2022 Freedumb Convoy(s) Thread

[Snuffleupagus]

Originally Posted by WhiteTiger

[Just a guy]

The fact that Man desires, fortune, fame and power and has used religion to obtain these is more an indictment of these people, rather than religion itself.

Much is made about no proof of God. I can’t observe something, then it can’t be real. Science, don’t you know.

We believe in electricity but cannot observe an electron. We can predict it, but not observe it. Is electricity a hoax? No

We believe in gravity, but cannot observe the gravitational pull mechanism. Does gravity exist? Yes

It is a rule of physics that matter cannot be created nor destroyed. Yet everything came from something. The Big Bang does not answer this. The matter from the explosion had to come from somewhere or this basic rule of physics is incorrect. If someone can explain this, I have not heard a reasonable explanation yet.

What about time? When did time start? Be interested to hear how time just came to be.

There are many things in science that are believed because of predictability, not through observation.

I believe that both can coexist. Even Einstein deeply believed in God.

I personally spent a lot of my life as an agnostic, but that is the easy path. Not in one camp or the other. Once I opened my self to the existence of God and opened my mind to asking God to help guide me I have seen a remarkable change in my life. Now people will say that is psychological and not God. Not true! I cannot count the number of times that my prayers have been answered. Not just simple coincidences, but direct pleas that are answered.

I expect to be ridiculed and I am fine with that. I have faith in science and God.

I just ask that before responding negatively please answer the mysteries above

[oldschoolcalgary]

I don't want this to break down into an anti religion thread - one is entitled to believe what they want to believe...that said

one can't compare the 'predictability' of science to religion.

there's zero predictability in religion. none.

one can observe things like gravity. This is a fact.

i can drop a egg 1 trillion times, in it will fall to the ground and break. I can show that to you.

Show me one thing that can be repeated by any religion.

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by oldschoolcalgary

I don't want this to break down into an anti religion thread - one is entitled to believe what they want to believe...that said

one can't compare the 'predictability' of science to religion.

there's zero predictability in religion. none.

one can observe things like gravity. This is a fact.

i can drop a egg 1 trillion times, in it will fall to the ground and break. I can show that to you.

Show me one thing that can be repeated by any religion.

I already acknowledged that gravity exists even if we cannot see the mechanism. I notice you did not answer any of my mysteries of science. Predictable, but unobservable.

I will give you one predictable thing. If one chooses to be blind to something they will never see it.

By the way if you haven’t noticed this has become an anti religion thread. Hence my decision to posit an alternate stance.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

The fact that Man desires, fortune, fame and power and has used religion to obtain these is more an indictment of these people, rather than religion itself.

Much is made about no proof of God. I can’t observe something, then it can’t be real. Science, don’t you know.

We believe in electricity but cannot observe an electron. We can predict it, but not observe it. Is electricity a hoax? No

We believe in gravity, but cannot observe the gravitational pull mechanism. Does gravity exist? Yes

It is a rule of physics that matter cannot be created nor destroyed. Yet everything came from something. The Big Bang does not answer this. The matter from the explosion had to come from somewhere or this basic rule of physics is incorrect. If someone can explain this, I have not heard a reasonable explanation yet.

What about time? When did time start? Be interested to hear how time just came to be.

There are many things in science that are believed because of predictability, not through observation.

I believe that both can coexist. Even Einstein deeply believed in God.

I personally spent a lot of my life as an agnostic, but that is the easy path. Not in one camp or the other. Once I opened my self to the existence of God and opened my mind to asking God to help guide me I have seen a remarkable change in my life. Now people will say that is psychological and not God. Not true! I cannot count the number of times that my prayers have been answered. Not just simple coincidences, but direct pleas that are answered.

I expect to be ridiculed and I am fine with that. I have faith in science and God.

I just ask that before responding negatively please answer the mysteries above

This post makes a lot of sense considering your posting history

[Captain Otto]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

The fact that Man desires, fortune, fame and power and has used religion to obtain these is more an indictment of these people, rather than religion itself.



