Brad Treliving needs to go

[nik-]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I wonder if Islanders fans said the same about Lou when Tavares walked. What about Armstrong in St. Louis and Pietroangelo?

Going to be a long 4-5 months reading ‘Treliving should be fired immediately if Gaudreau walks’. I would imagine this gets posted at least ten times a day from here on out.

Who cares what fans of other teams said when something happened to their team? Why are some people so desperate to distract by pointing at other teams?

This team isn't good enough. This team might have a colossal error in asset management happen to them. This GM hasn't got the job done. This GM needs to go.

Stop deflecting to excuse his performance.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by dino7c

This was last month

Also, the Flames being 1-1 vs. the Sens this season isn't going to make or break their season

I’m not even that mad about the Sens loss, or the 2-7-1 record or the fact that we’re sitting outside of a playoff position right now.

What’s got me upset is that we’re this deep into the “rebuild” and we’re still a one line team. Management has had years, YEARS, to build a deeper team with legitimate depth. They knew this offseason that scoring depth would be the biggest team problem and they still didn’t address it. On top of it all, they’ve burned countless assets to the point that we couldn’t even outbid a recent expansion franchise for Jack Eichel.

I posted this little nugget the other day that the Flames have relied on the top line for all 17 of the team’s wins this season. All 17 wins. So literally, if something happened to one member of the top line or if they happen to be held off the scoresheet that night then = instant loss. Us Flames fans have seen this song and dance before.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by nik-

Who cares what fans of other teams said when something happened to their team? Why are some people so desperate to distract by pointing at other teams?

This team isn't good enough. This team might have a colossal error in asset management happen to them. This GM hasn't got the job done. This GM needs to go.

Stop deflecting to excuse his performance.

Yeah, yeah, I got it. The sky is falling. As you were…

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Yeah, yeah, I got it. The sky is falling. As you were…

The sky is not falling. It already fell.

What people are frustrated with, and why they (we) have such a short amount of patience with the team is because the management team didn't do anything about it. They did nothing to improve the roster over the off-season. All we heard is that they couldn't "sell players for 50 cents on the dollar"...well, those players who were worth 50 cents on the dollar, are now worth 10 cents - and the best player on the team has no contract to remain here beyond this season.

This team has no direction. There's no vision for success today or tomorrow. I'm also frustrated because the team is 4-4-4 on home ice without any vision for the future - so I'm twice as likely to watch a loss as I am a win on home ice. So they're not selling me hope for the future, they aren't selling me success today, and they aren't communicating at all with season ticket holders.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I wonder if Islanders fans said the same about Lou when Tavares walked. What about Armstrong in St. Louis and Pietroangelo?

Going to be a long 4-5 months reading ‘Treliving should be fired immediately if Gaudreau walks’. I would imagine this gets posted at least ten times a day from here on out.

Difference is Lou had a #1 center (Barzal) ready to take Tavares’ position in the lineup and St Louis had a Stanley Cup calibre team that could absorb the loss of a Pietrangelo.

I don’t think the Flames can say the same with the loss of Gaudreau. He essentially is the team right now. Here’s another little nugget I posted the other day that might be relative to the conversation.


Gaudreau’s splits in the team’s wins vs losses this season (updated numbers):
Wins: 17gms, 12g, 15a, 27p, +25
Losses: 17gms, 3g, 9a, 12p, -7


So basically, if him and his line have a great game, the Flames win. If his line has a mediocre night, the Flames lose.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I wonder if Islanders fans said the same about Lou when Tavares walked. What about Armstrong in St. Louis and Pietroangelo?

Going to be a long 4-5 months reading ‘Treliving should be fired immediately if Gaudreau walks’. I would imagine this gets posted at least ten times a day from here on out.

When there is uncertainty in any situation people will sometimes overact and come up with the worst-case serranos. It is hard when you don't know "an" outcome of a situation; Even (..as I recall), Johnny said his first negotiation was really hard having to wait so long to get it negotiated. Even he had a hard time waiting for it to get done. A topic was put up about Gaudreau's potential signing after last season, but fans had all summer to post on the discussion board but nothing happened so you can see how that creates more, debates, "many unreasonable" and doubts. Especially for the fans who started the season feeling excited seeing how well Johnny, MT the team was playing.

