I agree 100% but good luck around here. Blows my mind how many people are fine with an expansion team being able to build a cup contender right out of the gate by cherry picking other teams rosters and players they spent years and money and assets on acquiring.
Doesn't really matter what anybody thought before, during or immediately after the process either. It's clear now that they were allowed too much leeway and as a result were able to build too good of a team without having to earn it like every other team has to.
I'll be glad if they knock Winnipeg out, because I don't want any other Canadian based team anywhere near the Stanley Cup besides the Flames. But the NHL should be embarrassed IMO, but they won't be because clearly most of the fans are just lapping it up like a cat on a saucer of milk.
Terrible post: The league let teams PROTECT their best players and young talent and forced Vegas to make a competitive team out of what was left by selecting from everyone else's lesser players. It's, literally, the definition of an anti-stacked deck. To think otherwise is bordering on deliberate cognitive dissonance on how the process works.
The result in Vegas is a surprising irony given the process, not a confirmation that the process was stacked in their favour.
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Yeah as far as the Jets go, I'd agree that it's hard to argue that Scheifele hasn't been their best player by far. Buff has had his moments but that's it. 14 goals in 16 games I think? He's been their MVP.
I dont cheer for vegas the expansion team. I cheer for the players that were given up on by their teams that make up the Knights. It's a good human story.
As for who deserves this or doesnt deserve that? Who cares. You build the best team you can given the circumstances. Just look at the Oilers and Buffalo, both garbage teams that paid their dues. Do you want them to succeed? Id rather see Vegas succeed.
Should we help Vancouver out because they never won? Only fair they get their cup after all these years, right?
I think a lot of GMs over complicated their situations and vegas took advantage of it. Should we feel sorry for Pitts because they gave away MAF? They had another goalie. One that sucked vs Wsh. But they chose to keep him.
Would Florida want a mulligan or two? You bet. They made a huge mistake. Can we blame Vegas? FLA could have offered some other players. But they chose to keep them instead.
Werent we happy that Engelland wanted to go there? We hit a jackpot. Only now we realize that muscle and ledership does mean something. We were all wrong. Blame vegas?
They have earned this run. Good on them.
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I have no beef with Vegas. They've been great hosts, the fans are awesome, and the team is hard working and entertaining. If Tampa wins the East, which they will, the thought of cheering for them against Vegas after memories of 04 makes me sick. And should make everyone here sick. #### Tampa.
That being said Jets aren't eliminated yet and have been the better team the vast majority of the series. Solve Fleury, and get Helleys ####ing game right.
What do you care about '04? Oh were you a "Flames" fan then?
You cheered for Edmonton over Calgary in the POs last year and blabbed about it in the threads. Don't pretend like you're everybody's friend in here or like you're a class act. Your allegiances are really ####ed up.
Also quite an apologist for your team that's about to be eliminated, in a very Edmonton-y way. Vegas has simply executed better, now for 3 straight. Flames also looked like the better team on a lot of nights this year but in the end finish and execution is everything, and we here would all gladly trade that for possession and lots of chances, or "looking" good. Try giving credit where it's due in a way that's not so tongue in cheek.
This is not true. McPhee's draft selections were panned by a number of pretentious fans and a few in the media, but otherwise outside opinions were fairly strong that he made astute player acquisitions and deals, and handled the whole process very well.
“Pretentious fans”... You have dialed it up a notch lately, how come? Not slamming you here, just thinking a mod on a fan site would have a higher opinion of fans in general.
What I recall is people wondering why McPhee overloaded on D. Those who thought he did a good job believed that he had made some good moves for the future, vs. being even sneaky good this year.
Anyway no expansion team in my memory has had a goalie play this well. And in the NHL, that can mean instant contender.
In another note, everyone seems to be talking a lot about playing with a chip on their shoulder because they are a team of castoffs. How is that different than every single expansion team in the history of sports? That hasn’t seemed to make such a difference before.
What do you care about '04? Oh were you a "Flames" fan then?
You cheered for Edmonton over Calgary in the POs last year and blabbed about it in the threads. Don't pretend like you're everybody's friend in here or like you're a class act. Your allegiances are really ####ed up.
Also quite an apologist for your team that's about to be eliminated, in a very Edmonton-y way. Vegas has simply executed better, now for 3 straight. Flames also looked like the better team on a lot of nights this year but in the end finish and execution is everything, and we here would all gladly trade that for possession and lots of chances, or "looking" good. Try giving credit where it's due in a way that's not so tongue in cheek.
I dont cheer for vegas the expansion team. I cheer for the players that were given up on by their teams that make up the Knights. It's a good human story.
As for who deserves this or doesnt deserve that? Who cares. You build the best team you can given the circumstances. Just look at the Oilers and Buffalo, both garbage teams that paid their dues. Do you want them to succeed? Id rather see Vegas succeed.
Should we help Vancouver out because they never won? Only fair they get their cup after all these years, right?
I think a lot of GMs over complicated their situations and vegas took advantage of it. Should we feel sorry for Pitts because they gave away MAF? They had another goalie. One that sucked vs Wsh. But they chose to keep him.
