[Rumour] Chad Johnson to the Sabres

[Vinny01]

I feel fairly confident there will be a veteran backup in Calgary next year. Treliving went as far to say if there is a position he has no problem "over-cooking" in the minors it is goaltending

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Most of his comments have been about how inexperienced both Rittich and Gillies are in North American pro hockey. He's talked about overcooking goalies. Seems reluctant to rush them.

Reading between the lines I'm skeptical they'd hand Rittich the backup job. I think they'll acquire a more experienced backup.

OK, here's the list of UFA goaltenders who are over 25 (Rittich's age) and played around 20 games or more last year, along with last year's cap hit:

Ryan Miller, 36 games, $6 million
Curtis McElhinney, 21 games, $800 K.
Brian Elliott, 49 games, $2.5 million (I think that ship has sailed)
Chad Johnson, 36 games, $1.7 million (rumored to sign in Buffalo)
Steve Mason, 58 games, $4.1 million
Jonathan Bernier, 39 games, $4.15 million
Keith Kinkaid, 26 games, $750 K.
Anders Nilsson, 26 games, $1 million
Darcy Kuemper, 18 games, $1.55 million

The only guys I would consider on that list are Kinkaid and Nilsson as both had good numbers and are only 27 years old. They would also be had for less than $1.5 million without any problem.

It's either a guy like those two to give a comparable talent for the other goalies to compete with in camp, or you just give the job to the best of the two and put the other in the minors. If one doesn't work out, you have another quality goaltender to call up and give them a chance. If NEITHER work out, you make a trade for a goalie in the season.

[GioforPM]

never mind - CPF's post was better.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

UFA backups with experience: Kuemper, Pavelec, Bernier, Nilsson, Enroth, Kincaid, McElhinny, Berube, Peters.

Hell no to the bolded ones. They were all pretty poor in recent years.

I wouldn't mind Bernier, but I doubt he signs for less than $2 million.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Hell no to the bolded ones. They were all pretty poor in recent years.

I wouldn't mind Bernier, but I doubt he signs for less than $2 million.

Yeah, it was just a list for discussion purposes.

I thought Vegas might end up with a few goalies to move for cheap but that sure didn't turn out.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Yeah, it was just a list for discussion purposes.

I thought Vegas might end up with a few goalies to move for cheap but that sure didn't turn out.

McPhee has really dropped the ball in setting up that franchise for future success. I would never otherwise say this because I think it's a stupid statement about being an armchair G.M., but I feel that even I could have done a better job of handling that situation.

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

McPhee has really dropped the ball in setting up that franchise for future success. I would never otherwise say this because I think it's a stupid statement about being an armchair G.M., but I feel that even I could have done a better job of handling that situation.

Yes seems like he passed on certain players that would have had greater trade value, and then got poor return on some of his tardes.

Meanwhile he takes a player from Flames he could have otherwise had for free. Wouldn't a guy like Stajan have had at least some value?

There were certainly a lot of moving parts and I guess ultimately sucking and accruing draft picks is the best strategy. But then I think he could have ended up with better picks in some cases.

[megatron]

Other than that stretch in December, I wasn't overly confident with Johnson in net. Too many bad goals let in glove side.

I think Gillies should be in the AHL as the starter, so Rittich should compete for the back up spot. However, I think BT will bring an experienced guy in case of an injury to Smith.

[Savvy27]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

There are many more successful NHL goalies who did not make the transition from the AHL to the NHL until they were in their mid/late-20s than there are those who were fast-tracked before turning 25.

This made me curious. I definitely made some subjective choices such as 15 NHL games, but I think that is a fair number in a season that the coaches have faith that the guy can play in the league. I also picked starters as I understood them to currently be (using starters will probably skew younger as well since they are probably more talented and make it earlier than back ups). Also some of the ages are +/- a year as I was too lazy to investigate which point in the season they were playing... this is just to establish some trends to chew on.

I included Bobrovsky's KHL games because he played four full seasons there and I figure it is equivalent or better than the AHL.

Team - Goalie - AHL games (total prior to graduation) - Age at Graduation to NHL (15+ games in a season)
Anaheim - Gibson - 46 - 20
Arizona - Raanta - 14 - 25
Boston - Rask - 102 - 22
Buffalo - Lehner - 95 - 22
Calgary - Smith - 127 - 24
Carolina - Darling - 53 - 26
Chicago - Crawford - 255 - 26
Colorado - Varlamov - 27 - 21
Columbus - Bobrovsky - 67 KHL - 22
Dallas - Bishop - 175 - 27
Detroit - Howard - 186 - 25
Edmonton - Talbot - 116 - 26
Florida - Luongo - 0 - 20
Las Vegas - Fleury - 0 - 19
Los Angeles - Quick - 33 - 22
Minnesota - Dubnyk - 132 - 23
Montreal - Price - 2 - 20
Nashville - Rinne - 82 - 25
New Jersey - Schneider - 136 - 24
NYI - Greiss - 141 - 23
NYR - Lundqvist - 0 - 23
Ottawa - Anderson - 97 - 22
Pittsburgh - Murray - 72 - 22
Philadelphia - Mason - 0 - 20
San Jose - Jones - 136 - 23
St. Louis - Allen - 120 - 22
Tampa Bay - Vasilevyskiy - 25 - 20
Toronto - Andersen - 47 - 24
Vancouver - Miller - 47 - 22
Washington - Holtby - 131 - 23
Winnipeg - Hellebuyck - 88 - 22

Average age of graduation: 22.7
Average AHL games played prior to graduation: 82.3

Rittich will be 25 when the season starts, but I probably would have put him at 24 for this out of laziness so I'll use that as the age of interest. He has played 31 AHL games to this point.

