The Matthew Tkachuk contract negotiations

[Burner]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Tkachuk setup 2 OT winners if it wasn't for the stone hands on his line

so he didnt set up any OT winners.....

[Aleks]

Originally Posted by flambers

Whole flames team with the exception of Bennett and Smith did squat.

Its a none factor in the negotiation in my view

Agent will tell the team, what is Tkachuk in 3 to 4 years time when Giordano retires?

Probably the captain of the team, the key piece on the club...

Sure, then show some leadership and be an example of how you want to be a team player and take a fair deal. Who wants a team captain who is willing to sit out and strap the team? I highly doubt the offer on the table is *unfair*. Like its been said numerous times, roster building is a puzzle and needs buy in from everyone to work toward that common goal. I understand maximizing career earnings, but these guys can't be blind to the fact it takes a team....Any player who disagrees frankly isn't interested in winning, just cashing cheques

[bax]

Originally Posted by Aleks

Sure, then show some leadership and be an example of how you want to be a team player and take a fair deal. Who wants a team captain who is willing to sit out and strap the team?

Um you do know Giordano sat out for a year, right?

A player should get paid fair market value- and that market has changed drastically over the past 3 years. You don’t know what is going on in negotiations, this is all assumptions.

[bax]

Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache

Let’s do this the other way.

Tkachuk piled up over 20 of his points on the PP, on an all star unit including the best D in the game, and that other guy who got 99 points

Rantanen had 87 points in 74 games. No disrespect to Tkachuk, who isn’t even a point per game player. Almost, but not quite.

Plus head to head in the playoffs, Rantanen put up 9 points in the last 4 games, while Tkachuk had 1 assist over that span and was -5

The Avs reportedly are valuing Rantanen at 8.4-8.75 over a 6-8 year term.

Believe me, if Tkachuk wants to compare himself to other RFAs, he is going to hear some things that don’t favour his negotiating position.

Rantanen wants Marner money. Sakic does not accept Dubas bad contracts as setting the market.

Okay?

Colorado also had an amazing power play where Rantanen put up 33 points last year and 35 the year before. He also plays with those goes at even strength unlike Tkachuk.

It doesn’t matter what the Avs are offering him- that’s not his value, and it’s clear he’s not willing to sign for that.

Of course he will hear negative things, that’s how a negotiation works.

Also, comparing their playoffs is fine, but why not include the one game where Tkachuk played well? Seems like you have a clear bias here. Tkachuk put up 3 points in 5 games. I agree not a good run, but the whole team was tentative and clearly didn’t have a game plan to match the Avs. Sample size

[Aleks]

Originally Posted by bax

Um you do know Giordano sat out for a year, right?

Sure, did anyone see or think of Gio as a future captain at that time, the team or the player? Did anyone see Gio as a Norris D man in 07? Were the circumstances the same (the hold out was for a 1 way contract).....Not really, so its a disingenuous comparison. If you're going to groom someone to be a leader, or make the assumption that is the future, why not step up and be that leader. You're comparing an undrafted camp invite to a highly touted draft pick who everyone wants to be a leader. Gio has since led by example, in countless ways, more than enough to make up for the fact he just wanted to have an NHL contract, not quibbling over a theoretical 8.2 vs 9 and sapping the team for any flexibility or potentially losing other effective roster players to make it work.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Quickest to name 5 better gets a prize

Giordano
Giordano
Giordano
Giordano
Giordano


Crap, I guess it's Edmonton that has 5 better players.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by bax

Um you do know Giordano sat out for a year, right?

A player should get paid fair market value- and that market has changed drastically over the past 3 years. You don’t know what is going on in negotiations, this is all assumptions.

Apples to oranges. Gio sat out a year because he wouldn't accept a 2-way deal.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Aleks

Sure, did anyone see or think of Gio as a future captain at that time, the team or the player? Did anyone see Gio as a Norris D man in 07? Were the circumstances the same (the hold out was for a 1 way contract).....Not really, so its a disingenuous comparison. If you're going to groom someone to be a leader, or make the assumption that is the future, why not step up and be that leader. You're comparing an undrafted camp invite to a highly touted draft pick who everyone wants to be a leader. Gio has since led by example, in countless ways, more than enough to make up for the fact he just wanted to have an NHL contract, not quibbling over a theoretical 8.2 vs 9 and sapping the team for any flexibility or potentially losing other effective roster players to make it work.

That’s doesn’t make a difference.

Point is both players were holding out to get what they felt they were worth at the time.

Would you take 10% less than what the market dictates you’re worth because there is an expectation that you are a “leader”?

IMO the Aho contract set the stage. If the Flames want that 6th year they will need to offer more than 8.5

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Tkachuk setup 2 OT winners if it wasn't for the stone hands on his line

"Stone hands"??

Come on. Grubauer's save on Backlund's shot in OT in Game 4 was all world.

[kyuss275]

Sooner or later Tkachuk will sign. Flames wil probably have to unload salary. I used to think it was a far gone conclussion that Frolik would be traded. I'm now thinking it will be Janko instead.

[Enoch Root]

with my western accent, it sounds more like foregone

[FlamesAddiction]

If you trade Frolik to sign Tkachuk, you end up having to rely on a rookie or replacement level player on Tkachuk's own line. It just seems counter productive to sign him to a big money contract and then throw a wrench in his ability to produce.

I realize Frolik might not even be ideal even, but he is a lot better than any other alternative.

[Enoch Root]

I don't know... I think at this point in Frolik's career, both Mangiapane and Dube are improving to the point where the difference is marginal. I wouldn't be surprised if at least one of them is actually better than Frolik this year (and that isn't a slight on Frolik)

Beyond that, in a cap world, it isn't just "what can you do for me?", it is also a case of "what are we getting for the cost?"

[Corral]

Originally Posted by bax

Um you do know Giordano sat out for a year, right?

A player should get paid fair market value- and that market has changed drastically over the past 3 years. You don’t know what is going on in negotiations, this is all assumptions.

Yes but I think giordano was offered a two way minimum deal by sutter at the time. Hardly comparable to the millions that tkachuk is turning his nose at

Btw interesting timing on the giordano story by Francis today.

[Manhattanboy]

Deal fatigue setting in.

[bax]

Originally Posted by Corral

Yes but I think giordano was offered a two way minimum deal by sutter at the time. Hardly comparable to the millions that tkachuk is turning his nose at



Btw interesting timing on the giordano story by Francis today.

Nobody here knows what is going on in the negotiations. I don’t think there is any reason to vilify Tkachuk

[Corral]

Originally Posted by bax

Nobody here knows what is going on in the negotiations. I don’t think there is any reason to vilify Tkachuk

Aside from the fact that it’s almost certain the flames have made him a fair offer that is worth more than most of us will ever earn in our lifetime. I suppose you are right there is no reason to crap on him

[Strange Brew]

Without knowing anything of substance related to the negotiations, it’s impossible to characterize one side as somehow more fair or reasonable than the other.

[Harry Lime]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

If you trade Frolik to sign Tkachuk, you end up having to rely on a rookie or replacement level player on Tkachuk's own line. It just seems counter productive to sign him to a big money contract and then throw a wrench in his ability to produce.

I realize Frolik might not even be ideal even, but he is a lot better than any other alternative.

I think that Tkachuk-Lindholm-Bennett would score like the dickens. Like Charles Dickens.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

Sooner or later Tkachuk will sign. Flames wil probably have to unload salary. I used to think it was a far gone conclussion that Frolik would be traded. I'm now thinking it will be Janko instead.

Nope, I still think Brodie is the guy on the way out.