Much is made about no proof of God. I can’t observe something, then it can’t be real. Science, don’t you know.



We believe in electricity but cannot observe an electron. We can predict it, but not observe it. Is electricity a hoax? No



We believe in gravity, but cannot observe the gravitational pull mechanism. Does gravity exist? Yes



It is a rule of physics that matter cannot be created nor destroyed. Yet everything came from something. The Big Bang does not answer this. The matter from the explosion had to come from somewhere or this basic rule of physics is incorrect. If someone can explain this, I have not heard a reasonable explanation yet.



What about time? When did time start? Be interested to hear how time just came to be.



There are many things in science that are believed because of predictability, not through observation.



I believe that both can coexist. Even Einstein deeply believed in God.



I personally spent a lot of my life as an agnostic, but that is the easy path. Not in one camp or the other. Once I opened my self to the existence of God and opened my mind to asking God to help guide me I have seen a remarkable change in my life. Now people will say that is psychological and not God. Not true! I cannot count the number of times that my prayers have been answered. Not just simple coincidences, but direct pleas that are answered.



I expect to be ridiculed and I am fine with that. I have faith in science and God.



I just ask that before responding negatively please answer the mysteries above

I wish I would have known this before arguing with you about COVID and the vaccine. It all makes sense.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

[oldschoolcalgary]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

I already acknowledged that gravity exists even if we cannot see the mechanism. I notice you did not answer any of my mysteries of science. Predictable, but unobservable.

I will give you one predictable thing. If one chooses to be blind to something they will never see it.

By the way if you haven’t noticed this has become an anti religion thread. Hence my decision to posit an alternate stance.

I don't want to get too far down this rabbit hole; as you mention there has been some anti-religion posts, and some pro-religion posts already.

in terms of the question of 'unobservability', this is not exactly true. You can observe things like gravity through the effects of gravity and the predictability of gravity. Not only for something as simple as an egg cracking, but also charting space satellites and what they need to do to catapult around the orbit of something like Jupiter or Saturn.

literally every technological device we have is built on 'unobservable' phenomena that has been decoded and understood and replicated by science.

Things like an iphone, if sent back 200 years, would look like a 'miracle'.

Religion can be helpful for communities and individuals and can have a positive role and place in society.

but it is wholly based on belief. Science is the opposite of that - it not based on belief, but repeatable, empirical facts.

Our grasp of science is ever evolving - are there gaps? like quantum physics? Dark Matter? Absolutely there is... 100 years ago the atom was mere speculation, computers the stuff of fiction... there's going to be more mysteries to solve as mankind's knowledge of science continues to improve.

pointing to examples of where science breaks down, doesn't disapprove science or the scientific method. However, I can point to an airplane or a computer or an iphone to 'prove' science...

what can religion point to?

Not going to post anymore than that, as I don't expect that you'd be convinced by anything I say, and I wouldn't be convinced unless God himself appeared on earth and changed water into wine - though undoubtedly, someone would look to manipulate that a la "The Grand Inquisitor" to their own ends

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

The fact that Man desires, fortune, fame and power and has used religion to obtain these is more an indictment of these people, rather than religion itself.

Much is made about no proof of God. I can’t observe something, then it can’t be real. Science, don’t you know.

We believe in electricity but cannot observe an electron. We can predict it, but not observe it. Is electricity a hoax? No

We believe in gravity, but cannot observe the gravitational pull mechanism. Does gravity exist? Yes

It is a rule of physics that matter cannot be created nor destroyed. Yet everything came from something. The Big Bang does not answer this. The matter from the explosion had to come from somewhere or this basic rule of physics is incorrect. If someone can explain this, I have not heard a reasonable explanation yet.

What about time? When did time start? Be interested to hear how time just came to be.

There are many things in science that are believed because of predictability, not through observation.

I believe that both can coexist. Even Einstein deeply believed in God.

