Russia invades Ukraine

[Manhattanboy]

Is there a rally in Calgary today?

[burn_this_city]

Originally Posted by Pointman

It did some years ago, but it was cancelled due to low demand

Russian aircraft still transit Canadian airspace to places in the US. The polar routes between North America and Northern Europe are shorter than the alternatives.

[Mathgod]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

So at what point do the nations of the world wean themselves off the Russia/China teat?

That way when the despicable leadership of these two countries inevitably pull #### like this, we don't have conflicts of interest slowing down what should be a much quicker and more decisive response.

Really is time to get serious about this. The west needs to isolate Russia & China as much as possible, and the way to do that is to phase out its dependence on importing goods from those countries. To me, it'll be the only real sign that the west is truly serious about condemning Putin for what he's doing to Ukraine, for what Xi is doing to the Uyghurs, and what autocratic countries do to their citizens in general.

[holden]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1497631916840951811

[cam_wmh]

Originally Posted by tony-soprano

https://twitter.com/user/status/1497654691336962048

That’s actually a brilliant tactic. Put the Ukraine into focus of each Russian home, constantly.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by Mathgod

Really is time to get serious about this. The west needs to isolate Russia & China as much as possible, and the way to do that is to phase out its dependence on importing goods from those countries. To me, it'll be the only real sign that the west is truly serious about condemning Putin for what it's doing to Ukraine, for what Xi is doing to the Uyghurs, and what autocratic countries do to their citizens in general.

I echo these comments too but countries like the USA really need to get their balance sheet and their debt levels under control. The level of debt that the US carries, and that China owns, is a terrible vulnerability.

People always confuse American military forces with power, and it's true, but the US has it's weaknesses on the financial front if China wanted to inflict financial damage, which in turn could lead to war.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

The only thing Putin respects is strength.

Rule one of nuclear weapons is you can’t actually use them (Japan aside).

Punch him in the nose, and send him home. He’s not going to start setting off nukes. Crazier men than he have had them and not used them.

Appeasement is going to cost more lives than it saves.

You are right. Except that is a giant gamble if you're wrong

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by curves2000

I echo these comments too but countries like the USA really need to get their balance sheet and their debt levels under control. The level of debt that the US carries, and that China owns, is a terrible vulnerability.

People always confuse American military forces with power, and it's true, but the US has it's weaknesses on the financial front if China wanted to inflict financial damage, which in turn could lead to war.

That goes both ways though. How many Chinese people are employed due to American companies or american/European customers?

[Pointman]

Originally Posted by burn_this_city

Russian aircraft still transit Canadian airspace to places in the US. The polar routes between North America and Northern Europe are shorter than the alternatives.

Correct. I remember Moscow-New York flight actually flies over Halifax and Newfoundland area.

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

His mindset is that there is no alternate, yes.

But that video is pretty clear evidence that his support from his oligarchs is slipping.

Lots of talk about appeasing Putin because he has the nuclear threat, and will use it. But he can't - while he may be crazy enough, his supporters, his powerbase, the oligarchs, will not allow it. These are some of the richest people in the world, and they keep him in power because they benefit from it. But if he goes off the deep end, they will take him out.

The Oligarchs owe Putin, not the other way around. He orders them around, not the other way around. These people got their money because Putin chose them and allowed them to enrich themselves. Sure they may flee or turn if they think their fortunes are at risk, but I wouldn't bet on it. They were chosen by him for their loyalty

[FlameyMcFlameFace]

Let’s just say war did happen. Don’t we have the infrastructure to shoot down nuclear war heads right out of the sky? I honestly don’t even believe Russia could sustain a nuclear fight with the west because one wouldn’t even touch our soil

Now I understand this could be an ignorant comment. But I’m sure we have these things in place

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Not sure if this has been posted.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1497650028806086656

[Hack&Lube]

Originally Posted by FlameyMcFlameFace

Let’s just say war did happen. Don’t we have the infrastructure to shoot down nuclear war heads right out of the sky? I honestly don’t even believe Russia could sustain a nuclear fight with the west because one wouldn’t even touch our soil

Now I understand this could be an ignorant comment. But I’m sure we have these things in place

I think you've been watching too many movies and science fiction. There are missile defense and early warning systems and failed programs such as the Star Wars program initiated by Reagan in the 80s but they were always more science fiction than fact and nothing is perfect.

