[Rumour] Lebrun: CGY & CAR talked about Lindholm trade that could involve Hamilton and Hanifin

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by 868904

...The way I see it:



Brodie paired with Gio = Hamilton paired with Gio



Brodie paired with Stone > Hamilton paired with anyone other than GIo



Brodie paired with Hamonic = Hamilton paired with anyone other than GIo





I'm not saying Hamilton isn't good, but his only success here has been while paired with Gio. I'm also not saying Hamonic is not good, it could just be a case of him not meshing well with Brodie on the ice, it happens.



At his best, and in my opinion, Brodie is an elite defenseman and better than what Hamilton has shown at his very best. There is always still the potential for Hamilton to take another step up, but his best isn't as good as Brodie's best...

The problem here is that this is simply not accurate. Bingo has posted figures a few times which demonstrate that Hamilton is far and away the Flames second-best defenseman.

I thought it very interesting at Peter's presser when he talked about Brodie having success playing the right side. Peters either had that fed to him by Treliving or someone in management OR it comes from his discussions and analysis as part of the Team Canada coaching staff for the 2016 World Cup . There was a lot of talk about Gio and Brodie being selected for that team, ultimately, they didn't and it sounds like it was because Babcock is a real stickler for the left-right thing but it may be a hint as to what potential Peters' might see for Brodie.

This is reaching. Peters also stated in the same PC that no player is better on his off-side than he is on his strong side.

[Mattman]

Originally Posted by Demetric

Chiarelli wants a RD D for 10th OV, I present you M. Stone, heck that is a better deal that what he paid for Reinhart.

I know we just got him so aside from the absurdity of trading him just one year later, would you take Hamonic for the 10th overall?

[the2bears]

Originally Posted by Diemenz

The bruins tried for 4 months to sign him, it was reported they even offered him more then Calgary extended him for. But yeah, Boston moved on from him by choice.

Before throwing out a swing and a miss ensure you know what your talking about.

Exactly as I remember it. Then the Bruins media (and fans) created some smoke around the whole thing, "uppity loner", etc.

"Where there's smoke..." has to be one of the shallowest bases for rumours on CP.

[Demetric]

Originally Posted by Mattman

I know we just got him so aside from the absurdity of trading him just one year later, would you take Hamonic for the 10th overall?

why you want to trade Hamonic instead of Stone?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

I'm simply trying to point out that people justifying trading Hamilton on the basis of him having a bad attitude is the typical response from teams and fans who have lost a trade.

And let's not act like the Bruins weren't a tire fire at the 2015 draft.

But yeah, swing and a miss as you usually do.

That’s not what he did. He suggested that two teams walking away from Hamilton, despite his pretty stellar on ice performance and young age, means there’s some smoke to that fire.

It hasn’t happened yet, and it may not happen. I personally think the Hamilton attitude rumours are garbage, but I agree with Scroopy in that two teams walking away from him at this point softens my resolve on that a little bit.

Your point is valid, but your analogy was bad.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Demetric

why you want to trade Hamonic instead of Stone?

Hamonic is not going anywhere. We just paid a mint for him less than a year ago and the work he does in the community is exactly the type of thing this organization loves.

[Bingo]

Honestly I think there are a lot of red herrings in this discussion that need to be moved aside.

- what the media thinks of Hamilton
- trading the best player in a transaction
- current stats

This all comes down to what Treliving and his assistants think of Hamilton as a fit for the Flames going forward, in the dressing room, his overall play.

There is little debate about his offence, some suggestions about his try level in battling and his defensive play that they have to sort out.

I'm not against betting on a young player that they like because it's the best way to add an impact player without a silly contract into the mid 30s and has a chance if you're scouting is correct to get more than it looked like you are getting on the transaction day.

But don't move Hamilton for fun. It has to make sense.

[Mattman]

Originally Posted by Demetric

why you want to trade Hamonic instead of Stone?

Is Stone worth the 10th Overall?

In my mind atleast, Stone isn't worth the 10th Overall.

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Mattman

Is Stone worth the 10th Overall?

In my mind atleast, Stone isn't worth the 10th Overall.

Which is why it's a perfect deal for Edmonton.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by MikeMc

We should probably chill out with the Foo on the top line projections.

