2021/2022 English Premier League

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

How is he not on your ignore list? Perhaps you should look deep in your soul and wonder why you engage with a pedantic, not particularly interesting individual? Plus you keep quoting him.

Yeah, you tried the pretend I'm on your ignore list already stint so that you can continue to run from explaining your disgusting comment.

Originally Posted by VladtheImpaler

Things are looking up for the Hitlerites.

You actually think asking someone to explain why they would call a club with Jewish owners who lost family in the Holocaust Hitlerites is pedantic?

You never did explain this sick comment. But hey you can't because conveniently you can't see that you've been asked to.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Slava

Perfect, then just don't worry about me and what I think, and we're fine. I'm at least 99% sure that no one else in this thread cares to read you and going back and forth, so it's probably best that way.

No. I'll post wherever I want and respond to whoever within the rules of the forum.
If you're going to make claims with zero elaboration don't get upset when called on it.
Now are you going to tell us why you felt United's 28 game unbeaten run last year was all lucky bounces? I'm interested to hear you elaborate on that.

[SuperMatt18]

I've said Ole is terrible the entire time and that the win in spite of him.

Still think that whether they win or lose.

[devo22]

I'll say it again, Ole did a good job for the most part. This club was in absolute turmoil after Mourinho and he cleaned it up well. He got most of the squad decisions right, which ultimately is his downfall now: he could hide behind the weak squad in the past, but those excuses don't fly anymore. There's too much quality in the squad for that, and the next manager will benefit from it. The club's in much better shape than when Ole took over, and yeah, he does deserve credit for that.

So no hard feelings from me. Ultimately, he can't fulfill the heightened expectations and take the club to the next level. Finishing 3rd and 2nd was decent, but he's not a good enough manager for more. The club needs to accept that and move on, but I certainly take Ole's reign at United over his predecessors' and it's not particularly close.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by devo22

I'll say it again, Ole did a good job for the most part. This club was in absolute turmoil after Mourinho and he cleaned it up well. He got most of the squad decisions right, which ultimately is his downfall now: he could hide behind the weak squad in the past, but those excuses don't fly anymore. There's too much quality in the squad for that, and the next manager will benefit from it. The club's in much better shape than when Ole took over, and yeah, he does deserve credit for that.

So no hard feelings from me. Ultimately, he can't fulfill the heightened expectations and take the club to the next level. It is what it is.

I agree with this too.

He was the right guy to come in as a caretaker manager, him and Woodward made some smart purchases, and they set the team in the right direction again.

But in terms of actual on the pitch play I still don't see much strategy or structure from them beyond "We are going to out talent you on the pitch".

And I think in order to take the next step they need a better actual game manager.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I agree with this too.

He was the right guy to come in as a caretaker manager, him and Woodward made some smart purchases, and they set the team in the right direction again.

But in terms of actual on the pitch play I still don't see much strategy or structure from them beyond "We are going to out talent you on the pitch".

And I think in order to take the next step they need a better actual game manager.

Its funny, in the fallout from their epic Liverpudlian ass-kicking the stat that I keep hearing thrown around is that United are the team in the EPL who run the least.

Which, you know, isnt the first stat you want to post on the wall.

Which goes to your point. They have talent. But not much else.

[Locke]

Lol.

"We worked on the pitch...we worked on everything that needed to, uh, be worked on....on the pitch."

Inspiring stuff Ole. It sounds like you had the squad cutting grass and doing some landscaping.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I've said Ole is terrible the entire time and that the win in spite of him.

Still think that whether they win or lose.

Elaborate please.


They got trounced 6-1 by The Spurs last year and that was his fault? Absolutely. No argument there.

They then turned around and absolutely schooled them later in the season and it was why? Lucky bounces? The players doing their own thing?
Another example of where they coasted against City who at that time were on a 13 game winning streak? That pure luck also?

Maybe you could have a go where Slava is failing miserably?


Why weren't you expressing this last year when they went over 70% of the season unbeaten?
Do you feel also that that streak was just lucky bounces and the players doing their own thing? That he deserves zero credit for that?

You feel that they subscribed to the Locke fantastic theory of coaching where they just went out and said ok, today we're just going to run like billy oh and that's it.

Look, I'm not making the argument that he's some sort of super manager, far from it.

But I'm curious why you feel that a squad with McFred, Lindelof and essentially no RW just got it done for 28 games despite of?

[SuperMatt18]

I did say it last year. I said it over the summer too. I’ve been consistent in my criticism of him.

Big part of the run last year was that Fernandes was on a heater, and Pogba returning to form - which is funny because you said they should sell him on the previous slide. The run last year doesn’t happen without Pogba.

I don’t see a team that has a plan or a strategy on the pitch. I see a team that hopes that their talent will be enough to win the game. I also don’t feel like they try to dictate the game and play very reactionary to their opponents.

