Arena Negotiation Discussion v2

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Cappy

The two (as of now) leading candidates to replace Nenshi both voted against the original Flames deal.

I thought Gondek voted in favour at the time (but was against this latest motion)? I recall her calling out Woolley for 'grandstanding' (he had the audacity to not want to rush the deal when there were still unresolved issues...which are now inevitably blowing up).


Davison was long rumoured to be a mayoral candidate, but thus far doesn't seem to be. I wonder if he knew the arena was likely going off the rail?

[Jimmy Stang]

If true, those are ludicrous demands and the Flames can shove it. They are completely out of touch with the public’s appetite for this kind of BS right now.

The city hasn’t even felt the brunt of the economic fallout from the pandemic. Civic election in fall. They’re about to discover that any remaining public support for subsidizing them has largely evaporated. A cynic would even suggest that they’ve got their relocation plans sorted out and just need to make it look like the city is to blame.

Ok. That’s a bit dramatic. But read the room, CSEC.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Cappy

Gondek

EDIT - i think she voted for it so im wrong

Thank goodness. I thought I somehow missed Farrell running for mayor and I had a chance to be driving 20 km/hr on every city road.

[getbak]

The only no votes for the deal were Chahal, Farrell, Farkas, and Woolley.

[jayswin]

nm

[FlamesAddiction]

Is anyone worried that another city might offer the owners a sweet deal to relocate the team? The arenas in Milwaukee, Salt Lake City, and Portland aren't getting any younger, the latter two were suggested as possible expansion locations a few years ago. They also all have NBA teams that would share part of the cost. Arenas typically have ~35 year lifespan. Those 3 will be around that by the time an arena is built if they started right now. Houston isn't that far behind.

If this arena doesn't get built, I think the Flames move if the owners can get a good deal somewhere else.

I'm personally not against using public money for things that are luxuries, as long as things that are necessary are also taken care of.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Is anyone worried that another city might offer the owners a sweet deal to relocate the team? The arenas in Milwaukee, Salt Lake City, and Portland aren't getting any younger, the latter two were suggested as possible expansion locations a few years ago. They also all have NBA teams that would share part of the cost. Arenas typically have ~35 year lifespan. Those 3 will be around that by the time an arena is built if they started right now. Houston isn't that far behind.

If this arena doesn't get built, I think the Flames move if the owners can get a good deal somewhere else.

I'm personally not against using public money for things that are luxuries, as long as things that are necessary are also taken care of.

If the people who run the team don't have enough loyalty to stay in the city over their own reneging on a deal then ####em

[jayswin]

Pull out, make it an election issue. That's the play here. With what I've learned about how our citizens think over the last year during Covid 19, good move by the Flames.

They can easily get enough of this population on board for more cooperate welfare after we already agreed to too much. Hell, just tell them ownership's net worth and that they'll make more millions in ticket increases is a HOAX!! and they'll have their second, better arena deal!

[jayswin]

Sorry, that wasn't particularly positive, but I've come to despise this city after 20 years of loving it to death and pumping it up more than anyone else that lives here, and that pains me.

[FurnaceFace]

Yep, if CP, their most rabid fanbase, is saying get bent then you’ve got problems. I think this past year has shown we can survive without going to hockey games which is along the path of not caring if there is a local team. Especially with the product. Think about it, if you didn’t have a local team, would it be more refreshing to watch say Colorado, Florida, or Carolina?

[GGG]

Who’s their candidate?

Godnek, Daivison?

And did they not learn their lesson last time.

[GordonBlue]

It's all part of a ploy by the flames to bring back CalgaryNEXT

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Torture

The Flames reportedly want
$70M more from the city.
More land
Control of traffic
Remove CMLC as project manager

Are you ####ing kidding me? Talk about negotiating in bad faith.
https://beta.ctvnews.ca/local/calgar...1_5387513.html

F that. City should walk.

[Cappy]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I thought Gondek voted in favour at the time (but was against this latest motion)? I recall her calling out Woolley for 'grandstanding' (he had the audacity to not want to rush the deal when there were still unresolved issues...which are now inevitably blowing up).


Davison was long rumoured to be a mayoral candidate, but thus far doesn't seem to be. I wonder if he knew the arena was likely going off the rail?

Yes sorry. I looked at the graphic quick and got them mixed up. I do not remember her being a huge arena booster though either

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

F that. City should walk.

Damn right! We’ll take our city to another team.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

It's all part of a ploy by the flames to bring back CalgaryNEXT

http://www.calgarynext.com/

https://twitter.com/calgarynext?lang=en

The website link is still dead.... no new tweets since 2017....phew

Might be an interesting time to do some domain squatting...

[Joborule]

Flames are not stupid, and know that if they were to reneged the deal, and ask for more money, that the blowback will be brutal in light of covid, the energy sector being #### even before the pandemic hurting the city, and overall less money to work with now. Plus, I don't think Bettman/NHL as a whole will be pleased with the Flames going back on a deal they made since it kills trust and commitment; just as it would with the city doing it.

Also it's just one side of the differences that were hearing right now. Who knows what the city may be asking for in return?

The project will still go ahead once they resolve the issues. It's in the best interest of both parties to do so. Think we can roll it back on the theatrics a bit. Although the whole intention of leaking that info was to invoke this exact response from the general public.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by Joborule

Flames are not stupid

How often do we say that and the flames prove us otherwise in the arena debacle?

Using their key charity event (the golf event) to make threats about the arena

Their top media guy going publicly on twitter when Nenshi gets reelected typing something like "the City is Screwed now". Again, not some low level employee, I think he was the director of media or something.

Creating a hastily made infographic full of falsehoods just to give the City more time to create a counter version

The list goes on....

[OldDutch]

This is hard negotiating from pros that is for sure. I have learned a thing or two about this best ones over the years. Basically their position is that once the arena is built and the lease terms in place they have no negotiation power for decades. So now is the time.

I get it as I have had to do that myself representing a company. In technology terms when a software is embedded the company has little leverage as moving to new software is near impossible. So you go hard as possible before you lose leverage.

If I was the city I wouldn’t blink and make it an election issue. If it is a good deal the owners will relent. However if they do have options the owners will exercise them. We all need to be prepared for that.

The more I watch this team the more I realize they are run as a profit entity. Its baked into almost all they do. Civic goodwill is there but if it makes sense on a whole.

Anyways, I am just saying the city needs to make their terms clear and be prepared for the worst. Caving is probably the worst option as it will show more is available to negotiate, and negotiate they will.

[kermitology]

Originally Posted by dino7c

lol this thread...city backing out on the deal was cool

oh wait the Flames are backing out...we had a deal god damn it!

This isn’t the city backing out, it’s the Flames demanding ludicrous things and trying to change the deal. And #### that noise.

You give on this and they’ll just keep taking. I’m looking forward to selling my house so I no longer have a vested interest in municipal affairs in Calgary.

This season’s performance is making this fall on some pretty deaf ears.