Mike Smith's... woes? He blows? Eating crows? Who knows! (Also David Rittich exists!)

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Jore

it's truly remarkable that not even one goalie has gone on a mcelhinney-like run in all the years that sigalet has been here. you'd think that even random chance would produce one career-year type of performance from the journeyman goalies we've had (not to mention one year above 17th in the league in save percentage), but no... curious

You don't think Smith as the team's MVP through January last year is a run? Or Rittich's October - November this year?

I have no idea as to Sigalet's abilities. None. I'm not a goalie coach myself and I'm certainly not boots on the ground watching him work with goaltenders. But most of the goalies that have a been here have struggled mightily in their next stops as well.

Certainly not a clear cut proof suggesting the goalie coach is the problem.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Sorry, I don't buy it. Coming into Calgary, Brian Elliott eas not "chicken ****"... he had just taken his team to the WCF and was a consistent performer. A year with Sigalet and he totally lost his talent? I don't care what he's done since then, the damage has been done. Mike Smith? I don't care if he's aging, his mistakes are the kind he has control over. David Rittich has started both his seasons on fire and only trended downwards. Chad Johnson was our best player for half a season and trended towards being our worst player by season's end. Jonas Hiller came in, carried us to the playoffs, and then became the worst goalie on the entire continent.

Maybe Philadelphia and St. Louis/Anaheim should fire their goalie coaches too then. Seems like they can't get the goalies to listen to them after they've been wrecked by Sigalet.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I can't sit here and definitely say that Sigalet is the problem.

However, there are a few things that I do know:

1) The Flames have gone through goalie after goalie for the past few years, and almost invariably, their performance has deteriorated in year 2, or after a period of time with the team.

2) We consistently see similar problems, being:

a) a propensity to play too deep in the crease
b) a propensity to 'lunge'
c) the weird positioning of the glove hand

Again, I'm no goalie coach, but these things bug the crap out of me. And there hasn't been enough success from the goalies for me to forgive and ignore these annoyances.

I am in no position to say: fire Sigalet. But the evidence as I see it is far from favourable, and I sure as hell have seen no reason to argue against the idea.

This is pretty much me.

He may be the problem, but I can't fathom how people with zero access know he's the problem.

And the goalies that have come through here have not been all that stellar and have gone on to be even less stellar after being here.

The lunging thing ... I heard Kelly Hrudey talking on the radio about how Sigalet was working with Smith to keep him tall in the net when pucks are near. Seems like he wasn't advocating the lunge he was trying to eradicate it.

[Bleeding Red]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Maybe Philadelphia and St. Louis/Anaheim should fire their goalie coaches too then. Seems like they can't get the goalies to listen to them after they've been wrecked by Sigalet.

StL has changed their goalie coach over the last 2 years - from Martin Brodeur & Ty Conklin to David Alexander. Not sure whose side is helped by the firing of the #1 goaltender of all time as a coach - maybe it proves the old adage - those who can do, those who can't teach, those who can't teach do commercials.

PHA will likely change their goalie coach this year. 4-5 yrs at the position seems normal for that franchise. Their current guy has been with them for 4 years. Before that it was Jeff Reese.

This is just info. None of it confirms anything.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Maybe Philadelphia and St. Louis/Anaheim should fire their goalie coaches too then. Seems like they can't get the goalies to listen to them after they've been wrecked by Sigalet.

They did. Jim Corsi was fired by the Blues in Feb 2017. They had the team worst save % in the league. They now have the guy who worked with Vasilievsky in the minors.

[Toonage]

What stands out is how Sigalet has withstood all recent coaching changes. By all accounts he is very popular with his goalies. I'd imagine its just not something given a whole lot of attention by management.

[Split98]

Here's Smith talking about goaltending if anyone missed it:
https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...s-goaltending/

I think his biggest issue is smugly opening with laughing that 'pundits' opinion don't matter with "well that's important then". He's right about 1 thing though: The Ws are pretty consistent. But he's disingenuous when he sluffs off anyones concerns as over-reaction. He's been much better lately, but his goaltending would have sunk this season if Rittich didn't step in. To his point though, Rittich is a Flames goalie... and Flames goaltending has gotten the job done more games than not.

