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Old 02-27-2018, 09:46 PM   #1
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- Flames dominate but can't finish
- Gillies solid
- Stewart meh
- powerplay oh for
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Old 02-27-2018, 09:56 PM   #2
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I thought the Flames PP looked good early as they were generating chances and maintaining the offensive zone. Maybe later it looked more disjointed but that was likely because they were frustrated with the outstanding goaltending and were trying to do too much.

Stewart looked mostly unnoticeable outside of his few one touch passes that he was trying to feed his linemates on. I thought it worked on the Monahan chance but after that it was a little too cute and mostly ineffective. He's nice to have, for free, as he is likely an upgrade on Hathaway and anyone on the 4th line but he isn't going to be a saviour of any sorts.

Frustrating game, Hitchcock coached teams usually result in such. Especially when the goalie is on another level like Bishop was tonight.
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Old 02-28-2018, 12:10 AM   #3
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I am seeing a trend which is the opposite of the 14-15 Hartley campaign. Then it was winning, with a bunch of explanation how it was lucky and not sustainable. This year it is too many shoddy results with a bunch of excuses letting us know that advanced stats indicate domination of play and bad luck.

Then they were under dogs playing fast and with heart. The find a way Flames. Now they often play slow when they have possession and particularly when they are not on the rush.

Maybe we need to look at the assumptions behind the stats more so than drawing conclusions. There are far, far too many games where the stats are defied to warrant giving said stats such merit.
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Old 02-28-2018, 12:20 AM   #4
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Ya it's so weird how we have
- better Goaltending
- a better Gaudreau
- have added Hamonic
- Tkachuk no sophomore slump
- a coach that has had a year to deploy and teach his system
- basically zero injuries on defense.

.....and we are literally no better then we were last season.

Can anyone else explain that for me? Because it is mind boggling.
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Old 02-28-2018, 04:47 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by Samonadreau View Post
Ya it's so weird how we have
- better Goaltending
- a better Gaudreau
- have added Hamonic
- Tkachuk no sophomore slump
- a coach that has had a year to deploy and teach his system
- basically zero injuries on defense.

.....and we are literally no better then we were last season.

Can anyone else explain that for me? Because it is mind boggling.
I think Frolik and Backlund taking a step back this yr and not having Versteeg for essentially all season has hurt the team.

Backs and Fro are our top 2-way guys and outside of the PK they haven't looked the same as last year in regards to offensive contributions. When you shut down a line its good but when you shut down a line and score on them it's great!

A healthy Versteeg would probably have went along way in helping solidify our top 9 while also strengthening our 4th line with Hathaway being bumped down. To be fair to your argument our top nine had holes in it last year as well since Jankowski wasn't here so maybe this aspect would be a wash even though Versteeg had a strong season for us last yr.

Whatever the reason is it seems the team isn't improving as a whole.

I feel a team with Gaudreau, Monahan, Tkachuk, Backlund, Ferland, Frolik, Bennett and Jankowski up front, with Hamilton, Gio, Brodie and Hamonic on D and Smith in net should be better than this.

But when you take everything in to account it somewhat makes sense. Bennett and Jankowski are struggling to maintain consistency as young guys, Ferland has been hot and cold, we need more depth upfront and most importantly is there really is only 2 top end teams in the West.

Nashville and Winnipeg look legit while Vegas is having a Cinderella season but outside that the rest of the teams are all bunched up and it will be a battle to the end.
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Old 02-28-2018, 04:57 AM   #6
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Team gets a little bit better. Just not enough to be more then a bubble team, because rest of the West is improving faster. There was no Vegas last year. Winnipeg was not as good. Avs were atrocious. If you are not moving forward, you will be dead end really soon. It's what happened to Oilers: they put all of their post season effort into locking McDavid and Draisaitl, but they forgot to solidify the depth around them. Their team doesn't look weaker, but the competition got better.
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Old 02-28-2018, 06:55 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Samonadreau View Post
Ya it's so weird how we have
- better Goaltending
- a better Gaudreau
- have added Hamonic
- Tkachuk no sophomore slump
- a coach that has had a year to deploy and teach his system
- basically zero injuries on defense.

.....and we are literally no better then we were last season.

Can anyone else explain that for me? Because it is mind boggling.
Glen Gulutzan.
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Old 02-28-2018, 07:29 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by DeluxeMoustache View Post
I am seeing a trend which is the opposite of the 14-15 Hartley campaign. Then it was winning, with a bunch of explanation how it was lucky and not sustainable. This year it is too many shoddy results with a bunch of excuses letting us know that advanced stats indicate domination of play and bad luck.

Then they were under dogs playing fast and with heart. The find a way Flames. Now they often play slow when they have possession and particularly when they are not on the rush.

Maybe we need to look at the assumptions behind the stats more so than drawing conclusions. There are far, far too many games where the stats are defied to warrant giving said stats such merit.
So you're telling me the eye test didn't match the advanced stats last night?

The Flames took the game over in the second period and held that edge all the way to the buzzer in the third.

What game were you watching?

This isn't hocus pocus, it's a team that gets great chances but can't finish.
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Old 02-28-2018, 07:32 AM   #9
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I thought the flames played ok yesterday, but missed the net way too much, took too many penalties, and not generating much on the 5 on 3 was tough.

I liked the flames taking a flyer on Stewart, I didn't like the move to put him immediately on the top line. This coaching staffs player utilization has been quite ridiculous, so it's not a surprise.

Anyways, back at it tonight.
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Old 02-28-2018, 07:40 AM   #10
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So you're telling me the eye test didn't match the advanced stats last night?

The Flames took the game over in the second period and held that edge all the way to the buzzer in the third.

What game were you watching?

