DC Capitol Riot & Subsequent Fallout Thread (Jan 2021)

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by btimbit

Not sure what the first two have to do with the last two, but okay

Back in the 70's when I was growing up minorities, women and gays pretty much knew their place, they didnt complain about racists or sexist or homophobic jokes on TV at 7 o'clock at night and if any of them did start to get a little uppity while Enoch Powell or Maggie Thatcher might decry violence you knew there was always the National Front or some extreme group of young thugs who would go crack some skulls while proclaiming their patriotism

sorry if this is UK specific but I wasnt in Canada in those days

[RoadGame]

Related to schisms in the conservative psyche, noted conservative party advisor Ken Boessenkoel penned this today: https://theline.substack.com/p/ken-b...u6H1ydsVjMvbgo

[Sliver]

Oh yeah, another kind of big thing is the right wingers believe the pandemic is a hoax and masks don't work.

Like, how can you think they aren't detached from reality?

[btimbit]

Originally Posted by afc wimbledon

Back in the 70's when I was growing up minorities, women and gays pretty much knew their place, they didnt complain about racists or sexist or homophobic jokes on TV at 7 o'clock at night and if any of them did start to get a little uppity while Enoch Powell or Maggie Thatcher might decry violence you knew there was always the National Front or some extreme group of young thugs who would go crack some skulls while proclaiming their patriotism

sorry if this is UK specific but I wasnt in Canada in those days

No I was just clarifying whether or not you were insinuating anyone that likes muscle cars and guns is also a homophobic racist

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Leondros

I don’t feel like going through each post but it definitely was said/implied.

The right is super detached from reality and are the ones who are wrong. The left isn’t and therefore has less blame.

Politics has become this hugely polarizing demon where no one can ever find middle ground. This forum is a perfect example. I don’t identify as right or left but on most issues find myself relatively balanced and in the middle. I can have discussions with most of my super right and super left friends and see where they are coming from and we can find some middle ground on issues like taxation, policing, rights, and social programs. I don’t see that happening nearly as much as it did before social media.

In further defence of this forum from the "centrists" who conveniently lack the ability to self-reflect on their own positions and don't see themselves as contributors to the exact problems they talk about...

Perhaps it would be easier to find middle ground, to reduce polarization, if "the problems of both sides are not equal" was not misrepresented as "one side has no problems"? If we asked what was implied, instead of assuming some implication and responding only to that? If... maybe... we didn't do these things and then say "YOU are part of the problem"?

I don't really mind posts like that. It's the internet, who cares? I do that #### on the regular and carry my "Sass Queen" card with honour (thanks Dirac!). But the complete lack of awareness, self-reflection, and critical thought it requires to do it, and then talk about it as "the problem" as if you're not playing right into it is constantly amazing to me.

"This place is so polarized! You! You are the problem based on my misrepresentation of your views!"
"Tribalism is a problem and this place is evidence, the only people who disagree with me are on another tribe!"
"People who disagree simply push a narrative, but I, I am an original thinker, simply collecting evidence that fits toward a set of ideas I have already committed to."

It's all a bit much fellas. Maybe an unspoken problem of the internet here is that it has increased delusion and decreased any impetus for self-reflection. You know, the same kind of things that cause people to believe in conspiracy theories, support treason, and get shot trying to break through a barrier in the Capitol building?

Nah, nevermind. I, as a free-thinker, couldn't be guilty of and succumbed to the problems I've identified with the internet, politics, or societal interaction. That's unpossible.

[peter12]

Is that where he's coming from? I'm not a centrist, I'm a progressive, and I can see what Cliff, Leondros et al. are talking about pretty clearly.

Like are you pretending you are somehow immune to this massive change in the medium for information?

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by btimbit

No I was just clarifying whether or not you were insinuating anyone that likes muscle cars and guns is also a homophobic racist

Cool story bro moment, but I know a gay dude who is the biggest muscle car enthusiast you'd ever meet. He has a mint condition Chevelle and he let me drive once. I can see why people are into it.

[Cappy]

There is the horseshoe theory in political science that say that the political spectrum is not a line, but a... horseshoe:



An example of this would be anti-globalists. The same redneck revolutionaries would agree with the Anti-WTO Seattle protesters about the perils of globalization and the rise of global elites.

another, weird, example is the anti-semitism expressed between some left-wingers and right-wingers (UK Labour Party and Jeremy Corban being an interesting example on the left).

There are also left-wing ideologues who disagree with the mainstream lefts immigration policies that would be more inline with right wingers.

However, i would agree that the right end of that horsehoe is probably far larger and more mainstream than the left (at this moment).

