[Signing] Buffalo signs Taylor Hall (1 yr, $8 mil, NMC, NTC)

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Games played the last 5 seasons

82 of 82

72 of 82

76 of 82

33 of 82

65 of 68ish (not sure how many he missed during trade talks)

He isn't some kind of ironman or anything but other than 2 seasons ago, he hasnt missed THAT much time even if it is more than many others.

All that being said, it never made a ton of sense for the Flames to go get him unless JG was traded for picks and prospects which i suspect was a pretty limited market this off season. Otherwise the club starts the year with 3 different 1st line LW's AND a 5+M dollar 4th line LW? That would be both bold and stupid.

I like Taylor Hall as a player, but his "fit" in Calgary just isn't/wasn't there for a few different reasons.

Ah damn, misread his stats on hockeydb and forgot to combine the last 2 seasons together .

[flamesforcup]

Originally Posted by 2ArmBands

He will likely get both. The 8.5 million and get dealt to a contender at the deadline.

Maybe he sees himself having more playing time and a bigger role on Buffalo then Colorado? More points would equal bigger contract and i think he can get more with Buffalo as he wont have to share the ice with as much people.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

I expect the answer to that is zero as it is explicitly not allowed and would cost any team doing so huge penalties.

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I guess Wilson and Labanc didn't get that memo.

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

100% disagree wholeheartedly. The objective of an agent is to make his client as much money as possible in as short a time as possible.

Again, see Labanc, Kevin. His agent sure screwed up last year, eh?

An agent's goal is to fulfill their client's wishes.

Hall could come out of this with an 8x8. Or an 8x6. Or a 7x7. He's probably bought insurance to protect him if it's less than that. I'm not sure what the best long term offer was on the table for Hall this year, but IMO he's very likely to get it again next year. He was never going to get a 1x8 on the back side of the deal.

The reason guys don't do this more often is that the big-ass long term deals are actually there for them. It seems they probably weren't for Hall this year.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I guess Wilson and Labanc didn't get that memo.



Again, see Labanc, Kevin. His agent sure screwed up last year, eh?
.

So, you are saying that if Leblanc fell off the cliff he would still have gotten the same contract because it was already signed?

I agree that SJ likely made some soft promises that if things planned out they would look after him.

But there could not have been any signed deal in the bottom drawer.


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[kyuss275]

I really feel the flames wasted a great opportunity to add first line talent. Yes flames made the correct move on getting a #1 goalie first. That said they should have been prepared to take a run at both. They should have been offering Hall a long term contract. There were a bunch of teams against the cap this year that couldn’t go long term. Next year there are going to be way more teams in the mix, with extra cap space, if he leaves the Sabres. Flames should have traded Ryan before the draft . If they had to add a late round sweetener to do it then so be it ( personally I think they could have gotten a late round pick for him) . I like Tanev but 4 years is to long for him. Priority #2 should have been Hall . They could have dealt with the RHD at a later date. It’s not everyday you get a 1st line player who would actually consider signing in Calgary.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

I guess Wilson and Labanc didn't get that memo.



Again, see Labanc, Kevin. His agent sure screwed up last year, eh?

An agent's goal is to fulfill their client's wishes.

Hall could come out of this with an 8x8. Or an 8x6. Or a 7x7. He's probably bought insurance to protect him if it's less than that. I'm not sure what the best long term offer was on the table for Hall this year, but IMO he's very likely to get it again next year. He was never going to get a 1x8 on the back side of the deal.

The reason guys don't do this more often is that the big-ass long term deals are actually there for them. It seems they probably weren't for Hall this year.

TBH almost everyone thought it was a dumb move at the time. It's good it worked out for him, but Leblanc is the exception and not the norm. I'll bet there's a hefty list of players who had multi-year offers but chose the 1 year contract to ''prove'' themselves worthy of a bigger pay, only to regret it later. So much can happen in a single year, as the pandemic has proven.