This isn't hocus pocus, it's a team that gets great chances but can't finish.
They generated decent chances. But that was hardly an outstanding effort. Bishop made a few great saves and a bunch of routine ones. They need to do more. It's not bad luck, it's chances that aren't really chances. Did bishop have to even move? Seemed like he just stood there waiting for muffin shots.
Decent game but lacked desperation. Tuned to the SJ and LA games and those teams were flying.
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Old 02-28-2018, 07:51 AM   #11
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Perhaps not the thread for it, but here goes...

Last night’s loss stings, especially with the out of town results. The way I see it, the next 7 game stretch will make or break the season. With the exception of the Pittsburgh game, all 7 games are winnable, and they’ll need all the points they can get because after that, the schedule gets really tough. If they don’t come through the next 7 with at least 10 points, I think it’s over.
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Old 02-28-2018, 07:56 AM   #12
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They generated decent chances. But that was hardly an outstanding effort. Bishop made a few great saves and a bunch of routine ones. They need to do more. It's not bad luck, it's chances that aren't really chances. Did bishop have to even move? Seemed like he just stood there waiting for muffin shots.
Decent game but lacked desperation. Tuned to the SJ and LA games and those teams were flying.
We saw different games then.

-I saw a Monahan breakaway
-A Jankowski breakaway where he shoots wide
-A two on one short handed where Bishop made back to back saves
-A short handed tip by Brodie that he swallowed up.
-Tkachuk point blank with seconds on the clock.
-And numerous mad scrambles and tips in the slot that went just wide or into Bishop

Oh and two independent web sites had the scoring chances in the 17-7 range for the Flames, there is that.
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:00 AM   #13
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losing Smith on a nothing play with a couple of secs left on the clock may end up being the single play that determines this season for the flames...

screw all the talk about BT not acquiring a scorer at the deadline... 3-5 since the Smith injury, easily should be 5-3...

the moaners won't even cut the team even for a injury to their starting goalie...
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:07 AM   #14
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losing Smith on a nothing play with a couple of secs left on the clock may end up being the single play that determines this season for the flames...

screw all the talk about BT not acquiring a scorer at the deadline... 3-5 since the Smith injury, easily should be 5-3...

the moaners won't even cut the team even for a injury to their starting goalie...
Thats a bit unfair. The goalie kids have given the team decent chances in every game but 1.
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:17 AM   #15
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Thats a bit unfair. The goalie kids have given the team decent chances in every game but 1.
still pinning our hopes one two raw rookies in the NHL...

not blaming the kids for anything: they've done yeoman's work. But they aren't Mike Smith either.

reading all the grousing from certain posters without at least acknowledging the bind the Smith injury has put calgary in is what's unfair imo
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:26 AM   #16
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So you're telling me the eye test didn't match the advanced stats last night?.
I would say that Bishop had a dominant game, but overall the Stars did look more well-positioned and defensively sharp, tighter and faster through the neutral zone, and with their own share of dangerous shots nearly trickling through only to be foiled by posts. I wouldn't say the Flames skaters clearly deserved to win or lose last night. The Stars also sat on a lead for much of the game which tends to affect these stats.
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:35 AM   #17
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We saw different games then.

-I saw a Monahan breakaway
-A Jankowski breakaway where he shoots wide
-A two on one short handed where Bishop made back to back saves
-A short handed tip by Brodie that he swallowed up.
-Tkachuk point blank with seconds on the clock.
-And numerous mad scrambles and tips in the slot that went just wide or into Bishop

Oh and two independent web sites had the scoring chances in the 17-7 range for the Flames, there is that.
Perhaps this is where the difference is. I saw the very same game and also saw those same 5 chances. I did not however look at any websites with the stats.

So I stand by my take, a few good chances and a bunch of meh. Dallas had a few good chances as well, scored 2 and tried to shut it down in the 3rd so they didn't need to take any risks. That's the game I saw.

Did the Flames have an edge? Not in the early going. In the third when the Stars were shutting it down? Sure. But still, my point is that the Flames played a bit passive. Desperate times call for desperate measures and this team did not push hard enough. Not winning many games in March with this effort.
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:35 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by Samonadreau View Post
Ya it's so weird how we have
- better Goaltending
- a better Gaudreau
- have added Hamonic
- Tkachuk no sophomore slump
- a coach that has had a year to deploy and teach his system
- basically zero injuries on defense.

.....and we are literally no better then we were last season.

Can anyone else explain that for me? Because it is mind boggling.
Part of it, I think, is overtime/coin toss records.

Last year the flames were something like 10 games above 500 in extra time. 14-4 maybe? Something like that.

I checked this year and I think they are 9-9 if my limited math holds up.
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:36 AM   #19
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It sure feels like a lot of “they were visually better” talk lately. It’s a .500 team that ran into a hot goalie, it’s not like it was an undeserved loss. A dumb late penalty put them in the 2-0 hole and that was that. Thankfully they’re one of the better teams when it comes to back to back games so I fully expect them to come out tonight and win.
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Old 02-28-2018, 08:36 AM   #20
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I would say that Bishop had a dominant game, but overall the Stars did look more well-positioned and defensively sharp, tighter and faster through the neutral zone, and with their own share of dangerous shots nearly trickling through only to be foiled by posts. I wouldn't say the Flames skaters clearly deserved to win or lose last night. The Stars also sat on a lead for much of the game which tends to affect these stats.
Score effects certainly play a role, but they don't change what I said ... the eye test matched the stats. The Flames controlled the last 35 minutes of the game.

And the Stars had 7 scoring chances the whole night in all situations, four of them five on five. So "nearly trickling through only to be foiled by posts" are included in the 7 and 4.

If you give up four five on five scoring chances on a night you win a huge majority of the time.

Score adjusted the Flames were 58.5% of shot attempts and 67% of the scoring chances.

The Flames played well.
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