Cinemascore is pretty simple...it’s a poll of people who wanted to see the movie what they thought of it. So it’s not shocking it would skew high compared critics. It’s also why a bad movie, or one you think is bad, would get a high rating....people pretty much know what they enjoy. So of the Star Wars fans, who at this point in the saga are the only ones watching the movie, 90% liked it.
I’ll taje that over random uncontrolled polls.
Note that doesn’t mean they loved the movie or thought it was super duper good, it means they liked it.
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Going back a few pages but why is the Kamikaze scene so hard to believe? The rebels do not have unlimited ships or people to sacrifice...even at its peak it was always a small guriella group, hoping planet to planet.
I saw the act as a desperate move, to save the very last of the rebels.
If the rebels space rammed all the ships, they would probably lose the entire alliance while barely scratching the First Order. Just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you use it.
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Going back a few pages but why is the Kamikaze scene so hard to believe? The rebels do not have unlimited ships or people to sacrifice...even at its peak it was always a small guriella group, hoping planet to planet.
I saw the act as a desperate move, to save the very last of the rebels.
If the rebels space rammed all the ships, they would probably lose the entire alliance while barely scratching the First Order. Just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you use it.
But why didn’t they other ships do it !! They just ran out of gas and sat there and died. Literally ANYTHING would be better . Drive in a different direction , kamikazee into them..... anything but run out of gas and float till you’re shot . Especially when you know you can’t make it to the planet they are trying to get too
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Going back a few pages but why is the Kamikaze scene so hard to believe? The rebels do not have unlimited ships or people to sacrifice...even at its peak it was always a small guriella group, hoping planet to planet.
I saw the act as a desperate move, to save the very last of the rebels.
If the rebels space rammed all the ships, they would probably lose the entire alliance while barely scratching the First Order. Just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you use it.
There have been multiple times where the rebels were "trapped" and taking very heavy losses.... Including in this film, through that whole chase. They could have sacrificed one ship to save ten, any of those times.
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So after a day of thinking about this I think that outside of the Casino planet this was a really good movie. They absolutely nailed Rey, Kylo and Luke.
The fault of Snokes death not being meaningful is really on the Force Awakens as that is the movie where that needed to be established instead of playing "Lost" with the mystery. Imagine how much more powerful Luke's betrayal of Ren would have been if you had seen some of Snoke converting Ren and Luke trying to save him with the key scene missing. Have a little more Snoke early giving him an anchor in the universe.
So the Last Jedi with a better prequel would be better recieved today.
So after a day of thinking about this I think that outside of the Casino planet this was a really good movie. They absolutely nailed Rey, Kylo and Luke.
The fault of Snokes death not being meaningful is really on the Force Awakens as that is the movie where that needed to be established instead of playing "Lost" with the mystery. Imagine how much more powerful Luke's betrayal of Ren would have been if you had seen some of Snoke converting Ren and Luke trying to save him with the key scene missing. Have a little more Snoke early giving him an anchor in the universe.
So the Last Jedi with a better prequel would be better recieved today.
Agree. Everyone is getting very nitpicky, but I think that a lot of frustration comes from the Casino scenes, and the forced Rose storyline. Utterly pointless.
Here we are, watching the first half of the Godfather... and then a 30 minute Three Stooges short... and then back to the Godfather. Only Curly shows up to save Moe from saving the universe later on, for some reason.
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But why didn’t they other ships do it !! They just ran out of gas and sat there and died. Literally ANYTHING would be better . Drive in a different direction , kamikazee into them..... anything but run out of gas and float till you’re shot . Especially when you know you can’t make it to the planet they are trying to get too
Quote:
Originally Posted by blankall
There have been multiple times where the rebels were "trapped" and taking very heavy losses.... Including in this film, through that whole chase. They could have sacrificed one ship to save ten, any of those times.
At the same time just because something has never been done doesn’t mean it can’t be done.
If the movie makers are constrained by only what has been done in past movies then these movies might as well just be remakes. What made the OT so great was that it was all fresh ideas and things never seen before. People weren’t yelling “It’s impossible for a human with no special powers to survive being entrapped in carbonite”.
As I mentioned previously the issue of it never being done before would have more weight if it was a planned strategy or if it was mentioned as an option but it wasn’t. It was clearly a moment of desperation, where there were no other options, the ship was going to be lost anyways, and she was willing to sacrifice herself and the ship to save the few final members of the rebellion.
It's by far the worst scene in the movie. Cinematically, very very cool, but it completely rips apart the rules of the Star Wars universe.
Why didn't anyone think of doing that against the death star in ROTJ? Especially when the half completed death star was decimating Rebel cruisers - surely one of them would've just FTL rammed it and won the fight.
The A-wing that smashed into the bridge of the super star destroyer might as well have just light-speed battering ram and taken out a lot more than just the flagship.
Why didn't they do that in Yavin 4? Why even have this long convoluted scene with Luke Skywalker when you could've just FTL rammed it with 10 Xwings and called it a day?
Because it's basic lightspeed technology, you could say this for literally any fight that's ever happened in star wars including the prequels. It tears apart the suspension of belief in the world that they have created when rules change for no reason.
I don’t see how they changed rules. Technically this was always possible - basic sci fi rules are that you need to take time to plot a course that doesn’t hit something, so deliberately hitting something was always possible. Why didn’t they do it in earlier battles? Who knows. Why didn’t she do it earlier in the same sequence, when she already knew she was going to die? Maybe she literally just thought of it. Or maybe it was against the code and this was the point it shifted to total war. Whatever, it happened, but it doesn’t cheapen the other movies. You can look back at any movie and say what if but what’s the point.