Guy might not even make the team.

Lol I was going to post the same thing. How anyone thinks that kid is top line material at this juncture is completely beyond me.

[SuperMatt18]

I do think that the one positive here is that I don't think Treliving feels like he has to trade Hamilton here - if he's listening it's probably because the market for him is so strong.

RH D-men are at a premium, he's still only 25, and is on a good contract for 3 more seasons.

If he makes the deal it's probably because he feels we have the defensive depth now and in the future to be able to do it while the trade still brings in a lot of assets to help us be more competitive now and in the future.

[dammage79]

As with any good player. You only move them if you feel it makes the team better over all.
I think the idea around Lindholm and Hanafin is that it brings a better balance to the team.

Whatever happens, it was done with making the team better in mind.

[Demetric]

Originally Posted by Mattman

Is Stone worth the 10th Overall?

In my mind atleast, Stone isn't worth the 10th Overall.

true, however, you missed the point. We are dealing with Edmonton and Chiarelli who paid a 1st and 2nd for Reinhart who is not even an NHL player.

Time for us to cash in.

[JBR]

Get ‘er done Treliving, and you’re welcome for planting the seed for this one...

Calgary receives:
#4 pick (Tkachuk)
Hanafin
Lindholm

Carolina receives:
Hamilton
Mark Stone

Ottawa receives:
#2 pick
Sam Bennett
TJ Brodie

The risk is Montreal taking Tkachuk at #3.

[kukkudo]

Originally Posted by JBR

Get ‘er done Treliving, and you’re welcome for planting the seed for this one...

Calgary receives:
#4 pick (Tkachuk)
Hanafin
Lindholm

Carolina receives:
Hamilton
Mark Stone

Ottawa receives:
#2 pick
Sam Bennett
TJ Brodie

The risk is Montreal taking Tkachuk at #3.

What you trying to say

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Demetric

true, however, you missed the point. We are dealing with Edmonton and Chiarelli who paid a 1st and 2nd for Reinhart who is not even an NHL player.

Time for us to cash in.

Getting a player as good as Mark Stone at 10 is the fever dream.

[Dan403]

Wow.

That's really, really bad for Calgary.

Like really bad value.

Are you an Oiler's fan?

[Demetric]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Getting a player as good as Mark Stone at 10 is the fever dream.

not Mark but Michael ....

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by JBR

Get ‘er done Treliving, and you’re welcome for planting the seed for this one...

Calgary receives:
#4 pick (Tkachuk)
Hanafin
Lindholm

Carolina receives:
Hamilton
Mark Stone

Ottawa receives:
#2 pick
Sam Bennett
TJ Brodie

The risk is Montreal taking Tkachuk at #3.

Wow the Flames get totally fleeced there. Hurricanes get by far the best 2 players in the deal.

[868904]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

The problem here is that this is simply not accurate. Bingo has posted figures a few times which demonstrate that Hamilton is far and away the Flames second-best defenseman.





This is reaching. Peters also stated in the same PC that no player is better on his off-side than he is on his strong side.

Sure fancy stats say that, but what do you see? I see Giordano covering up a lot of Hamilton's mistakes. I see mistakes from both Brodie and Hamilton. Just go back and isolate and watch Hamilton, there are a lot of problems defensively and Giordano covers a lot of them. You could even argue that Giordano's offensive game has been hampered by covering up for Hamilton. Giordano had no problem putting up points while paired with Brodie.

Don't get trapped into relying fully on fancy stats.

Like I said, I'm going off of what I see, which is Brodie being superior when paired with Giordano. Am I biased? maybe, but it's the same bias that the Brodie haters have. Honestly I really have no reason to be bias, I don't know the players personally, they are all Flames to me and I want them all to succeed. But this is what I see. I'm not here to say trade Hamilton cause he sucks, i'm just curious why there is so much hate for Brodie. I see them both as fairly equal and if Hamilton can get a better return because his stock is high cause he's been playing with Giordano, than sure make a deal. I'm comfortable knowing that if that happens, the Flames can always fall back on reuniting Brodie with Giordano for an elite number one pairing; Flames won't take a hit at all in that regard. They will need to shore up the second and third pairs though.