Brad Treliving needs to go

[Locke]

Always a Bridesmaid....

[dino7c]

Vegas has $78.74M committed to 11 players next season
81.5M cap

you can compare rosters player to player but Vegas isn't icing that team

[Muta]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Lindholm has 8 pts in 15 playoff games ... Eichel has none in none.

Point per game player, what a talent!

[Toonage]

Vegas will do what Vegas does best these days. Unceremoniously dump loyal players with little to no warning.

[1qqaaz]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

I think people are focusing in on the wrong mistake made by Trelieiving. I firmly believe Tkachuk was on the table, and any comments to the contrary are damage control.

The reason Tkachuk isn't valuable is because of the stupid 3 year contract he is under which has a $9mil qualifying offer. If he was signed to a better second contract with term the Flames could get something for him.

That terrible contract is what should get Treleiving fired.

Yeah, this is where I draw the line for Treliving.
Tkachuk should be the most valuable asset in the organization, but he isn't. Lindholm is.

And it's all because of the fact that Tkachuk can be UFA by 25.

The priority should be signing the young guys to long term deals, then use remaining cap space to fill out depth here and there.

Treliving seems to prefer spending picks/cap space on small holes, then signing young guys to short deals.
I don't agree with that kind of cap and asset management.

[dino7c]

He can save it by signing Tkachuk to a long term $50 more than his bro got

or trade him for a massive haul

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

Oilers have a top line better than any of the teams listed.

And yet they can't get out of the first round.

It's not only about top line talent. It's about the team as a whole.

It's about both top talent and depth.
Oilers have the top end, we have the depth. Vegas likely has both now.
Flames with Eichel would have had both.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

It's about both top talent and depth.
Oilers have the top end, we have the depth. Vegas likely has both now.
Flames with Eichel would have had both.

no they don't

$78.74M 11 players

They will be the Leafs if lucky

[McG]

Originally Posted by gvitaly

Is Vladar a rental? he seems like a great find for a 3rd round pick. Zadorov and Pitlick might not have been worth the picks(yet), but we get to try how they fit, and convince them to stay if its a good fit.

Zadorov even though he's been terrible this year showed a lot of promise in his previous seasons... I was personally hoping he could take a step in his game. The gamble didn't pay off so you move on. Pitlick seems like a good fit on a line with Backlund, and I wouldn't be surprised if he signs a reasonable extension, in this case that is more than worth a 4th round pick.

As for being on the cusp of losing players for nothing. You realize that those players could only sign with the team from the end of July. That's only a bit over 3 months, and these deals take time. In addition, I'm pretty sure the management wanted to evaluate which players perform the best under Daryl. Most likely the Flames will keep 2 of Tkachuk, Gaudreau, and Mangiapane. One of them will be traded for assets.

I’m sorry but I just have to bite on this obvious fishing attempt. Is this Brad or his dad?

Are the only burned 3rds and 4ths only this off season or is it over the entire body of work? Rentals are commonly understood to be at the trade deadline. Not one of the players that you cited was a deadline rental acquisition. I ‘d further argue that trading for UFA negotiation rights is another level of crazy.

Remember these trades? Forbort, Gustafson, fantenburg?

Contracts. Man oh man. Look, I don’t know if you have ever negotiated before but if you think that parties on both sides don’t talk to each other or are aware before the official sign by date then I don’t know what to say. I completely agree that players cannot sign officially before the date. Please explain how other teams are able to get signings done on the very first day? Ever written a post dated cheque? Exactly. But not the Flames.

Also, why would the Flames need to see how a player plays under a coach for even a season when multi year contracts long outlive any coach? If they play great, they drive up the price? If they play poorly, we hope that past glories get higher trade value? Of course, Treliving doesn’t trade expiring assets so moot point I guess.

Actually, here is a good trade by Brad. Rittich for a leafs 3rd. Expiring asset that we didn’t intend to re-sign. Want a bad one? TJ Brodie for nothing.

This is what I mean though; debating trade x or y, signing x or y, coach x or y, this season or last, it’s the entire body of work. Poor asset management and decisions that guide long term decisions like the lifespan of managers, not whether or not we got robbed by a referee or had a hot start to the season.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by dino7c

no they don't

$78.74M 11 players

They will be the Leafs if lucky

If we have learned anything about Vegas over the years they seem to be able to move whoever to make a deal work.

Schmidt was cast off to get Pietrangelo, Tatar to get Patches, Fleury was moved when they could not afford him and Lehner.

They will trade and dump whoever to get whoever they want.

