[News] Islanders arena bid selected for Belmont Park

[sureLoss]

https://www.newsday.com/sports/hocke...ampaign=buffer

The Islanders’ proposal to build a new arena at Belmont Park was selected as the winning bid, according to people familiar with the situation.

A news conference is scheduled for Wednesday morning at the racetrack in which Gov. Andrew M. Cuomo is expected to be on hand.

The Islanders’ bid includes an 18,000-seat, year-round arena that would host 150 events annually as well as 435,000-square feet of space for retail, a hotel with 200 to 250 rooms and a 10,000-square foot “innovation center” that would be developed with resident input.

The Islanders partners in the development include Sterling Project Development, a real estate firm run by the Mets’ Wilpon family, and Oak View Group, an arena development company partially funded by Madison Square Garden.

The proposal was selected over New York City FC, a professional soccer team partially owned by the Yankees. That bid called for a 26,000-seat open-air stadium in addition to 400,000 square-feet of space for retail, a 5.2-acre community park and a 2-acre soccer facility.

The Islanders left Nassau Coliseum in 2015 to play home games at Brooklyn’s Barclays Center.

Islanders co-owner Jon Ledecky has said the team will continue to play at Barclays Center through next season as they are contractually obligated to do.

Tavares extension next?

[dash_pinched]

I can't seem to find any info regarding funding proposals (i.e. is public money being allocated towards the building of this new arena for the Isles?)

[getbak]

Here are the two proposals: https://www.newsday.com/sports/belmo...cfc-1.15517487

This should be a good move for the Islanders. It's much closer to the core of their fanbase (only about 7 miles from Nassau Coliseum) and is directly adjacent to the railway station, which will make it easier to get to from the city.


If they have one more season in Brooklyn, I wonder where they'll play for the one or two additional years that it will take to build this? Extend their stay in Brooklyn, or move back to the smaller, but renovated Nassau Coliseum?



This Oak View Group seems to know how to get things done (they're also behind the new deal in Seattle). Maybe the Flames need to partner up with them.

[sureLoss]

Originally Posted by dash_pinched

I can't seem to find any info regarding funding proposals (i.e. is public money being allocated towards the building of this new arena for the Isles?)

I think the full details will be released tomorrow.

The land is owned by the State of New York.

[Erick Estrada]

I suppose 18K is the standard capacity for new arenas these days. Even in a new location I can't see them getting 18k per game attendance. I don't see what's wrong with say 16k capacity for markets like this as if they ever get to a point where the tickets are in demand they can simply raise prices.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I suppose 18K is the standard capacity for new arenas these days. Even in a new location I can't see them getting 18k per game attendance. I don't see what's wrong with say 16k capacity for markets like this as if they ever get to a point where the tickets are in demand they can simply raise prices.

They may want the capacity for some of the other events they'd like to host. I can't imagine the construction costs or even the maintenance costs from going from 16K to 18K are really all that much, so might as well build it bigger than your main tenant might need.

[Table 5]

Long Island has over 7 million people. It can more than support an 18k stadium.

I found Islanders fans to be one of the more knowledgable and passionate of anyone in the US. As long as the team isn't a complete joke like it was for a good 2 decades there, they won't have issues filling this stadium....especially now that this building will be back on their turf again (there are plenty of Long Islanders who just don't go into the City, period).

[playmaker]

Ken King please read

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Cleveland Steam Whistle

They may want the capacity for some of the other events they'd like to host. I can't imagine the construction costs or even the maintenance costs from going from 16K to 18K are really all that much, so might as well build it bigger than your main tenant might need.

Yeah, it's easier to tarp over 2000 seats you can't sell than it is to try and cram an additional 2000 people into a building when you need the extra capacity.

If you think about it, most arenas have about 30 sections around the seating bowl, with about 20 seats per section, per row. That means one extra row is about 600 extra seats. 4 extra rows easily covers 2000 more seats.


Also, with a new, modern arena that is in a location that's easily accessible both by car and by train and close to their traditional fanbase, there's no reason to think they shouldn't be able to regularly draw in the 17-18,000 range.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Long Island has over 7 million people. It can more than support an 18k stadium.

I found Islanders fans to be one of the more knowledgable and passionate of anyone in the US. As long as the team isn't a complete joke like it was for a good 2 decades there, they won't have issues filling this stadium....especially now that this building will be back on their turf again (there are plenty of Long Islanders who just don't go into the City, period).

Can you provide evidence they have ever supported the Islanders to the tune of 18k? Hard to say without any doubt a fan base that's never put an average of 16k into a building even when they were winning Stanley Cups can do 18k.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Can you provide evidence they have ever supported the Islanders to the tune of 18k? Hard to say without any doubt a fan base that's never put an average of 16k into a building even when they were winning Stanley Cups can do 18k.

That's impossible, just like you can't prove they wouldn't have had that level of support if they had an appropriate venue. They've never played in an arena with that capacity. They were selling the place out when they were winning Cups.

The Nassau Coliseum was a cramped dump. Its concourse reminded me of McMahon Stadium with less room. Imagine if the Corral had twice the capacity, with the same concourse. Add on top of that, the closest railway station was 2.5 miles from the arena.