Goalies who played 15 games in the NHL at 24 and under: 24
Goalies who played 15 games in the NHL at 25 and up: 7

Goalies graduating at <32 AHL games: 8
Goalies graduating at >31 AHL games: 23

Hopefully people find this interesting... it's a bit of a mixed bag. I'm curious to see what you guys make of it.

[Savvy27]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Yes. But they may get more NHL chances this year due to injury. It's unlikely Smith and our backup are 100% healthy all year. Also they will be more qualified to win an NHL spot the following year with more pro experience under their belts. They learn how to be starting goalies at the pro level by starting a large number of games. Not backup up a large number of games.

Fair enough, but I don't really see how the goalies are going to start a large number of games in the AHL if they are splitting the net. Rittich only started 31 games last season (Gillies with 39 GP), which is more than he would in the NHL but it's not like he carried the mail as a true starter.

Yeah you sign a backup for only 1 year. Who is that? I don't know.

The AHL schedule is condensed enough you need both goalies to start large amount of games. Lots of back to backs.

I hadn't really considered that. Hypothetically, if Rittich were the back up I think that the Heat would be fine with Gillies and Parsons splitting the net. Parsons may spend some time in the ECHL but I think that would be more out of necessity to get him starts due to a crowded net rather than a reflection of his ability level.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

OK, here's the list of UFA goaltenders who are over 25 (Rittich's age) and played around 20 games or more last year, along with last year's cap hit:

Ryan Miller, 36 games, $6 million
Curtis McElhinney, 21 games, $800 K.
Brian Elliott, 49 games, $2.5 million (I think that ship has sailed)
Chad Johnson, 36 games, $1.7 million (rumored to sign in Buffalo)
Steve Mason, 58 games, $4.1 million
Jonathan Bernier, 39 games, $4.15 million
Keith Kinkaid, 26 games, $750 K.
Anders Nilsson, 26 games, $1 million
Darcy Kuemper, 18 games, $1.55 million

The only guys I would consider on that list are Kinkaid and Nilsson as both had good numbers and are only 27 years old. They would also be had for less than $1.5 million without any problem.

It's either a guy like those two to give a comparable talent for the other goalies to compete with in camp, or you just give the job to the best of the two and put the other in the minors. If one doesn't work out, you have another quality goaltender to call up and give them a chance. If NEITHER work out, you make a trade for a goalie in the season.

Thanks for the research, interesting info. It does seem the options available through that route are limited. Flames won't be limited to strictly the UFA market. Thought I heard a quote from an executive recently that "the backup goalie market was robust". You've got CAR with 3 goalies. There might be veteran AHL options they'd consider for backup over their kids.

Should be interesting see which way they go. Pretty sure the Flames will plan for injuries at the NHL and AHL level. We keep visualizing the list of goalies when healthy but Treliving will get the depth to survive a major injury.

[TheFlamesVan]

Rittich is making more and more sense. If not for Smith injury fears it would be an easy decision.

But they are backlogged in minor goalies now with Parsons. I think he needs AHL time next year. Doesn't sound like he's interested in going back to the OHL.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by TheFlamesVan

Rittich is making more and more sense. If not for Smith injury fears it would be an easy decision.

But they are backlogged in minor goalies now with Parsons. I think he needs AHL time next year. Doesn't sound like he's interested in going back to the OHL.

Parsons can go to the ECHL next year worst case

[MacDaddy77]

I believe it will be rittich. We can use the cap flexibility having a backup make $1MM for forward depth. Also having rittich as backup clears space for Gilles to start in Stockton with Parsons backing him up there

[TheFlamesVan]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Parsons can go to the ECHL next year worst case

He can for sure.... but that's no step up from the CHL. And with his skill set and how quickly he has developed I think it would be a bit of a waste of a year. Not a bad thing, won't hurt his development or anything. I just think he would benefit more from splitting AHL duties.

[Gaudfather]

Originally Posted by MacDaddy77

I believe it will be rittich. We can use the cap flexibility having a backup make $1MM for forward depth. Also having rittich as backup clears space for Gilles to start in Stockton with Parsons backing him up there

Would each of Gilles and Parsons get enough work if they split duties in Stockton?

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Gaudfather

Would each of Gilles and Parsons get enough work if they split duties in Stockton?

I don't think this is a major concern with Parsons given his age for this year.

[CSharp]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

I can't see any way Tre lets just McCollum, Rittich and Gillies fight for the back up spot. Not enough NHL experience there and a huge gamble.

Nilsson, McElhinney or Kinkaid maybe?

Gives me bad flashbacks of when the Flames D was bigger and tougher than what we have now. So, if Smith goes down with an injury, you're left gambling with a backup that is known to suck and another backup without much or any NHL experience. I'd rather gamble with the farm solution and hope for the best. Regardless of the situation with the backups, the Flames don't have the first two rounds of the 2018 draft selection, which is projected to be deep. So, tanking is not an option either. I just hope Treliving doesn't turn out like Sutter where he's going to be greedy on build the D and reliance on the main goalie and then everything else is neglected OR a patchwork of plugging in 2nd rate forwards for 1st line duty.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Parsons can go to the ECHL next year worst case

That's not the worst case, that's the most likely case. Unless he has a knock-out training camp, or someone ahead of him gets hurt, he'll almost certainly play the season in the ECHL.

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

Agreed. Next season when Gillies and Rittich are more developed seems to be the perfect time.



They are developing, in the minors. Likely the best place to develop.



You know what will help Gillies develop more than practicing and sitting on the bench? Playing games! in the minors.

Isn't Rittich under contract for just one more year. Perhaps he'll just go home if he feels he isn't going to get a shot.