I personally spent a lot of my life as an agnostic, but that is the easy path. Not in one camp or the other. Once I opened my self to the existence of God and opened my mind to asking God to help guide me I have seen a remarkable change in my life. Now people will say that is psychological and not God. Not true! I cannot count the number of times that my prayers have been answered. Not just simple coincidences, but direct pleas that are answered.

I expect to be ridiculed and I am fine with that. I have faith in science and God.

I just ask that before responding negatively please answer the mysteries above

Are you able to provide the specifics of how god answered your prayers and why it couldn’t have possibly been a coincidence that you prayed for an outcome and it occurred? Basically you’re saying there was divine intervention at play here so the specifics should help prove your point to anyone who disagrees with you.

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by Cappy

This post makes a lot of sense considering your posting history

Originally Posted by Captain Otto

I wish I would have known this before arguing with you about COVID and the vaccine. It all makes sense.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

As predicted. No intelligent explanation, but personal attacks.

One must be insane because they believe in a greater being. Such hubris believing that man and/or this level of existence is all there is.

Because I am sceptical in a rushed medicine, does not make me anti vax. Everyone wants to brand anyone who questions it a heretic.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

The fact that Man desires, fortune, fame and power and has used religion to obtain these is more an indictment of these people, rather than religion itself.

Much is made about no proof of God. I can’t observe something, then it can’t be real. Science, don’t you know.

We believe in electricity but cannot observe an electron. We can predict it, but not observe it. Is electricity a hoax? No

We believe in gravity, but cannot observe the gravitational pull mechanism. Does gravity exist? Yes

It is a rule of physics that matter cannot be created nor destroyed. Yet everything came from something. The Big Bang does not answer this. The matter from the explosion had to come from somewhere or this basic rule of physics is incorrect. If someone can explain this, I have not heard a reasonable explanation yet.

What about time? When did time start? Be interested to hear how time just came to be.

There are many things in science that are believed because of predictability, not through observation.

I believe that both can coexist. Even Einstein deeply believed in God.

I personally spent a lot of my life as an agnostic, but that is the easy path. Not in one camp or the other. Once I opened my self to the existence of God and opened my mind to asking God to help guide me I have seen a remarkable change in my life. Now people will say that is psychological and not God. Not true! I cannot count the number of times that my prayers have been answered. Not just simple coincidences, but direct pleas that are answered.

I expect to be ridiculed and I am fine with that. I have faith in science and God.

I just ask that before responding negatively please answer the mysteries above

God and science are not mutually exclusive. Science simply tries to explain why things are the way they are. The scientific method is simply a process vetting theories about the nature of things.

Many things were seen as mysterious and miraculous in the past, and therefore evidence of God, but once explained by science they became just natural phenomenon. If there is a God then his 'mysterious ways' could be explained by science. Not now, maybe not with our current understanding of physics, maybe not in this dimension, maybe not given a billion years, but there is ultimately an explanation. Explaining how God answers your prayers, if you believe he does, shouldn't minimize the act.

The corollary to that, is that no 'miracle' should be used to 'prove' the existence of God. At best they might suggest the existence of something we don't understand yet.

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Are you able to provide the specifics of how god answered your prayers and why it couldn’t have possibly been a coincidence that you prayed for an outcome and it occurred? Basically you’re saying there was divine intervention at play here so the specifics should help prove your point to anyone who disagrees with you.

One coincidence is just that. I am talking about many. How many coincidences does it take before it become mathematically improbable to be anything else?

Reaching out for help and a friend from years ago calls at that moment. One coincidence. Brush it off. Prayer for someone who is having a very difficult time and then all the sudden it stops (multiple times). Starting to become more improbable that it is just coincidence. Prayer for someone’s mental wellbeing and then their mood suddenly changes (multiple times). Too many coincidences for me to brush off.

If one is not ready to accept/see things they never will. The old saying “There is no one so blind as those that will not see”.

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by edslunch

God and science are not mutually exclusive. Science simply tries to explain why things are the way they are. The scientific method is simply a process vetting theories about the nature of things.