[Coach]

The Islanders are like the Mets. Not the same type of support as their more famous brethren (Yankees/Rangers) but those that support them are diehard fans. It would be sad to see them move, I'm glad a deal is getting worked out.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by getbak

That's impossible, just like you can't prove they wouldn't have had that level of support if they had an appropriate venue. They've never played in an arena with that capacity. They were selling the place out when they were winning Cups.

The Nassau Coliseum was a cramped dump. Its concourse reminded me of McMahon Stadium with less room. Imagine if the Corral had twice the capacity, with the same concourse. Add on top of that, the closest railway station was 2.5 miles from the arena.

You are correct but history supports my argument better seeing that market has never filled a smaller arena. I watch a lot of sports and all I see is plenty of empty seats in the NHL, NFL, NBA, etc and I feel MLB and the CFL are ahead of the curve in making reducing capacities in newer facilities as the landscape is changing with HD TV and internet streaming. I personally don't believe the Islanders could ever sell out an 18k building on a regular basis. Even the Rangers aren't putting 18k in MSG. Winnipeg's arena is still a little on the small side but the plus is that atmosphere is much better than most larger buildings with thousands of empty seats.

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Table 5

Long Island has over 7 million people. It can more than support an 18k stadium.

I found Islanders fans to be one of the more knowledgable and passionate of anyone in the US. As long as the team isn't a complete joke like it was for a good 2 decades there, they won't have issues filling this stadium....especially now that this building will be back on their turf again (there are plenty of Long Islanders who just don't go into the City, period).

I think you explained this to me before, so I apologize for asking. Is Brooklyn considered "the City" and not part of Long Island?

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Yes but all I see is plenty of empty seats in the NHL, NFL, NBA, etc and I feel MLB and the CFL are ahead of the curve in making reducing capacities in newer facilities as the landscape is changing with HD TV and internet streaming. I personally don't believe the Islanders could ever sell out an 18k building on a regular basis. Even the Rangers aren't putting 18k in MSG. Winnipeg's arena is still a little on the small side but the plus is that atmosphere is much better than most larger buildings with thousands of empty seats.

Yeah but I think the point is more the other events than the Islanders. Let's say the Islanders draw 15-16k for most of the season with probable sell outs for playoffs. That revenue is made up by the extra 3000 seats they get for concerts and other events that they will get which Nassau never had.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by MattyC

Yeah but I think the point is more the other events than the Islanders. Let's say the Islanders draw 15-16k for most of the season with probable sell outs for playoffs. That revenue is made up by the extra 3000 seats they get for concerts and other events that they will get which Nassau never had.

I suppose but when I look at markets like Detroit and New Jersey there's just no atmosphere in these buildings.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I suppose but when I look at markets like Detroit and New Jersey there's just no atmosphere in these buildings.

Yeah well that's a bit of a different question. Smaller venues will always seem/be more intimate and fun and rowdy (not just for sports). I agree that gets lost with bigger stadiums, particularly if they are only 2/3 full. But the stadiums need to make money, and if the Islanders aren't the only tenant (and actually a potential revenue negative like they are at Barclays), they need to make up that revenue with extra capacity for other events.

[Table 5]

Originally Posted by troutman

I think you explained this to me before, so I apologize for asking. Is Brooklyn considered "the City" and not part of Long Island?

There's no hard boundary, but yes in general Brooklyn is considered to be part of the city, even though it's physically on Long island itself. There's also Queens between it and the rest of Long Island, which is another heavily populated (but less dense) city borough.

Assuming you asked because of Barclays Center? The problem with Brooklyn (and the city in general) is that it's an accessibility and parking nightmare for cars. Long Island is the epitome of sprawl...it's huge and was developed in a time where car was king. So for many people if they can't drive to it, they won't go. Even getting to it by train (which is actually pretty efficient), still takes a lot of time from many parts of the island, especially when you consider the traffic nightmares on a weeknight when hockey games take place. How often would you go watch a hockey game if you had to travel to Red Deer or Edmonton on a Tuesday?

Belmont Park may technically still be in Queens, but it's way more accessible to the average resident there.

[topfiverecords]

Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Yes! Wooooooo!

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Table 5

There's no hard boundary, but yes in general Brooklyn is considered to be part of the city, even though it's physically on Long island itself. There's also Queens between it and the rest of Long Island, which is another heavily populated (but less dense) city borough.

Assuming you asked because of Barclays Center? The problem with Brooklyn (and the city in general) is that it's an accessibility and parking nightmare for cars. Long Island is the epitome of sprawl...it's huge and was developed in a time where car was king. So for many people if they can't drive to it, they won't go. Even getting to it by train (which is actually pretty efficient), still takes a lot of time from many parts of the island, especially when you consider the traffic nightmares on a weeknight when hockey games take place. How often would you go watch a hockey game if you had to travel to Red Deer or Edmonton on a Tuesday?

Belmont Park may technically still be in Queens, but it's way more accessible to the average resident there.

The ride was certainly nowhere near as long as a trip to red deer as you suggest. Trains from the Island run frequently and most are well outfitted with plenty of individual seats and room if you compare them to the shabby LRT cars we use in Calgary or even standard subway cars in Manhattan.

With that said, I agree that the current location is not ideal for the franchise and they should be back on the Island where they can draw more effectively from the local populous.