Building The 2018/19 Flames Roster

[Kovaz]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Actually I’ve heard several of our players resent Brouwer and the ice time he gets compared to what he accomplishes with it. The players are watching as closely as we do and they’ve surely noticed how much plays die on his stick and how much he’s squandered the opportunities he’s had. They know he’s been gifted ice time due to his salary that he’s failed to earn. If he’s widely resented by the fan base for doing little to nothing on the ice then it’s likely some players feel the same way.

If Brouwer is a divisive topic for the team and it’s players then that’s a reason to buy him out IMO. I’m not convinced we’ll see it but it’s an option. We have guys on the farm like Foo who seem to be able to bring what Brouwer brought with an upside that I’m not sure Brouwer has anymore. If Brouwer is impeding young players from getting the ice time they need that’s another reason to buy him out.

Should be interesting to see if anything happens with him. I don’t have much hope for Brouwer redemption. Cutting bait might be best despite the length of the buyout.

I'm 100% in this boat. He's the only player on the roster that would truly be addition by subtraction to get rid of him IMO. I can't count the number of times I've put together a hypothetical roster for next year, only to realize I forgot Brouwer and fitting him in means significantly downgrading a line somewhere in my lineup.

There's just no room for a slow player with poor puck skills in today's game. The 4th line becomes significantly slower if you have Brouwer take a faster, younger player's spot, and his lack of puck skills drags down any line in the top-9.

[Flash Walken]

Buying Brouwer out should be the easiest hockey ops decision Treliving has this summer.

It should be a no-brainer.

That being said, this is the Flames, so we'll see what happens.

[Red]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Actually I’ve heard several of our players resent Brouwer and the ice time he gets compared to what he accomplishes with it. The players are watching as closely as we do and they’ve surely noticed how much plays die on his stick and how much he’s squandered the opportunities he’s had. They know he’s been gifted ice time due to his salary that he’s failed to earn. If he’s widely resented by the fan base for doing little to nothing on the ice then it’s likely some players feel the same way.

If Brouwer is a divisive topic for the team and it’s players then that’s a reason to buy him out IMO. I’m not convinced we’ll see it but it’s an option. We have guys on the farm like Foo who seem to be able to bring what Brouwer brought with an upside that I’m not sure Brouwer has anymore. If Brouwer is impeding young players from getting the ice time they need that’s another reason to buy him out.

Should be interesting to see if anything happens with him. I don’t have much hope for Brouwer redemption. Cutting bait might be best despite the length of the buyout.

A great point that's often overlooked FDW. It's hard to watch a teammate/co-worker getting the royal treatment in any line of work. And Brouwer may not be at fault here so that makes it even more awkward.
But at the end of the day, if you can't score, do things others can't. For a big guy he didn't really throw his weight around. And this team could have used some nastiness. He pretty much mailed it in.

[FanIn80]

Gaudreau Monahan Tkachuk
Neal Backlund Ferland
Bennett Jankowski Brodie
Hathaway [4th line vet with speed] Foo

Giordano Hamilton
Kulak Hamonic
Stone Andersson

Just running with my thought of trying Brodie out on the wing. Just have to sign Neal and a 4th line C then.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

Buying Brouwer out should be the easiest hockey ops decision Treliving has this summer.

It should be a no-brainer.

That being said, this is the Flames, so we'll see what happens.

I'm torn.

Removing the player is a no-brainer sure, but it costs you 4 years cap hit @ $1.5 million in a year where his current $4.5 million hit isn't likely to hold you back.

You can still remove the player without removing the cap hit and not cost yourself 4 more years of dead cap space, and that's by waiving him and sending him to Stockton for one season.

If the Flames don't need the cap space this coming season a demotion might be the best move.

We'll see I guess.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I'm torn.

Removing the player is a no-brainer sure, but it costs you 4 years cap hit @ $1.5 million in a year where his current $4.5 million hit isn't likely to hold you back.

You can still remove the player without removing the cap hit and not cost yourself 4 more years of dead cap space, and that's by waiving him and sending him to Stockton for one season.

If the Flames don't need the cap space this coming season a demotion might be the best move.

We'll see I guess.

IMO he's below replacement level. Would rather give the minutes to Foo or mangiapane, hathaway or even lazar

I think having a guy at 4.5 on the fourth line is an organizational distraction. There was huge pressure on GG to get Brouwer going the last two years, huge organizational pressure to turn this large expenditure into something resembling a break even ROI. Peters won't be immune to this, no matter what is said publicly, if Brouwer is on the roster, he'll be a distraction.

From what I heard, Tre was looking to move Brouwer at the start of this year. He wasn't willing to waive. This year he'll have a 15 team no trade list and his value is even lower, I'd say significantly lower, than it was even last october.