Would Florida want a mulligan or two? You bet. They made a huge mistake. Can we blame Vegas? FLA could have offered some other players. But they chose to keep them instead.
Werent we happy that Engelland wanted to go there? We hit a jackpot. Only now we realize that muscle and ledership does mean something. We were all wrong. Blame vegas?
They have earned this run. Good on them.
Agree with a lot here but Engelland was appreciated by a lot here.
This makes no sense. If they win the cup they've earned it. The NHL didn't give Vegas some all star team. They have defied all the odds with great management, coaching, and players stepping up.
Congratulations to Vegas if the win the cup, and full marks to those players, coaches, and management for doing what they needed to do to get the job done. No negativity whatsoever directed toward VGK or their fans. On that point we agree.
However, my frustration is with the NHL and the format with which it allowed Vegas to pick players. They got to hand pick a roster from basically the entire pool of players in the NHL except for 7 forwards, 3 defencemen, and a goalie from each team, so there were plenty of opportunities to pick quality players from deep teams.
Can we stop pretending that the Knights aren't an elite team with elite players? They are, without a doubt, an elite team with elite players. They are 5 wins away from being crowned the best team in the NHL. Look, every team that makes the playoffs has quality players, quality coaching, and plays extremely hard. To pretend that Vegas has a significant leg-up on the rest of the league in terms of effort, coaching, and team chemistry, is a bit naive I think. Every team that makes the playoffs has plenty of those things. The thing that ultimately separates the truly elite teams from the rest of the teams is talent. Vegas is oozing with talent. They got that talent by hand-picking it off the rosters of the rest of the NHL. Now they have (possibly) the best team in the NHL. It doesn't sit well with me and I don't see why it should.
And before you say well the NHL couldn't have foreseen this happening... well, it is their job to fully think through policies before they implement them. This expansion process was just plain unfair to the rest of the teams in the league.
Vegas just keeps coming back, even when dominated. It is SO disheartening to dominate a team that much in a period, then religiously give up a goal on the few shots they have. The Jets need more guys going than just Scheifele, though at least Laine got one. Where is Stastny and all this balanced attack we hear about? Winnipeg needs to have this urgency in periods 1 and 2. I think this series might be over. Sucks..... was fully cheering for Winnipeg as I find the Vegas shtick really annoying by now- including how Bettman bent over backwards to make them successful.
I can respect the Knights player's story in this though- even if it is isn't totally true that all of these guys were truly cast-offs. Even if something isn't true, believing in the underdog role galvanizes a team.... I could probably get behind Vegas if they play the bolts because, let's face it, **** Tampa Bay. If it's WSH then I am cheering for the Caps, though I think VGK wins that one. Might be time to start coming to terms with this. I am sure the little weasel Bettman is salivating over this...
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The same players teams deemed expendable and left them unprotected?
If a ghost appears in front of you and says that you can save all of your children except for one, and you must choose one to be sacrificed, would you consider your one lost child "expendable"?
... no expansion team in my memory has had a goalie play this well. And in the NHL, that can mean instant contender.
In another note, everyone seems to be talking a lot about playing with a chip on their shoulder because they are a team of castoffs. How is that different than every single expansion team in the history of sports? That hasn’t seemed to make such a difference before.
I agree. This is why I tend to think the events to start the season which galvanized the team and the city played a huge part. This was brought up again in the Engelland pre-game piece.
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Originally Posted by woob
"...harem warfare? like all your wives dressup and go paintballing?"
If a ghost appears in front of you and says that you can save all of your children except for one, and you must choose one to be sacrificed, would you consider your one lost child "expendable"?
If a ghost appears in front of you and says that you can save all of your children except for one, and you must choose one to be sacrificed, would you consider your one lost child "expendable"?
Damn. I didn't know the players that got chosen in the expansion draft were all murdered.
But they came back as ghosts to play for Knights? Is that what you are saying? Doesn't seem fair to have an NHL team full of ghosts.
Anyways, I've got a better question for you. There's a bomb on a bus. Once the bus goes 50 miles an hour, the bomb is armed. If it drops below 50, it blows up. What do you do? What do you do?
Admittedly I've only watched probably 1/3rd of the time, so maybe I've just caught the wrong parts, but the periods I've watched there's been a ton of stretches where Vegas is on their heels, giving up chance after chance, Fleury makes 3 or 4 ten-bell saves, and then they go the other way and score on their one shot. IMO Winnipeg has comfortably out-played them outside of Fleury being at a .945 and Hellebuyck at .868, and I thought SJ was the better team after game 1.
Admittedly, the Jets have been a better team than the Vegas Knights as the games wore on. However, the Knights were able to capitalize on the turnovers on even strength plays. In addition, Fleury is definitely putting his heart out and keeping the Jets at bay. With any other team, the Jets would have swept the series. The Jets team is big and fast, but the Golden Knights are, time and time again, RESILIENT. Whenever the Jets score, they're able to score back the next goal to keep the leads in a short period of time.
The Jets are definitely the best of the final 4 teams, but when it comes to Vegas, bet on the Golden Knights A little luck goes a long ways sometimes.
A little luck goes a long ways sometimes.
