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Old 01-12-2021, 08:57 AM   #5541
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Did I miss the memo where Pierre-Luc Dubois had ascended into elite player territory? He's a nice player but he's behind Sean Monahan's career pace at the same age.
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Old 01-12-2021, 08:57 AM   #5542
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I find Warrener in particular to be a huge knob. The way he speaks on the radio is aggravating af, i can just tell he believes his own voice is sexually arousing.

These values are malarkey. What center better than Monahan could CBJ reasonably expect to make this trade? I don't see any options around the league for a player who is trying to leave his team.

Lindy is untouchable IMO. If Hanifin+1st are attached, then the most I am willing to add is Zary.
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Old 01-12-2021, 08:59 AM   #5543
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There is a reason these guys work in radio, not hockey.
Can’t really blame them, they've been reading this thread seeing us throw around offers of Monahan and Dube, Monahan and a first etc.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:05 AM   #5544
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Can’t really blame them, they've been reading this thread seeing us throw around offers of Monahan and Dube, Monahan and a first etc.
I don't think anyone takes anything on CP seriously. Posting on fan forums is even less credible than working in radio when it comes to sports knowledge.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:10 AM   #5545
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I would love to get Dubois on this team. But, the Flames are not in rebuild mode. I don’t see the benefit of taking really good players off this roster to get a guy that doesn’t make us significantly better today. If we were rebuilding, then yes, definitely get a younger guy with potentially a higher upside.

To take Lindy and Hanifin out of the lineup today (plus futures) for one guy who isn’t going to be our number one center right now a feels like the wrong move at the wrong time.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:23 AM   #5546
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I thought Boomer and Rhett had it right. PLD isn't going to come cheap. There will likely be several serious bidders. Put yourself in Columbus' shoes. Most people here are more than prepared to move on from Monahan. Why would he be an appealing asset to CBJ? If I'm CBJ, sure, I will take him but I'm also taking Valamaki. I don't think Monahan would be the central piece coming back to CBJ. The Flames are going to have to sweeten the pot by a considerable margin if they want to include Monahan. If I'm CBJ and the Flames are not prepared to meet my price, I'm moving on. Some team out there will step up.

Lindholm + Hanafin + a 1st or Lindholm + Peltier + 1st is not far off the package CBJ would be looking for in my mind.
Both of those are huge overpayments.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:24 AM   #5547
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I don't think anyone takes anything on CP seriously. Posting on fan forums is even less credible than working in radio when it comes to sports knowledge.
Hahah I was joking
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:25 AM   #5548
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He hasn't taken that next step to where he is truly better than Monahan, so other than age and keeping your fingers crossed, we could easily be worse off.

I like Dubois as well, but I do not believe he is worth these packages either. I am still an advocate for a one for one, which CBJ would laugh at, so no deal in my mind to be had.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:30 AM   #5549
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I thought Boomer and Rhett had it right. PLD isn't going to come cheap. There will likely be several serious bidders. Put yourself in Columbus' shoes. Most people here are more than prepared to move on from Monahan. Why would he be an appealing asset to CBJ? If I'm CBJ, sure, I will take him but I'm also taking Valamaki. I don't think Monahan would be the central piece coming back to CBJ. The Flames are going to have to sweeten the pot by a considerable margin if they want to include Monahan. If I'm CBJ and the Flames are not prepared to meet my price, I'm moving on. Some team out there will step up.

Lindholm + Hanafin + a 1st or Lindholm + Peltier + 1st is not far off the package CBJ would be looking for in my mind.
Those are terrible takes. Brutal.

You have tried to put yourself in Columbus' shoes, but you have not tried to put yourself in Calgary's shoes (or those of any team making an offer).

No one is going to offer WAY more than he is worth, ruining their team in the process, just because #1 Cs are rare.

It takes 2 teams to make a deal, and the deal has to make sense for both teams. These proposals aren't remotely close to fair.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:36 AM   #5550
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Those are terrible takes. Brutal.

You have tried to put yourself in Columbus' shoes, but you have not tried to put yourself in Calgary's shoes (or those of any team making an offer).

No one is going to offer WAY more than he is worth, ruining their team in the process, just because #1 Cs are rare.