Hall is a big marquee name so it very well might work out for him. But IMO it's a big risk.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

TBH almost everyone thought it was a dumb move at the time. It's good it worked out for him, but Leblanc is the exception and not the norm. I'll bet there's a hefty list of players who had multi-year offers but chose the 1 year contract to ''prove'' themselves worthy of a bigger pay, only to regret it later. So much can happen in a single year, as the pandemic has proven.

Hall is a big marquee name so it very well might work out for him. But IMO it's a big risk.

Exactly.

[Robbob]

I know fans don't like it, but I get it. This off season has been less than ideal. Push it back a year and it gets closer to getting away from the flat cap. Seattle is coming in so there will be movement on rosters which will open up cap space. For the Flames between the Brouwer buyout, Ryan, and Rittich you have close to 8. Who knows what happens with Lucic, Gio, etc.

Next signing season I think will be better for the players.

[delayedreflex]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

I really feel the flames wasted a great opportunity to add first line talent. Yes flames made the correct move on getting a #1 goalie first. That said they should have been prepared to take a run at both. They should have been offering Hall a long term contract. There were a bunch of teams against the cap this year that couldn’t go long term. Next year there are going to be way more teams in the mix, with extra cap space, if he leaves the Sabres. Flames should have traded Ryan before the draft . If they had to add a late round sweetener to do it then so be it ( personally I think they could have gotten a late round pick for him) . I like Tanev but 4 years is to long for him. Priority #2 should have been Hall . They could have dealt with the RHD at a later date. It’s not everyday you get a 1st line player who would actually consider signing in Calgary.

Well, there’s a decent chance there’ll get another shot at him next year, unless Hall signs an extension with Buffalo (or is traded to another team that can sign him to an extension). Frankly I am much happier with adding Markstrom than I am adding Hall, and I just don’t think we could have added Hall without moving out Gaudreau, and you can see the trade market is extremely weak if you are trading players for futures this year. If you were hoping to keep all of Hall/Gaudreau/Tkachuk then you probably are stuck with some pretty big holes in your lineup - the only position that it seems to work stacking all your talent into and sacrificing other positions is centre, putting all your money into left wing doesn’t seem like a good move.


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[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Saqe

I guess Treliving feels that the forward group is fine on offense

Or he has other plans to try and make changes.......didn’t realize the rosters are now locked in for the upcoming season.

[Hackey]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Ah damn, misread his stats on hockeydb and forgot to combine the last 2 seasons together .

Also this season will likely be shortened so that might make it easier to stay healthy. Also maybe why he chose Buffalo for less travel.

I agree it definitely is a bit strange/risky but this situation has never happened before so likely why we've never seen players go this route.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

Or he has other plans to try and make changes.......didn’t realize the rosters are now locked in for the upcoming season.

In fact Treliving has made a point to see he could see things happening after free agency and what not settled down. He said it so much that many in the media speculated there wouldn’t be much Flames action early in Free agency (Francis, Boomer, Nault).

I am less convinced we see a Johnny or Monahan deal but I could see pieces like Mangipane, and Hanifin on the block

[The Professor]

The sign Hall/trade Gaudreau asset windfall would have been great for the franchise, but I’m sort of glad it didn’t happen. I think Hall is a small but clear downgrade on Johnny. Other changes need to be made now, but I think we would have disposed Hall in short order.

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

100% disagree wholeheartedly. The objective of an agent is to make his client as much money as possible in as short a time as possible. There are some things to consider as to why it would have been a whole lot better to sign big right now, instead of gambling (big time) that he will cash in bigger next season:

• If his plan is to have a good season then cash in bigger next season, he will be 29 when he signs next season. 28 looks a whole lot better then 29 to a GM looking to sign someone longterm.

• Hall has been injured 3/3 the past seasons. He was healthy during his Hart season. But 3 seasons in row since, massive injuries. His party is gambling big time he's going to stay healthy this entire season to cash in bigger next UFA season? To me this is by far the riskiest part of this contract; gambling he will stay healthy to be recognized as deserving a bigger contract next time. The whole point of signing big long term UFA contracts is to have that stability/financial security IF you get injured.