To take a W as 'pretty good' and accept no criticism about anything that happened during the game isn't going to sit well with the 'pundits' who hope your name isn't attached to the ticket they paid for. Because what he's not addressing is the highlight reel of gimmies he's offered up throughout the season. Those are games people have paid to be at and those are 2 points that matter, even in our position right now. If we finish near the top of the conference, regular season mishaps are forgiven but they aren't forgotten. Those gimmies need to stop, and Iggy night was too familiar for a lot of fans. More worrisome is our saviour in Rittich hasn't been too confidence inspiring lately either.


The question is, how many 'blips' need to happen in a 7 game series before we realize goaltending is the problem. Throughout the year, the Flames have managed very well despite 1-2 gimmies a game (less so lately, albeit). However, those hurt a lot more in the playoffs and without our score-at-will top-6, that easily could be 1 of 4 games to the opposition over a few 'blips'.

There's reason to worry, but it's good to hear that they aren't letting panic control the dressing room. There's nothing that can be done about the situation now, so what he's saying is the best we can hope for. It's good to hear that he can let that roll off his back, as I don't think fans are complaining about it to hurt the guy. We want him to respond to terrible games with great goaltending we've seen from him before.

But he has to understand why fans hate seeing him in net as hard as that is to make peace with. He's single-handedly cost games, or made them a lot more exhausting than they needed to be. His terrible starts to begin the season could be the storyline of an exhausted Flames team in the playoffs, for all we know.

Either way, 'blips' aren't what fans want to hear. Especially when they've seen how many 'blips' he wants us to ignore.

[VladtheImpaler]

I have that sinking 1990's Trevor Kidd feeling. We shall see - maybe Rittich can Halak for a couple months. Smith I have no hope for - he just looks so fundamentally unsound and it feels like any given shot can beat him.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I think it's quite likely that Smith was surprised on that play by Hanifin joining him behind the net. Usually Hanifin would go to the corner to get the chip pass. I think Hanifin thought the Wild player was closer to Smith than usual though, so he went to get the puck himself.

If there had been a good option the other way (was it Hamonic?) the whole play goes differently.

Even if Smith thought Hanifan should have been in the corner waiting for the pass, he could have chipped it in to the empty corner and got back into the net. What he did certainly didn't work out well.

[schteve_d]

I have no idea the extent of influence that a goalie coach has on a goalie, but I just can't see how a year or two with Sigalet can undo twenty plus years of playing the position and coaching and wreck numerous goalies forever. It just makes no sense to me.

[Bleeding Red]

Originally Posted by Bingo

He may be the problem, but I can't fathom how people with zero access know he's the problem.

And the goalies that have come through here have not been all that stellar and have gone on to be even less stellar after being here.

So, my position is he may or may not be the problem, but he is the only constant factor over four years and 6+ goalies, so maybe a change is in order.
(If Bordeur can be let go as a goalie coach for not producing a solid goalie, I think Sigalet can too.)

If it boils down to "the Flames have only had crappy goalies and no coach can help that", then why not either do away with the position or change it up until you get the most awesome coach?

OR pay whatever you have to and get the most awesome goalie already. Pick the top 5 guys statistically and get one of them. Johnny Hockey for Carey Price, Tkachuk for MAF, Giordano for Anderson. (good luck)

[GioforPM]

Goalie coaches are such a mixed bag. Technicians, like Allaire. Feel good guys like Noodles, most of whom seem to have been old backups who just do the same thing as they did when playing - moral support. Old stars like Brodeur.

All I want is to somehow get a Mitch Korn student here. I don't know what Sigalet does, but I sure know Korn's results. I have zero hope of getting the man himself, short of hiring Trotz.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Even if Smith thought Hanifan should have been in the corner waiting for the pass, he could have chipped it in to the empty corner and got back into the net. What he did certainly didn't work out well.

I can't remember if that corner was empty or not. I think once it happened he though he could leave it for Hanifin and block/interfere with the Wild player. he gets away with that move all the time, though it's not usually that tight. And once he committed to it, it was too late to get back, especially the long way around.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Split98

Here's Smith talking about goaltending if anyone missed it:
https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/...s-goaltending/

I think his biggest issue is smugly opening with laughing that 'pundits' opinion don't matter with "well that's important then"...

Good. The last thing the team needs is a goalie who is distracted by opinions of fans and the media.