[MissTeeks]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1347617682317860867

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by btimbit

No I was just clarifying whether or not you were insinuating anyone that likes muscle cars and guns is also a homophobic racist

No not at all, just using them as an easy example of the rights clear desire to reach back to the past before we cared about the enviroment or other peoples feelings or rights (except white people obviously).

I find myself somewhat lost by both sides in this while I think the extremes of left wing thought on nomenclature, language and the media, wokeness if you will, can be a bit stupid I am also pretty sure the right's complaints about 'cancel culture' are just a cover for a wish to go back to being able to tell racist jokes and not give a toss what the Indian guy you work with thinks , and its a very short trip from there to thinking you shouldnt have to work with an Indian guy or if he complains you should give him a belt to keep him in his place.

[woob]

Originally Posted by MissTeeks

https://twitter.com/user/status/1347617682317860867

Social media and narcism - Name a more iconic duo! Now putting you in jail for years. The smart domestic terrorists keep their sunglasses on, masks on, and don't pose for selfies no matter how "cool" it is to break into the capitol building.

[troutman]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1347618729165783049


https://www.businessinsider.com/trum...ls-feds-2021-1

[Ozy_Flame]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1347621779783770112

[btimbit]

Glad to see some of these scumbags are being arrested

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Cappy

However, i would agree that the right end of that horsehoe is probably far larger and more mainstream than the left (at this moment).

In which country?

[woob]

FYI: The wiki on 2021 Storming of the US Capitol is full of good info.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_s...States_Capitol

[opendoor]

Pretty crazy footage of "patriots" trying to bust through a police line to enter the Capitol. Pretty raw video with lots of swearing and violence, so just a warning about that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=1216...ature=youtu.be

I can only imagine what some of those people would've done if they had actually succeeded in getting ahold of some Members of Congress.

[Leondros]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

In further defence of this forum from the "centrists" who conveniently lack the ability to self-reflect on their own positions and don't see themselves as contributors to the exact problems they talk about...

Perhaps it would be easier to find middle ground, to reduce polarization, if "the problems of both sides are not equal" was not misrepresented as "one side has no problems"? If we asked what was implied, instead of assuming some implication and responding only to that? If... maybe... we didn't do these things and then say "YOU are part of the problem"?

I don't really mind posts like that. It's the internet, who cares? I do that #### on the regular and carry my "Sass Queen" card with honour (thanks Dirac!). But the complete lack of awareness, self-reflection, and critical thought it requires to do it, and then talk about it as "the problem" as if you're not playing right into it is constantly amazing to me.

"This place is so polarized! You! You are the problem based on my misrepresentation of your views!"
"Tribalism is a problem and this place is evidence, the only people who disagree with me are on another tribe!"
"People who disagree simply push a narrative, but I, I am an original thinker, simply collecting evidence that fits toward a set of ideas I have already committed to."

It's all a bit much fellas. Maybe an unspoken problem of the internet here is that it has increased delusion and decreased any impetus for self-reflection. You know, the same kind of things that cause people to believe in conspiracy theories, support treason, and get shot trying to break through a barrier in the Capitol building?

Nah, nevermind. I, as a free-thinker, couldn't be guilty of and succumbed to the problems I've identified with the internet, politics, or societal interaction. That's unpossible.

I think this is a fair post, thank you. My largest issues and to Cappy's point, sure CP doesn't track and utilize algorithms but at the end of the day this forum is a source of social media. And despite what some may argue there is a certain demographic that I have noticed here that at least a majority of regular posters fit into.

What I believe to be part of the problem in the 'polarization' I am talking about is with the internet today people are able to find each other much more easily and tend to feed off each other and get into a group think mentality. This causes some spiraling, much like what we've seen with the Trump supporters and radicalization.

Before the internet, people were less likely to find as many people who they identified with unless they were part of some sort of cult or group and in their daily lives of work and family, they had less time to partake in those interactions that I mention above. Social media has drastically increased these types of experiences for people to consume resulting in more and more polarization.

The middle ground I speak of Pepsi is something that is becoming more and more rare and this me vs you mentality is becoming more and more common. The result is what we saw this week in Capitol hill. Lots of anger, and lots of radicalized people all in one spot. I think this only gets worse.

I think some posters have hit the nail on the head. The right is going to be inherently more violent due to its gun beliefs, anti government sentiment and freedoms. But that doesn't mean the left is without its radicalized groups such as Antifa.

[troutman]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1347615088589426688

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

https://twitter.com/user/status/1347621779783770112

I can't believe he recorded it live on his Facebook.

People have been given life sentences in the U.S. for less than what some of these people did. They need to make an example out of a few of them and this guy might deserve it the most since he is actually a delegate.