On the one hand I don't think the Flames can afford to lose any forward off the roster because the depth is so, so, so bad, but on the other hand, I don't see Brouwer addressing that need for depth in any meaningful way. In that sense, worst case scenario he gets hurts and you can't buy him out.

That 1.5 is going to be a pain in the ass for the owners to pay out, but having Brouwer sitting there injured with a no-trade when it comes time to sign Tkachuk might be an even bigger pain.

If the Flames pay through the nose for forward help, which they will have to do barring substantial asset out or miracle trade, they're going to need every dollar of his cap hit they can save in order to do so.

They won't be paying hartley this year, they won't be paying GG like they might have been, and Bouma's buyout is off the books. Buying Brouwer out at 1.5 million with no other buyouts or head coaches to pay might mean the Flames are actually paying out less than they have in previous years for people no longer in the organization.

If Brouwer ISN'T bought out I think it's an indication ownership said no.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I drool at the thought of trading for Kessel and signing Tavares.



I mean holy crap would that be awesome.





Gaudreau - Tavares - Kessel

Tkachuk - Monahan - Foo (or whoever)

Ferland - Backlund - Frolik



or



Tkachuk - Tavares - Kessel

Gaudreau - Monahan - Foo (or whoever)

Ferland - Backlund - Frolik

Yeah I guess they could only afford three lines under that scenario!

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

IMO he's below replacement level. Would rather give the minutes to Foo or mangiapane, hathaway or even lazar

I think having a guy at 4.5 on the fourth line is an organizational distraction. There was huge pressure on GG to get Brouwer going the last two years, huge organizational pressure to turn this large expenditure into something resembling a break even ROI. Peters won't be immune to this, no matter what is said publicly, if Brouwer is on the roster, he'll be a distraction.

From what I heard, Tre was looking to move Brouwer at the start of this year. He wasn't willing to waive. This year he'll have a 15 team no trade list and his value is even lower, I'd say significantly lower, than it was even last october.

On the one hand I don't think the Flames can afford to lose any forward off the roster because the depth is so, so, so bad, but on the other hand, I don't see Brouwer addressing that need for depth in any meaningful way. In that sense, worst case scenario he gets hurts and you can't buy him out.

That 1.5 is going to be a pain in the ass for the owners to pay out, but having Brouwer sitting there injured with a no-trade when it comes time to sign Tkachuk might be an even bigger pain.

If the Flames pay through the nose for forward help, which they will have to do barring substantial asset out or miracle trade, they're going to need every dollar of his cap hit they can save in order to do so.

They won't be paying hartley this year, they won't be paying GG like they might have been, and Bouma's buyout is off the books. Buying Brouwer out at 1.5 million with no other buyouts or head coaches to pay might mean the Flames are actually paying out less than they have in previous years for people no longer in the organization.

If Brouwer ISN'T bought out I think it's an indication ownership said no.

Yeah I remember those rumblings about Brouwer being potentially traded, and then nothing happened. I also remember wondering if it was because he wasn't willing to waive or if the rumors were just wrong. (If there is substance here that you are privy to, I'd love a PM )

Bouma's buy out cap hit actually isn't off the books year. His and Murphy's are both still on for the 2018/19 season and then gone. Combined they are less than $1 million though.

You don't think sending him to Stockton for 1 season to avoid a 4 year buy out penalty is a good option?

I absolutely do not want him on the NHL roster this year, but I also don't want the Flames with $1.5 million of dead cap space for 4 years either.

Tough call.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by edslunch

Yeah I guess they could only afford three lines under that scenario!

Haha. Actually, with Tavares at $10-12 million they would just need to remove any two of Brodie/Stone/Brouwer/Frolik and it works with a full roster and everything!

[Vinny01]

If the Flames make a run at some big free agents then freeing up the $3M on a Brouwer buyout is necessary but if not waiting another year is probably what needs to happen.

They need to strip him of the A right away though and give it to Backlund or Tkachuk.

The Flames have $12.5M of capnsoace right now with mostly lower roster players to replace or re-sign. If the cap goes up $5M they would be at $18.5M with the possibility of $21.5M if Brouwer is bought out.

They could certainly take a run at Tavares with that space or take on a bigger contract like Kessel in a trade.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

They need to strip him of the A right away though and give it to Backlund or Tkachuk.

Agreed. Think Backlund is easy sell after captaining Sweden in the WC which Peters and Ward coached in.

I’d be absolutely shocked if Brouwer was still wearing an A this fall.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

From The Athletic's top 25 buyout candidates , on which Brouwer ranks #1 in the entire league:



Brouwer was awful on the PK, and the PP.