I remember how amazing it was they put Brannstrom in the deal to get Stone where they didn’t even have include a first. Ottawa has Brannstrom on the block. Won’t be surprised if Krebs is equally as disappointing and not be more than an average piece while Vegas has an elite player.

[mrdonkey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

no they don't

$78.74M 11 players

They will be the Leafs if lucky

Having too much star talent on your roster is a good problem to have.

Paying Monahan, Lucic, Pitlick, Zadorov, and Gudbranson a combined $20 million to fill out the bottom end of your roster (and giving up picks for the privilege of doing so) is not.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Vegas will do what Vegas does best these days. Unceremoniously dump loyal players with little to no warning.

Which is a smart thing to do in the pro sports business.
loyalty is for suckers.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

If we have learned anything about Vegas over the years they seem to be able to move whoever to make a deal work.

Schmidt was cast off to get Pietrangelo, Tatar to get Patches, Fleury was moved when they could not afford him and Lehner.

They will trade and dump whoever to get whoever they want.

I remember how amazing it was they put Brannstrom in the deal to get Stone where they didn’t even have include a first. Ottawa has Brannstrom on the block. Won’t be surprised if Krebs is equally as disappointing and not be more than an average piece while Vegas has an elite player.

Hows that working out?

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by mrdonkey

Having too much star talent on your roster is a good problem to have.

Paying Monahan, Lucic, Pitlick, Zadorov, and Gudbranson a combined $20 million to fill out the bottom end of your roster (and giving up picks for the privilege of doing so) is not.

All I said is they won't have depth and Eichel...they won't

They need to cut some stars to make this work. Lets see how their roster looks when Eichel is actually in the lineup. It won't be what people are penciling in right now.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

Which is a smart thing to do in the pro sports business.
loyalty is for suckers.

I think you're missing the point.

They treat their players like #### on the way out.

Loyalty is for suckers? Ok, but when one of the faces of your franchise finds out he's been moved for nothing, over twitter, you erode the trust of the players you have. Do you want a team or 23 independent contractors?

The misfit magic is gone in Vegas.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by McG

Also, why would the Flames need to see how a player plays under a coach for even a season when multi year contracts long outlive any coach? .

Sorry for cutting out other parts of your post but just wanted to comment on this insightful remark.

Darryl is signed for one more year after this. We have three key forwards due for new contracts at the end of this season. In assessing those players, how much weight will we put on their one season with Sutter? Thinking of Gaudreau specifically in this case, but Tkachuk too. Mangiapane just seems to be on an upward trajectory.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by dino7c

no they don't

$78.74M 11 players

They will be the Leafs if lucky

They were already an elite team with more playoff success than Toronto, added Eichel, and now will be lucky to be Toronto?

This is a next level bad take, even by your standards.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

They were already an elite team with more playoff success than Toronto, added Eichel, and now will be lucky to be Toronto?

This is a next level bad take, even by your standards.

Again you are acting like they are just adding Eichel to that team...they aren't

No MAF
No Tuch
No 2 or 3 other 5M players

Vegas will be a totally different team and that's just last years team that lost to the Habs in less games than the Leafs

Their cup finals team isn't even remotely the same team

the current Vegas roster people are trotting out has a 92M cap hit

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

If we have learned anything about Vegas over the years they seem to be able to move whoever to make a deal work.

Schmidt was cast off to get Pietrangelo, Tatar to get Patches, Fleury was moved when they could not afford him and Lehner.

They will trade and dump whoever to get whoever they want.

I remember how amazing it was they put Brannstrom in the deal to get Stone where they didn’t even have include a first. Ottawa has Brannstrom on the block. Won’t be surprised if Krebs is equally as disappointing and not be more than an average piece while Vegas has an elite player.

I think Vegas's overachieving has made almost all of their assets overvalued. The valuation of Krebs is inflated because Vegas has a reputation for just being awesome at everything, so if it was one of their prospects, it must be awesome.

No saying Krebs isn't a good prospect, but he is in a pretty large class that most teams have comparable prospects. All of them are less than sure things. But forget what the data says, he is surefire superstar.

[PepsiFree]

Yeah, anyone who thinks Vegas just "added Eichel" with no other changes required is absolutely nuts.

They need to sign 9 roster players this off season, and if they sign each of them at league minimum, that means moving $4M out in addition to losing Smith, Janmark, and McNabb. That also means that they need to move out or sign for minimum all of their RFAs, even ones that are already making more than minimum, or move out even more salary if any of them want a raise.

This is a completely different team next year.