Brad doesn't always say much about negotiations but will comment on other aspects of the team. One thing that is different with Brad's approach from maybe Darryl is Darryl sometimes gives you an answer; Like his comments about the call ups needing to be stronger and more developed. My first thought was Maybe this is something that would have helped Sam Bennett. They could have used him in all situations on the farm and then brought him up when he was physically ready. My point though is Darryl's response about call-ups made sense to the media and to the fans so they were not making assumptions about things and feeling left in the dark.

If Johnny wants to stay and has said as much, isn't that is exactly the kind of thing you would tell the media? If Flames come out and said, "we want him here and we are continuing to negotiate", wouldn't this help reduce a lot of unwanted uncertainty?

[dammage79]

End of the day, they aren't put of anything and they're in a playoff spot.

But you cannot blindly discredit fans who are thinking that this looks like a very familiar song and dance to the previous 4 years. Even with a lot of the season remaining.

And who knows how they'll hold up under a crushing schedule to finish the season. They'll have a ton of home ice to potentially relieve some of that with no travel time but their bread and butter has come from spanking the east this year too. On the road.

I've like what I've seen a lot this year but I've also seen some familiar red flags recently as well.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

The sky is not falling. It already fell.

What people are frustrated with, and why they (we) have such a short amount of patience with the team is because the management team didn't do anything about it. They did nothing to improve the roster over the off-season. All we heard is that they couldn't "sell players for 50 cents on the dollar"...well, those players who were worth 50 cents on the dollar, are now worth 10 cents - and the best player on the team has no contract to remain here beyond this season.

This team has no direction. There's no vision for success today or tomorrow. I'm also frustrated because the team is 4-4-4 on home ice without any vision for the future - so I'm twice as likely to watch a loss as I am a win on home ice. So they're not selling me hope for the future, they aren't selling me success today, and they aren't communicating at all with season ticket holders.

I find this extremely hard to believe. Can you unpack this for me? How do you know there is no plan? What evidence, other than your speculation, is there that there is no plan? Does Treliving walk into the board room and basically say ‘what are we doing? Does anyone know?’. What does Edwards say to that?

You could argue the plan isn’t working but to suggest there is no plan is pretty unsubstantiated.

[flamesforcup]

I used to be a huge Treliving fan but this season destroyed my trust in him. Signing Coleman to that horrendous contract just when we were close to getting rid of the Lucic contract is unforgivable and means we probably lose one of the top 3 wingers this off season. Then after 6 years still not fixing the centre position. Not giving up Tkachuk when you have a game breaker like Eichal available just cause we we were on a little hot streak at the time should be firable.

Everytime we are close to getting rid of a bad contract it seems like he signs someone new. From Brouwer to Neal to now Coleman. I like Coleman but this contracts gonna age horribly.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by DazzlinDino

Why do you still sound like an oiler fan?

You don’t know me. Discuss the Flames not me my son

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

You don’t know me. Discuss the Flames not me, my son

Fixed it for you. You have a long way to go before you start condescending, especially to dd.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

You don’t know me. Discuss the Flames not me my son

I am just trying to understand the nature of your posts which at times include a lot of negative messages. When I sit back and read them, I find it hard to picture you as a Flames fan. You seem quick to put the Flames in a negative light and when someone adds meaningful dialog you seem to ignore it by adding more of the same messages. Seeing you describe the Flames as they, and their in another post just confirms my thoughts. If you are just antagonizing conversations for the fun of it, it doesn't really add to the quality of discussion. We do have lots of fans from other teams that visit but tend to be a bit more respectful in that regard. I like to hear what other fans have to say, lots of good insights and points too; But to just be overly negative can get tiresome for some and I am sure having a fake profile would be.. well, fake?

[TheSquatch]

I think being a fan only means you hope the team does well. It doesn't mean you can't talk about the warts, or in the case of the Flames, the chronic mediocrity that the organization seems to be okay with.

GM Darryl Sutter hurt this team bad, traded a lot of picks for "right now" stuff, in the belief (an incorrect belief) that the team was a piece or two away from a Cup. The team was in fact, 1 Miikka Kiprusoff injury away from going 0-82.

GM Darryl Sutter left the cabinets bare. This was a time when Flames had prospects like Kyle Greentree - big lumbering farm kids, just as the NHL was moving in a direction of speed and skill.