His PP linemates in 17/18:
23.3 BROUWER,TROY - GAUDREAU,JOHNNY - MONAHAN,SEAN - VERSTEEG,KRIS
15.9 BROUWER,TROY - FERLAND,MICHEAL - GAUDREAU,JOHNNY - MONAHAN,SEAN
11.9 BACKLUND,MIKAEL - BENNETT,SAM - BROUWER,TROY
8.3 BROUWER,TROY - GAUDREAU,JOHNNY - MONAHAN,SEAN - TKACHUK,MATTHEW

The majority of his PP time was with the players that would be on PP1.

Troy Brouwer was the worst mainstay player on the Calgary Flames in 2017/2018.

Yeah, but he wasn't on the PP at all from about the 11th game until the second half of the season. Look at his game logs. After he got back on he saw spot duty with the second unit. That percentage you are looking at is only the percentage of his power play time, not the percentage of their PP time. Compare his linemate % to Gaudreau's. Gaudreau played more with Hamilton, Versteeg, Ferland or Tkachuk.

https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/...es=2017-2018:R

https://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/...es=2017-2018:R

PS: I'm starting to question the accuracy of Dobber stats. They give Brouwer at least 1 PP point with Johnny but don't give any PP points for Johnny with Brouwer. That doesn't make sense.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Little article on Valimaki I stumbled across

https://www.nhl.com/flames/news/top-...ki/c-298863870

"You hear what Bill Peters wants on defence and that's Juuso Valimaki," assistant general manager Craig Conroy told CalgaryFlames.com. "It really is.

"I expect him to come in here and really make a push, soon, to make the big club."

"He has a man's body and he's a great skater with offensive instinct," Conroy said. "It's fun to watch guys that are good pros and good people. He's all about the team, all about winning, it's not about him but he knows he has to step up.

"He has the skill and ability to be a difference maker on the back-end, which is hard to find."

I'd be surprised if Valimaki spends all year in the AHL. I think he probably only plays a half season there at most if I had to guess and I wouldn't be shocked if he makes the club out of camp. How close Andersson and Valimaki are is what allows Treliving to trade a defensemen this summer if he wants.

https://www.nhl.com/flames/video/sco...092/c-60513003

[Toonage]

Where are the people telling me I'm being dumb expecting Valimaki to make a push for the team next season? Thats right from the horses mouth

[keenan87]

Trade 1: Sam Bennett + Adam Fox + Michael Frolik for Phil Kessel (only adding $2.5MM in cap this way)

Trade 2: TJ Brodie for Mike Hoffman

CEO of Calgary Flames Entertainment: Brad Treliving
GM: Mark Hunter
President of Calgary Flames: Don Maloney
Assistant GM: Craig Conroy

Coach: Bill Peters
Assistant: Ward, Gelinas, Huska

Gaudreau-Monahan-Kessel
Tkachuk-Jankowski-Hoffman
Ferland-Backlund-Foo
Mangiapane-Shore-Lazar
Hathaway

Hamilton-Hamonic
Andersson-Giordano
Kulak-Stone
Wotherspoon

Smith
Gillies

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Where are the people telling me I'm being dumb expecting Valimaki to make a push for the team next season? Thats right from the horses mouth

I thought he was the best D prospect in camp last year (though understandably not making the team and going back to junior).

[GoJetsGo]

I see Valimaki is listed around 6'2 205 lbs.

Big kid!

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I thought he was the best D prospect in camp last year (though understandably not making the team and going back to junior).

People balked when I said he could move into Brodie's spot. Maybe thats overshooting (Kulak seems more likely if Brodie were to be moved) but those same people clearly haven't watched this kid or followed his progress. Like you said, he looked almost ready out of camp last year.

[Barca]

Originally Posted by keenan87

trade 1: Sam bennett + adam fox + michael frolik for phil kessel (only adding $2.5mm in cap this way)

trade 2: tj brodie for mike hoffman

ceo of calgary flames entertainment: Brad treliving
gm: Mark hunter
president of calgary flames: Don maloney
assistant gm: Craig conroy

coach: Bill peters
assistant: Ward, gelinas, huska

gaudreau-monahan-kessel
tkachuk-jankowski-hoffman
ferland-backlund-foo
mangiapane-shore-lazar
hathaway

hamilton-hamonic
andersson-giordano
kulak-stone
wotherspoon

smith
gillies

wat

[CliffFletcher]

Talk out there of Charlie Coyle being available. Seems like a good fit. Youngish, skilled RHS RW with size. Maybe not the home run some are looking for, but he'd definitely be an improvement over existing options at RW.