It takes 2 teams to make a deal, and the deal has to make sense for both teams. These proposals aren't remotely close to fair.
well then, what would be a comparable deal? off the top of my head, the Johansen - Jones deal seems close. Obviously CBJ came out on the winning end of that deal, but that doesn't mean the team acquiring PLD couldn't come out on top or break even.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:42 AM   #5551
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well then, what would be a comparable deal? off the top of my head, the Johansen - Jones deal seems close. Obviously CBJ came out on the winning end of that deal, but that doesn't mean the team acquiring PLD couldn't come out on top or break even.
Why does there need to be a comparable deal? Players are individuals.

Columbus hosed Nashville on that deal. So what? Does that mean we have to massively overpay for PLD?

Did San Jose have to massively overpay for Thornton? (which I think is a comparable deal, if you need one)
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:44 AM   #5552
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Monahan plus a 1st or Zary is the limit I would go. Valimaki and Lindholm are non starters in a deal imo, they are going nowhere. I think trading Hanifin would also be a mistake and I don't see the Jackets needing a D man anyhow.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:44 AM   #5553
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Seguin is another comparable.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:45 AM   #5554
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Default PLD for Monahan

Am I the only one that thinks this conversation is Ludicrous?

It is a crapshoot on if PLD will be as good as Monahan, and Calgary is adding 1sts, etc? I could see that package going for a Couturier, but what has PLD proven that warrants even a 1 for 1 with Monahan let alone the +,+?
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:47 AM   #5555
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Hahah I was joking
For sure. Ironically though, it is interesting that amongst the emotional overreactions there is a lot of good, considered analysis here. And even the most irrational of us know the team really well.

I was reading season previews and predictions on the Athletic the last few days and it is painfully obvious that the writers AND the agents, scouts and executives they poll are shamefully ignorant of any details about the Flames (and undoubtedly many other teams). I don't even care that they don't rate them highly, but at least they should try and make it look like they have a clue.

It is actually disappointing compared to NFL coverage where there seems to be a much higher national profile of all teams.
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Old 01-12-2021, 09:58 AM   #5556
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Why does there need to be a comparable deal? Players are individuals.

Columbus hosed Nashville on that deal. So what? Does that mean we have to massively overpay for PLD?

Did San Jose have to massively overpay for Thornton? (which I think is a comparable deal, if you need one)
Thornton is a pretty poor comparable. Just because Mike O'Connell made one of the worst deals in modern hockey history 15 years ago shouldn't be indicative of what Jarmo Kekalinen will do. Frankly, I would put zero stock on that deal. It was a one off deal that landed the GM of the Bruins on the outside of the GM's circle permanently. GM's around the league tend to take note of that sort of thing.

Same goes with Seguin. Bottom line, Kekalinen is far too shrewd a GM to mishandle this.

as for 'massively overpay' what does that mean? I think you are pretending to know what the market is on the player, but you don't. Friedman said yesterday that already GM's are making serious offers. There doesn't sound like there is much beating around the bush here. This is a prime asset set to hit the market, if he hasn't already. Again, the price will be steep.

I'm not necessarily of the mind that the Flames should do the trades the morning guys were suggesting, but I don't think they are far off the asking price.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:00 AM   #5557
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Someone needs to remind Boomer that Dubois is a malcontent who asked for a trade. CBJ are not in the position that an offer needs to blow them away. The offer doesn't need to be too good to refuse.

If they were on a more northern no good radio, I would begin to suspect that something was in the works. That they were trying to alter expectations, so it appears a good deal when the actual trade isn't as damning as the proposals.
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:18 AM   #5558
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are there any other 22 year old No. 1 C's available? when was the last?
Ryan Johansen ?
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:19 AM   #5559
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Someone needs to remind Boomer that Dubois is a malcontent who asked for a trade. CBJ are not in the position that an offer needs to blow them away. The offer doesn't need to be too good to refuse.

If they were on a more northern no good radio, I would begin to suspect that something was in the works. That they were trying to alter expectations, so it appears a good deal when the actual trade isn't as damning as the proposals.


CBJ is absolutely in the drivers seat. there will be multiple teams bidding on him, it will not be a race to the bottom. If PLD wants out the message from CBJ to the other GM's is 'here is a prime 22 year old center of which there is only one on the market. Present your best offers.'
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Old 01-12-2021, 10:21 AM   #5560
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They are basing Dubois on one playoff performance. I mean, if that's the criteria, why aren't we trading Bennett straight up for Dubois.

And remind me again how many more points did Dubois get vs. Monahan last playoffs? He must have at least tripled Monahan in production right?

It's just redonk some of the opinions the morning guys have on trade value.
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