Enter Feaster. And I remember the relief - here's a guy who understands that the team isn't good, needs to rebuild, and is going to get out from the weird contracts and prospectless farm system that Sutter left him. But lo - no, the first press conference he has, he states that the mandate from management is "make the playoffs". So, nothing changes, REALLY. Maybe Feaster had a better eye for talent or listened to the scouts more, but he didn't, for the most part, draft terribly (Save the Jankowski pick). But the team goes nowhere, and Feaster bungles the Iginla trade, bungles (nearly fatally) a deal that would have seen the Flames give up prospects for a player who would have had to clear waivers to join the team... a few other things, real big "whoops" moments. But the team isn't way better.

Enter Treliving, and... it's more of the same. Johnny and Monny will lead us to the promised land. But goaltending never sticks, the rest of the forwards are a motley crew of castoffs and journeymen. Drafting has been good, but the draft position mostly has been not so good, so the Flames are lucky to have guys like Mangiapane maybe outperforming draft expectation. But mostly it's gonne be guys like Dube that the team is able to draft. The trade for Hanifin and Lindholm had to happen - the Flames needed pieces on offense and D... think of where this team would be without Lindholm right now. Dead in the water.

Which might actually be good. They might actually have to rebuild for real, not in the half-assed "oh the fans are coming back, yay!" way they have done.

I think the fan negativity is the result of watching 20 years of pretty boring hockey, having so little success, and seeing so little change. "We're just a piece or two away."

Nope. And that's disheartening.

[TheSquatch]

Cast another way, trusting Brad Treliving's "The Process"(tm) has left us with a team that has one dangerous line, a tenous defensive presence, and relies on stellar goaltending and zero mistakes to win.

Which.... isn't too likely, actually, any given night, for ANY team.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Difference is Lou had a #1 center (Barzal) ready to take Tavares’ position in the lineup and St Louis had a Stanley Cup calibre team that could absorb the loss of a Pietrangelo.

I don’t think the Flames can say the same with the loss of Gaudreau. He essentially is the team right now. Here’s another little nugget I posted the other day that might be relative to the conversation.


Gaudreau’s splits in the team’s wins vs losses this season (updated numbers):
Wins: 17gms, 12g, 15a, 27p, +25
Losses: 17gms, 3g, 9a, 12p, -7


So basically, if him and his line have a great game, the Flames win. If his line has a mediocre night, the Flames lose.

Sure. If he left it would be a massive loss, no argument here.

That said, the outright loss of Tavares and Pietroangelo undoubtedly was heavily criticized in those two markets. Let’s not pretend they weren’t. You point to Barzal being able to absorb that loss because Barzal was waiting in the wings. Doesn’t change the fact the lost Tavares, who is also a 1C.

On the other hand if the Flames were to lose a player at a specific position, LW would be it. I’ll be a bit surprised if all of Gaudreau, Tkachuk, Mangiapane, Dube, Pelletier, Zary are back with the team/organization next year. I’m not convinced all of them are here once this TDL passes.

[blender]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

I don’t know, I think there is a difference when you sit 1st and lose a game because you take a night off versus struggling for 10 games trying to hold on to a playoff spot.

But fans moaning is the exact same thing.
I don't mind when someone makes a valid point (and there are many; I'm very disappointed with Treliving’s work during the Johnny Hockey era), but constantly banging on about is boring.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

I’m not even that mad about the Sens loss, or the 2-7-1 record or the fact that we’re sitting outside of a playoff position right now.

What’s got me upset is that we’re this deep into the “rebuild” and we’re still a one line team. Management has had years, YEARS, to build a deeper team with legitimate depth. They knew this offseason that scoring depth would be the biggest team problem and they still didn’t address it. On top of it all, they’ve burned countless assets to the point that we couldn’t even outbid a recent expansion franchise for Jack Eichel.

I posted this little nugget the other day that the Flames have relied on the top line for all 17 of the team’s wins this season. All 17 wins. So literally, if something happened to one member of the top line or if they happen to be held off the scoresheet that night then = instant loss. Us Flames fans have seen this song and dance before.

They are out of a playoff spot because of games played...2nd by winning %

It's fair to be concerned with recent results but they are only not in a playoff spot because of games played. Points % is the real standings...unless you assume they are losing all 3-6 games in hand

[1qqaaz]

Maybe the Flames would have been better off if they acquired Buchnevich or Reinhart this past summer rather than signing Coleman.

[bubbsy]

Coleman has looked exactly what he's been known for, a good 3rd liner. Only problem is giving him 2nd line $$$ and expecting 2nd line role production, at the latter phase of his prime.

[BoLevi]

Do people really believe that Treliving is one of the best 32 people to do the job on the planet?