If a single nuclear warhead gets through, you are talking about millions of deaths and an escalating global conflict of mutually assured destruction. There is no such thing as sustaining or winning a nuclear fight. A nuclear fight is simply global destruction for all with radiation and fallout lasting thousands of years.

[curves2000]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

The Oligarchs owe Putin, not the other way around. He orders them around, not the other way around. These people got their money because Putin chose them and allowed them to enrich themselves. Sure they may flee or turn if they think their fortunes are at risk, but I wouldn't bet on it. They were chosen by him for their loyalty

Very true but there becomes a point in time no matter what the situation is, that loyalty get's tested and relationships get pushed. If there is writing on the wall, than people will naturally worry about their own self interests.

Look at family feuds and the destruction that happens over nothing. If the situation demands it and the end game becomes clearer, than I can see some distancing and pushback from the elite of Russia. It is in their best interest and that is a human component, not a political one.

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by FlameyMcFlameFace

Let’s just say war did happen. Don’t we have the infrastructure to shoot down nuclear war heads right out of the sky? I honestly don’t even believe Russia could sustain a nuclear fight with the west because one wouldn’t even touch our soil

Now I understand this could be an ignorant comment. But I’m sure we have these things in place

No we cant stop ICBM's, current anti missile technology is based on shooting down shorter range cruise and 'locally' fired missiles, its moderatly effective against homemade missiles fired from Gaza into Israel that are little more than massive slow (as missiles go) bottle rockets.

Even if they could the US dont have anti missile gear all over the US protecting everything like Israel has had to do

[tony-soprano]

Lot of videos on this telegram channels

https://t.me/verkhovnaradaukrainy

https://t.me/Tsaplienko

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

The Oligarchs owe Putin, not the other way around. He orders them around, not the other way around. These people got their money because Putin chose them and allowed them to enrich themselves. Sure they may flee or turn if they think their fortunes are at risk, but I wouldn't bet on it. They were chosen by him for their loyalty

Yeah, that was one of Putin's earliest moves to consolidate power: he demanded total loyalty from the oligarchs who emerged from the 90s or they would wind up dead or jailed. Khodorkovsky was the most prominent oligarch (and richest) and served as an example of where the real power in Russia lay.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

I really don’t think this is going to go the way Putin thought it would.

Understatement of the year and we're not even out of February yet.

2020: Well this sucks, next year HAS to be better than this!

2021: Welp. Nope. This is a whole new level of suck but 2022 HAS to be better!

2022: "Hold my vodka..."

[Street Pharmacist]

Originally Posted by curves2000

Very true but there becomes a point in time no matter what the situation is, that loyalty get's tested and relationships get pushed. If there is writing on the wall, than people will naturally worry about their own self interests.

Look at family feuds and the destruction that happens over nothing. If the situation demands it and the end game becomes clearer, than I can see some distancing and pushback from the elite of Russia. It is in their best interest and that is a human component, not a political one.

True, but that's far from anything I would rely on. Again, these people were personally chosen by Putin for their loyalty, and didn't come from money necessarily. They're also survivalists to the extreme. They far more likely to take what they have and leave than dig in and risk punishment by Putin by going against him.

We are used to to Plutocrats in the West who are powerful due to their wealth and the politicians get their orders from them. It's quit the opposite with Oligarchs in a kleptocracy. Their only power is due to the proximity and fealty to Putin. They came from little and received much by bowing to him and constantly proving their loyalty over and over. If Putin is gone, so is their wealth. They lose everything if Putin falls

[bob-loblaw]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1497567917294116869