The Deal With Geoff Ward

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by nik-

Results. A top team isn't a sure first round out. Top teams aren't based on having a decent regular season. Average teams are.

Sutter not only has a winning record with multiple teams, he has two stanley cups, so i'm not sure what results mean in your world.

Some of these responses remind me of the internet meme of the dorky guy who says "6/10, would not bang" when looking at a supermodel.

D. Sutter is leaps and bounds better than anything we've seen behind the bench..since, D. Sutter. The Flames should be begging him to come save this sorry team.

[Azhouse]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Can't go back to Darryl as the GM but I would be open to him coaching the team. I can't imagine Treliving would welcome this as Darryl won't be afraid to question Treliving's process.

One cannot question the “process”...

[Ashasx]

I can't believe the bar is so low that people would be okay with Darryl coming back as GM.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Igottago

Sutter not only has a winning record with multiple teams, he has two stanley cups, so i'm not sure what results mean in your world.

Some of these responses remind me of the internet meme of the dorky guy who says "6/10, would not bang" when looking at a supermodel.

D. Sutter is leaps and bounds better than anything we've seen behind the bench..since, D. Sutter. The Flames should be begging him to come save this sorry team.

I addressed his cups. We don't have LA's roster. Sutter is a good coach, and yes he's absolutely better than what we have now or have had. No arguments there, but I'm not going to rewrite history and pretend that his era in Calgary was a success. We will be better if he became the coach, but not that much better. The roster is still just not good enough.

Like I said, if he were to come in and finish the season, fine. If he got them in and won a round, give him another year. Long term I don't think it's enough. The whole thing needs a complete rework.

[DeluxeMoustache]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I can't believe the bar is so low that people would be okay with Darryl coming back as GM.

Yeah, isn’t he the guy that relieved Darryl of his coaching duties?

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Yeah, isn’t he the guy that relieved Darryl of his coaching duties?

Yes, yes he was. And nice avatar change.

[ThePrince]

Originally Posted by nik-

I addressed his cups. We don't have LA's roster. Sutter is a good coach, and yes he's absolutely better than what we have now or have had. No arguments there, but I'm not going to rewrite history and pretend that his era in Calgary was a success. We will be better if he became the coach, but not that much better. The roster is still just not good enough.

Like I said, if he were to come in and finish the season, fine. If he got them in and won a round, give him another year. Long term I don't think it's enough. The whole thing needs a complete rework.

What does "long term" mean to you? The average NHL coach lasts 2.4 years, so I don't think it's fair to expect a Jon Cooper. I would be totally fine with Gerard Gallant's Vegas tenure, short but sweet. At this point, I think anyone would take even some short term success because we haven't even had that in the last several years.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by ThePrince

What does "long term" mean to you? The average NHL coach lasts 2.4 years, so I don't think it's fair to expect a Jon Cooper. I would be totally fine with Gerard Gallant's Vegas tenure, short but sweet. At this point, I think anyone would take even some short term success because we haven't even had that in the last several years.

I mean long term as in this is the guy we're betting on until it doesn't work. A normal coach hire, not an interim one. However long that is depends on what happens on the ice. If Sutter came as a defined interim coach I'd be ok with it. But the permanent head coach should be someone else and there should be a proper search process for it.

[Makarov]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I can't believe the bar is so low that people would be okay with Darryl coming back as GM.

There are people pining for the days of Glen Gulutzan. This is rock bottom/the darkest timeline/ the apocalypse. Its every fan for him or herself.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by nik-

I mean long term as in this is the guy we're betting on until it doesn't work. A normal coach hire, not an interim one. However long that is depends on what happens on the ice. If Sutter came as a defined interim coach I'd be ok with it. But the permanent head coach should be someone else and there should be a proper search process for it.

Interim coach is a bad message for this core. Frankly, I think they view a 2 year contract (one of which is a short year) at a salary which makes him expendable as an interim coach.

This was a bad year to be new coach of a team trying institute any kind of overhaul of the style. Their training camp was minimal, rookies were hard put to make the team, so you’d get imported vets ingrained in various other systems, etc. And I think this group is a difficult one. So I feel sorry for Ward in a way.

But for both him and the GM, results matter, and their bottom line is not good.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Interim coach is a bad message for this core. Frankly, I think they view a 2 year contract (one of which is a short year) at a salary which makes him expendable as an interim coach.

This was a bad year to be new coach of a team trying institute any kind of overhaul of the style. Their training camp was minimal, rookies were hard put to make the team, so you’d get imported vets ingrained in various other systems, etc. And I think this group is a difficult one. So I feel sorry for Ward in a way.