To take a W as 'pretty good' and accept no criticism about anything that happened during the game isn't going to sit well with the 'pundits' who hope your name isn't attached to the ticket they paid for. Because what he's not addressing is the highlight reel of gimmies he's offered up throughout the season. Those are games people have paid to be at and those are 2 points that matter, even in our position right now. If we finish near the top of the conference, regular season mishaps are forgiven but they aren't forgotten. Those gimmies need to stop, and Iggy night was too familiar for a lot of fans. More worrisome is our saviour in Rittich hasn't been too confidence inspiring lately either.

Just because Smith doesn't "address" this with media and fans does not in any way mean he is failing to take accountability for his own mistakes. (What is he realistically going to say, anyways, that will make everyone feel better?)

Smith has no one to answer to but his teammates, his coaches, and himself. I suspect that whatever needs to be said is said behind closed doors and out of the public eye, as it should be.

[TheScorpion]

What is Smith going to say to the media? "I suck"?

I don't think that'd be a good message to send to his teammates, especially when the team is doing as well as it is. Smith rightfully focused on the team's success over his own individual merits (or supposed lack thereof).

[Split98]

Speaking of goalie coaches, Mike Bales (Pittsburgh and now Carolina) was interviewed by ESPN and echoed a few sentiments we've heard from Sigalet
http://www.espn.com/nhl/story/_/id/2...ing-turnaround

[...]I don't get too much into the numbers with the guys. I think sometimes when you fill a guy's head with the numbers, it can overwhelm them. I just like them to go out and let them play.

When I'm dealing with my guys, my basic philosophy is that I'm trying to help them be the best version of themselves. I don't have a particular style. Some ideas, I feel, are more conducive to having success than others. But I'd say that's my basic philosophy. Everybody processes the game a little bit different. Everybody is built a little bit differently. Guys are more comfortable with certain save selections. I understand that guys have gotten to this level for a reason. Let's see what makes them successful and build off of that.

Curtis has been around a little bit. To be honest, I'm not interfering at all with what he's doing. He's an older guy. He knows how he wants to play. If there's something in his game he's not comfortable with, something I haven't picked up on, he can bring it to me and we can work on it. Some guys do change a little bit as they get older -- changing their style due to injury or because their body gets older. But for the most part, if they're older and still in the league, it's been working for them.

I know myself and a few others were less than encouraged by Sigalet's laissez faire attitude towards coaching - but I take a lot of solace in hearing a goalie coach I like speaking similarly

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Bleeding Red

So, my position is he may or may not be the problem, but he is the only constant factor over four years and 6+ goalies, so maybe a change is in order.
(If Bordeur can be let go as a goalie coach for not producing a solid goalie, I think Sigalet can too.)

If it boils down to "the Flames have only had crappy goalies and no coach can help that", then why not either do away with the position or change it up until you get the most awesome coach?

OR pay whatever you have to and get the most awesome goalie already. Pick the top 5 guys statistically and get one of them. Johnny Hockey for Carey Price, Tkachuk for MAF, Giordano for Anderson. (good luck)

I read this as essentially a call to make changes for the sake of change. That is a terrible idea. Moreover, just because Martin Brodeur was the greatest goalie who ever lived, this does not on its own qualify him to be any good at coaching.

As for paying "whatever you have to" to shore up goaltending, I will take a hard pass on this suggestion. Hopefully reliving can resolve the situation more effectively and affordably than through panicky, reactionary decisions that cripple the franchise.

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I think you are reading too much into player sound bites. These sorts of interviews are entirely useless for revealing information about a player’s character and his relationship with his teammates.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Well it wasn't just a sounds bite here, it was the whole entire interview. His tone, the potshots, the defensiveness, the crabby nature. Very difficult for me to like him or defend him at this point.

Secondly, I don't know what his relationship with his teammates are and I'm not saying this interview shows it. But I'm saying for me, I don't like his performance or his personality.

[Tyler]

Overall, Smith's persona and attitude is just unlikable. The fact that he's regressing as a goalie certainly doesn't help.

[Split98]

^ He really has stoked the fire a few times this year with his unlikeable personality and 'chill, dude' relationship with fans ('pundits')

I think telling everyone there's no panic here, no one wants those flubs back more than me, we're all on the same page that goaltending has been spotty but we're confident in the team we have... would go a lot further than "you guys need to chill, nothing's happened here and you're all just making stuff up"

We can see the games Mike, and this many 'blips' on the radar usually means we're under attack.