Going back a few pages but why is the Kamikaze scene so hard to believe? The rebels do not have unlimited ships or people to sacrifice...even at its peak it was always a small guriella group, hoping planet to planet.
I saw the act as a desperate move, to save the very last of the rebels.
If the rebels space rammed all the ships, they would probably lose the entire alliance while barely scratching the First Order. Just because you can do something, doesn’t mean you use it.
Even in the first scene of the movie, rather than losing all their bombers, numerous A/Xwings, support ships and all that, they could've just used one of the support ships to light speed ram the dreadnaught.
In the long chase scene, they showed everyone basically evacuated the medical frigate - basically have them do that and light speed ram!
It's fine that it's a deus ex machina and a complete change to the rules of star wars just to create a beautiful scene, but that's exactly what it is. I don't like it but I don't hold anything against anyone that suggests plot/cinema > continuity of the world. I personally just feel more immersed when I feel like I understand the world and how the characters interact within it, which is why I hate that scene, but really love the rest of the movie.
Even TFA respected the rules of hyperspace by going into a long explanation about "sub-hyperspace" tech that they developed that could make this exact thing happen (for starkiller base's weapons). TLJ didn't even try.
I don’t see how they changed rules. Technically this was always possible - basic sci fi rules are that you need to take time to plot a course that doesn’t hit something, so deliberately hitting something was always possible. Why didn’t they do it in earlier battles? Who knows. Why didn’t she do it earlier in the same sequence, when she already knew she was going to die? Maybe she literally just thought of it. Or maybe it was against the code and this was the point it shifted to total war. Whatever, it happened, but it doesn’t cheapen the other movies. You can look back at any movie and say what if but what’s the point.
Plus, it was super cool.
Edited. Upon further reflection they've basically taken liberties at everything that was the Star Wars universe at this point. Whatever. Enjoy the cool scene.
Saw it for the second time tonight. Going into it and not liking it gave me a Chance to try and appreciate it from a different perspective. It’s not a bad movie, but it’s definitely disappointing. I don’t hate what they did, I hate what they didn’t do. I feel like it was just a huge wasted opportunity.
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This movie was pretty trash. From obvious demographic pandering to cowardly avoiding any real tragedy, weight or tension, the movie failed on pretty much every level that mattered. Besides Kylo Ren pretty much every character from the first film felt kind of pointless. Straight up disappointment. Without the last act this movie is almost as bad as the prequels. And oh god, that Leia forcing back from space scene. Epic cringe.
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I saw it tonight and I'm...I don't know. It was 'ok'. I didn't feel any rush of excitement with it. I am not already planning a second trip back to see it (which put it just above ep's 1-3...). I honestly kind of found it overlong and uninteresting.
The only scene that really got me going was watching the Falcon fly around the salt mine (though I thought that the Lightspeed Battering Ram was kinda cool, all the while snickering at it).
I may need to mull this a bit and see where I end up with it.
Man, some of you guys are overthinking this stuff a little too much, lol. Let's not forget that these movies are basically fairy tale adventures about space wizards, talking robots with human personalities, alien creatures, cool spaceships, and a magical religion, all framed by your basic good vs. evil/ hero's journey style plot. If you're looking for logic or realism in the Star Wars universe, then perhaps these movies aren't for you.
The Last Jedi isn't a perfect movie by any means, and there are certainly moments in the film that bugged me a little. But it's still a highly entertaining and enjoyable romp, and a worthy addition to the franchise in my opinion. I'm eagerly looking forward to the final chapter.
Oh not this old argument
Your realize every critique being given here is by Star Wars fans and in relation to other Star Wars movies that are also fairy tale adventures, space wizards, talking robots, magical religion etc...
People are judging the movie within that world and for a lot of us there were major issues that fell below expectations when compared to other Star Wars moves.
If you're looking for a thread where everyone agrees about everything and sings the praises of every scene, then perhaps movie review threads aren't for you.
Your realize every critique being given here is by Star Wars fans and in relation to other Star Wars movies that are also fairy tale adventures, space wizards, talking robots, magical religion etc...
People are judging the movie within that world and for a lot of us there were major issues that fell below expectations when compared to other Star Wars moves.
Fair enough. I never said people had to like the movie or sing it's praises. Some folks loved it, some folks hated it, and the rest fall somewhere in between. That's Star Wars fandom for ya. Nobody will ever agree on anything regarding these movies, except maybe that Empire is the best one.
Anyway, I just thought people were being a little too nit-picky about certain scenes, that's all.
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Something else I liked was Poe's story and setting him up to be one of (if not the) leader in the next generation of the rebellion. But equating the decision he made at the beginning of the movie with the one he made at the end seems a bit off (beginning of the movie: chance to score a victory at significant cost when retreat and escape was a perfectly valid option; vs. end of the movie: chance to give the rebellion what seemed like a fighting chance when, as far as they knew at the time, retreat and escape was not an option.) It worked out for him thanks to the sparkly dogs and a jedi on the other side of a rock wall, but just based on what he knew, I thought he made the wrong call in both circumstances. They could have set up a much better situation of him making a tough but correct call that that involved setting aside his ego.
You see I didn’t like him at all - he made nothing but bad decisions:
- the bombing run killed lots of rebels
- the mutiny and support for the casino run almost resulted in the complete destruction of the remaining rebel force
- bailing on the speeder assault when at the time it looked like the last resort