But for both him and the GM, results matter, and their bottom line is not good.

Well this core shouldn't be the core anymore regardless of the coach imo. See if there's a value bump playing under a new coach and ship them out and go in a new direction.

[868904]

I think Darryl is the right choice for this team but at this point, I'm fine with Boudreau or Gallant or hell even Babcock.

Just get an experienced head coach with a track record.

I don't care about the players feelings or coddling them anymore. They are being paid millions of dollars and it's time to produce results.

[Northendzone]

would it not be faitr to say that the sutter team worked much harder and were generally more difficult to play against.

i feel like this group is in a massive shame spiral and as soon as they get behind, they are done

to be honest i am not sure much can be done now this year. trading for guys is complicated by quarantining, so even if you make a "blockbuster" move, you are without top players for two weeks

i think it is time to part ways and tre and ward. may as well do that at the end of the season and then see who else is available; however, my gut tells me they would promote conroy and promote gelinas.

both which could work out or be terrible

[Roof-Daddy]

Darryl Sutter as GM? Hell no
Darryl Sutter as coach? Sure, why not?

The team is sinking fast, it's the easiest thing to change right now in hopes it jolts this team to life before it's too late. He also has a track record of success, and getting the most out of his teams, especially at crunch time.

Plus the fact that he's already here in Alberta would make it a quick and easy transition, at least compared to other options. Just bring him in as an interim to finish the season and go from there.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

would it not be faitr to say that the sutter team worked much harder and were generally more difficult to play against.

i feel like this group is in a massive shame spiral and as soon as they get behind, they are done

to be honest i am not sure much can be done now this year. trading for guys is complicated by quarantining, so even if you make a "blockbuster" move, you are without top players for two weeks

i think it is time to part ways and tre and ward. may as well do that at the end of the season and then see who else is available; however, my gut tells me they would promote conroy and promote gelinas.

both which could work out or be terrible

Sutter’s 2004 team worked hard. There were plenty of years under him where the Flames played under their talent level. Maher used to talk about them being “too easily satisfied”, meaning they’d have a good game to end a losing streak, and figure that would just roll over into future games. I’m pretty sure Maher was getting that phrase from Sutter.

[timbit]

Flames beat Ottawa 6-3.

11- 3 points , +4

13- 2 points, +2

19- 2 points , +2

23- 1 point, +1

28- 1 point, +1

Totals 9 points. +10

Ottawa beat Flames 5-1

SAME PLAYERS

Totals 1 point. -9

[868904]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Sutter’s 2004 team worked hard. There were plenty of years under him where the Flames played under their talent level. Maher used to talk about them being “too easily satisfied”, meaning they’d have a good game to end a losing streak, and figure that would just roll over into future games. I’m pretty sure Maher was getting that phrase from Sutter.

Again, Sutter only coached this team for 2.5 seasons. The "too easily satisfied" was after he stopped coaching.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by timbit

Flames beat Ottawa 6-3.

11- 3 points , +4

13- 2 points, +2

19- 2 points , +2

23- 1 point, +1

28- 1 point, +1

Totals 9 points. +10

Ottawa beat Flames 5-1

SAME PLAYERS

Totals 1 point. -9

And they played fast in the first game. Not at all in game two..

And they had a day off with no travel.

I honestly just don't get that second period last night. They just came out flat as a pancake, made all kinds of individual errors.

I've said it often, I'm fine with moving on from Geoff Ward if they can find an upgrade. But no coach instructs turnovers, not skating and refusing to engage in the game.

The team may have two problems. Coaching, and a complete lack of heart from key players.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by timbit

Flames beat Ottawa 6-3.

11- 3 points , +4

13- 2 points, +2

19- 2 points , +2

23- 1 point, +1

28- 1 point, +1

Totals 9 points. +10

Ottawa beat Flames 5-1

SAME PLAYERS

Totals 1 point. -9

A: “Yay we are on our old lines, let’s try hard”. “Look we got the first couple goals! We are a confident bunch who can make passes”.

B. “Well, these reinstated lines mean we don’t have to work hard, we will just win, right?” “Oh no they scored a couple. But hey Lucic got us back in. Oh wait, Dave screwed up, let’s fall apart”.

[Fischy13]

I wonder if it's at all likely there is a coaching change coming and they have begun the quarantine process. Once the 7 or 14 days is up, Tre pulls the trigger. Players don't give up on the coach that badly typically. There is something significantly wrong here and maybe some know that Ward is done, just not until the quarantine period is over. Maybe just wishful thinking, but something stinks bad and more than the typical for this situation.