Many things were seen as mysterious and miraculous in the past, and therefore evidence of God, but once explained by science they became just natural phenomenon. If there is a God then his 'mysterious ways' could be explained by science. Not now, maybe not with our current understanding of physics, maybe not in this dimension, maybe not given a billion years, but there is ultimately an explanation. Explaining how God answers your prayers, if you believe he does, shouldn't minimize the act.

The corollary to that, is that no 'miracle' should be used to 'prove' the existence of God. At best they might suggest the existence of something we don't understand yet.

100% agree. Did not say that it was proof. Did say that there are unobservable things that people, including myself, believe in.

[Captain Otto]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

As predicted. No intelligent explanation, but personal attacks.

One must be insane because they believe in a greater being. Such hubris believing that man and/or this level of existence is all there is.

Because I am sceptical in a rushed medicine, does not make me anti vax. Everyone wants to brand anyone who questions it a heretic.

Don't be so sensitive. It wasn't a personal attack.

I think it's safe to say that those with a religious base are significantly more represented in the ant-vaxx, not quick to vax or COVID skeptical movement.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by Captain Otto

Don't be so sensitive. It wasn't a personal attack.

I think it's safe to say that those with a religious base are significantly more represented in the ant-vaxx, not quick to vax or COVID skeptical movement.

Sent from my Pixel 6 Pro using Tapatalk

Okay, but to be clear my hesitancy is not religious based. It is caution based.

[chedder]

Well, you can see an electron.

https://phys.org/news/2008-02-electron.amp

And, I'd say believing in a god is the easy way out as it takes no critical thinking skills or logic. Just 'faith' or brainwashing since birth.

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by chedder

Well, you can see an electron.

https://phys.org/news/2008-02-electron.amp

And, I'd say believing in a god is the easy way out as it takes no critical thinking skills or logic. Just 'faith' or brainwashing since birth.

Okay, the one point that I expected to be the easiest to prove. Where does matter come from if it cannot be created nor destroy? When does time begin?

Critical enough for you?

How about the mathematical improbability of so many coincidences?

Saying a higher being/existence does not exist because you do not have the capability to see beyond what you have been taught is far less critical in my mind.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

If one is not ready to accept/see things they never will. The old saying “There is no one so blind as those that will not see”.

I can agree with you on that.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

Okay, the one point that I expected to be the easiest to prove. Where does matter come from if it cannot be created nor destroy? When does time begin?

Critical enough for you?

How about the mathematical improbability of so many coincidences?

Saying a higher being/existence does not exist because you do not have the capability to see beyond what you have been taught is far less critical in my mind.

If everything has to start somewhere or come from something then what created god or where did they come from?

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

One coincidence is just that. I am talking about many. How many coincidences does it take before it become mathematically improbable to be anything else?

Reaching out for help and a friend from years ago calls at that moment. One coincidence. Brush it off. Prayer for someone who is having a very difficult time and then all the sudden it stops (multiple times). Starting to become more improbable that it is just coincidence. Prayer for someone’s mental wellbeing and then their mood suddenly changes (multiple times). Too many coincidences for me to brush off.

If one is not ready to accept/see things they never will. The old saying “There is no one so blind as those that will not see”.

It's interesting that all of your examples are all interactions between people. I'm much more open to there being an unseen level of interconnectedness between people that could accessed via prayer, meditation, or whatever one calls it than divine intervention in physical events.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Just a guy

One coincidence is just that. I am talking about many. How many coincidences does it take before it become mathematically improbable to be anything else?

Reaching out for help and a friend from years ago calls at that moment. One coincidence. Brush it off. Prayer for someone who is having a very difficult time and then all the sudden it stops (multiple times). Starting to become more improbable that it is just coincidence. Prayer for someone’s mental wellbeing and then their mood suddenly changes (multiple times). Too many coincidences for me to brush off.

If one is not ready to accept/see things they never will. The old saying “There is no one so blind as those that will not see”.

Can you use your prayer super power to see if Putin can be capped