• If it's such a "smart" move, why does this very rarely happen with big UFAs? Are there examples of past star players going the 1 year route, only to cash in substantially larger the season after and we can all agree it was a smart move. I think Hossa is a good example of doing as such. But those are the exceptions and not the norm. Otherwise we'd be seeing it happen a whole lot more. There's a reason you sign the dotted line when a big sum is put in front of you, and not risk going the 1 year route in an attempt for something bigger next season.

• I feel like Hall left between $40-$50 million on the table doing this. If Hall goes on to have an elite season and signs a bigger contract then I will happily eat my words. But IMO this is a huge risk. Take the stability NOW.

Weird signing. Even weirder it was with Buffalo. The only positive I can think of is he knows Buffalo isn't a contender, but can pad his stats with Eichel. Come trade deadline, he'll have the chance to essentially choose his destination (his NMC a big part of that) and if he wins the cup then he can cash in. I suppose if that all comes to fruition it will be seen as an epic 4D chess move. But that's some wild-ass 4D chess moves to pull it off.

It's rarely done because we've never seen the inexhaustible upward climb in NHL cap and revenues interrupted by an economic crisis like this. NHLers play for years to get to this point, it's the culmination of their entire career through their ELC, and then their RFA contract where they have little to no leverage; the chance to be a UFA and sign a big ticket retirement contract that forms the basis of their career earnings and in a location that they will most likely build a family. It's super important. So instead of valuing safety above all else and signing this longterm backbone contract in the middle of the most economic uncertainty in the NHL for decades, Hall did the smart thing and waited it out for another year. He'll still be a young known commodity in the league next year, and next year for signing purposes is likely only 8 months and 50ish games away. It's nothing.

We don't know what he was offered exactly vs what he will sign for next year but allow me to speculate. He was likely looking for 8 million minimum, over a 6-7 year time frame. He was able to get that for one year for the Sabres, and lets say next year he's able to sign a 8X6 with someone else. That's now 7 years of making his preferred money, and about 12 million more over the life of the contract than if some team was trying to get him cheap at a 6X8. Or, what was more likely in my mind, teams were'nt willing to give him 6-7 years term in this environment but only 4-5. Now we're talking about a 34 year old hall needing a new contract, which is a lot different than 29 or 30, that's way more of a risk to career earning than betting on yourself when you're still in your 20s. The injury risk is real but minute, the major bet is that NHL teams will be more willing to hand out money next summer, which is a bet I would personally take. It's a small risk to take to counter act being forced in to a deal that's below his market value either in money or in years, possibly for a team in a city he doesn't want to go to, in the most dysfunctional free agent market in decades.

[cannon7]

An NMC...for Buffalo. Ok then.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by cannon7

An NMC...for Buffalo. Ok then.

It's more about control imo. I think Hall wants to avoid being traded to a team like Arizona again at the deadline. He needs to keep his offensive numbers up to makea run at a big contract.

[cannon7]

Kind of feel bad for Hall. All this talk of wanting to play for a contender, and when it materializes, he takes the better pay with a dysfunctional tire fire. Not that I want the Avs to get Hall, but the guy clearly doesn't mean what he says. If he just kept quiet, I wouldn't fault the guy for taking the big money. But he just sounds insincere here.

Maybe it works out for him in Buffalo. Who knows.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I'm sorry but this is pure and utter lunacy if Hall really wants to win. To choose Buffalo over Colorado for $1.5 million?



No wonder he failed his boating exam multiple times.

I don't know. At the TD Hall could force a trade to Colorado; he gets all of his money, and they get him for a playoff run in a bargain return.

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[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I don't know. At the TD Hall could force a trade to Colorado; he gets all of his money, and they get him for a playoff run in a bargain return.

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Yeah, this is true I guess.

I mean last trade deadline if he had any control, he ends up in Calgary as opposed to Arizona more than likely.

[cannon7]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I don't know. At the TD Hall could force a trade to Colorado; he gets all of his money, and they get him for a playoff run in a bargain return.

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Approaching your NHL career in such a cynical way surely will pay dividends.