Their success to me seems to be more dependent on the form of their top players. When their top players are on form, and can break a game open with a piece of individual magic, then United have success, but I don’t see a manager that can read the game or change the tactics to cover for when his team might be slightly off.

I also don’t think he’s done a great job of handling Van De Beek or Sancho.

I don’t get why you are so defensive of the guy. People are allowed to think he’s not a good manager without you seemingly being personally offended by the idea.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I did say it last year. I said it over the summer too. I’ve been consistent in my criticism of him.

Big part of the run last year was that Fernandes was on a heater, and Pogba returning to form - which is funny because you said they should sell him on the previous slide. The run last year doesn’t happen without Pogba.

I don’t see a team that has a plan or a strategy on the pitch. I see a team that hopes that their talent will be enough to win the game. I also don’t feel like they try to dictate the game and play very reactionary to their opponents.

Their success to me seems to be more dependent on the form of their top players. When their top players are on form, and can break a game open with a piece of individual magic, then United have success, but I don’t see a manager that can read the game or change the tactics to cover for when his team might be slightly off.

I also don’t think he’s done a great job of handling Van De Beek or Sancho.

I don’t get why you are so defensive of the guy. People are allowed to not think he’s a good manager without you seemingly being personally offended by the idea.

I've been consistent in wanting Pogba gone even when he was showing a glimmer of promise last year. Always have said that their priority last summer should be to get rid of him. The fact that he is still there speaks volumes about how the club has fallen and off field issues as well regarding what is acceptable behaviour. He's always been and remains a big part of the problem imo.

And of the 28 games that I mentioned he only played in 2/3 of them, and started about half one of which was the Sheff U loss. McFred was a bigger part of that run than him.

What team's success isn't dependent on the form of their top players?

Noone's getting offended. Simply calling out the sloppy posters that crawled into their holes last season. If there was some sort of argument made regarding the performances last season at the time then their claims that they always thought he was subpar might carry more merit. Instead the best that can be stated is lucky bounces, penalties ....

Sancho, I agree with. Donny, he's done absolutely nothing when given the chance to suggest that he deserves more.

But I will say this, because I said it before when The Spurs were finishing top 4 and they didn't listen as their heads were full of nonsense that this was the start of something big. Last years second place in my opinion flatters as for the most part of the season it was a very poor PL.

But regardless, he deserves credit for the wins.

[Senator Clay Davis]

With Man City all of a sudden in the toilet Ole's path to salvation is looking like it might happen again. Winning three in a row not looking nearly as tough as it did a week ago.

[nixon45]

What a crazy matchday it's been.

[SuperMatt18]

One thing I think all of us can agree on is that Pep is overrated

(and I say that when he’s winning games too)

[Locke]

Starting with literally the 'Old' Guard up top.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

One thing I think all of us can agree on is that Pep is overrated

(and I say that when he’s winning games too)

Why's that? Because he has good players?

Who do you rate?

[Locke]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

One thing I think all of us can agree on is that Pep is overrated

(and I say that when he’s winning games too)

Honestly, I go back and forth with Pep.

He has never really impressed me, kind of like the Messi/Ronaldo debate, Pep has never faced any adversity. He has always managed teams that were just an embarrassment of riches.

Yeah, he's not going to Barca now.

And his tactical prowess has never really seemed like anything great.

Then again, a huge element of being a top manager is managing players, which he seems to be really good at.

[devo22]

watching Ole vs. Nuno makes me question my life choices.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by devo22

watching Ole vs. Nuno makes me question my life choices.

Its like watching two Prizefighters throwing haymakers.

Except those fighters are 80 years old and its just kind of sad.

[Senator Clay Davis]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

One thing I think all of us can agree on is that Pep is overrated

(and I say that when he’s winning games too)

I think where he's overrated is as an in-game manager. When things aren't going well he's either too late to make changes, or unwilling to use a plan B/C/D. And of course the overthinking in big moments as well. But it's hard to argue that when plan A is working they aren't the most enjoyable team to watch in the world.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Why's that? Because he has good players?

Who do you rate?

He still a good manager. I just don’t think he deserves any of the “Best Manager Ever” hype that he gets .

When has he ever won anything without having clearly the best squad?

Barcelona? Nope. He pretty much was coaching the Spanish National team that won the 2008 and 2012 Euros and 2010 World Cup…but with Messi on top of that. That team was magnificent.

Bayern? Always the class of the league with or without pep as coach.

Man City? Nope, spends millions year after year to try to get that squad over the CL hump.

And really his CL record since leaving Barcelona is not great. Didn’t win it at Bayern. Hasn’t won it at City.

Think he deserved all the praise he got in his run at Barcelona, but think he’s been overrated since leaving there. Good manager but not at all worthy of the “Best Manager Ever” calls that he gets.

I just think if you give a guy like Simeone, Klopp, Conte, etc the squads that Pep has they would have just as much success as he’s had.