Flames' 2017 Off-Season Defence Discussion

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

So what is the deal with Alzner? I thought he was pretty much universally accepted as a perfect new age shut down Dman where as he is big and physical, yet mobile and can move the puck.

Yet I see a lot of fans lately not so keen on him. Is there something in the advanced stats etc that paint him in a poor light? Bad qual comp or terrible possession metrics or something?

Some fans don't appreciate shut down defencemen and what they bring at all. Some fans don't understand the value that rubbing a forward out, stapling him to the boards, clearing the crease, etc bring. I think in general what they contribute is misconstrued by advanced stats. Hard to quantify how much value there is in physically dominating smaller forwards and physically keeping them to the outside. Some people like to believe the NHL is all about skill and skating and that physical play is near irrelevant. That isn't reality but you won't convince them any different

Look at how much hate Engelland got during most of his time here as a prime example of the above

[StrykerSteve]

Re-sign Stone and Wotherspoon and call it a day. Wotherspoon slots in at #5-6. The guy is never going to be an offensive star, but you don't need him to be. Just let him play his game, which is a solid, dependable defenceman.

18p in 56 games in the AHL this season, with a +30. Was also recognized by the team as the Heat's best defensive defenseman this season.

6'2, 210, 24 years old. Fits in perfectly with the core of the team and won't cost you much right now.

Then let everyone else fight for the last spot. I contemplated bringing in Alzner as well, but I don't think it's a good fit after putting some thought into it.

[DJones]

Resign Stone and let the kids play up. I think Kulak and Wotherspoon are ready.

[Toonage]

I liked Wotherspoon's game, but I think the team is ready to move on from him.

IMO Kulak & Andersson likely to be the bottom pairing unless one gets plucked by Vegas.

[Huntingwhale]

Stone absolutely needs to come back. Not because he's an elite player (although he is very good). But because he makes Brodie that much better. A good Brodie is a top 20 D in the league. I think everyone hopes last season was an anomaly with Brodie and he can get back to form. He struggled for a bit without Gio as his partner, but instantly improved the second he got away from Wideman and was paired with Stone.

I know we all like to look at stats and salary and such. But there is something to be said for chemistry between players. Some players just have it. Brodie/Stone has it.

IMO outside of a star goalie, a ''back to form Brodie'' has a bigger impact on the team going forward then Gaudreau being back to PPG, Monahan scoring 30 or the bottom 6 forwards carrying the workload.

What better player to help Brodie get back to the form then the very partner he finished the season with. IMO getting Stone signed to a reasonable deal is very much a high priority. Even more then a top 6 RW spot.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Stone absolutely needs to come back.

Just to add to this, without Stone this team has no big RH shot from the back end.

[Roof-Daddy]

Originally Posted by Toonage

Just to add to this, without Stone this team has no big RH shot from the back end.

Hamilton?

His shot is no slouch.

[Toonage]

Originally Posted by Roof-Daddy

Hamilton?

His shot is no slouch.

Great wrister. Seeing eye, even. But his slap shot? Not the same as a guy like Stone (or even Wideman that one year he was on).

And if it is better than I recall, he definitely needs to use it more.

[Calgary4LIfe]

It wouldn't surprise me if Treliving can't get Engelland to sign a shorter term, lower dollar deal, that he will move onto McIlrath. Would help to fill the toughness quotient with Engelland leaving (though he isn't half the fighter that Engelland is). I am not a fan of him in ability either in playing hockey or in his fisticuffs, but I can't see Treliving not replacing some toughness on the team with having to play the Oilers 6 times a year with Lucic, Maroon, Kassian, Nurse, etc. Hopefully it isn't McIlrath (and hoping it isn't a D at all, as messes with the combos).

[Roof-Daddy]

Left side:

Giordano - LOCK
Brodie - LOCK

Kulak
Wotherspoon
Bartkowski
Kylington

Seems like we have have a really strong 1st and 2nd pair lefty D, and a really good battle for bottom pair lefty D. No need to sign a LHD IMO.



Right side:

Hamilton - LOCK

If Stone is re-signed, he's another locked in guy, so you're left with just finding a bottom pair RHD, Andersson will push for a spot, but i would be OK with bringing in some competition to push him.

Deryk Engelland
Dylan McIlrath
Korbinian Holzer
Roman Polak
Yanik Weber
Paul Postma
Matt Tennyson
Nate Prosser
Eric Gryba
Luke Witkowski
Cody Goloubef
Taylor Fedun
Tom Gilbert
Jakub Nakladal
Chad Ruhwedel


Lots to choose from of all shapes, sizes, ages, experience levels, and skill sets.

I'm also all for trading for an upgrade on Stone for the 2nd pairing RHD, but the type of assets Tre might use to do that will probably be needed to acquire a young goalie now.

[dammage79]

I don't see Kulak or Wotherspoon having a future in Calgary.
I hope they re-sign Stone, he fit in really nicely on the top 4. With Wideman and Engel land gone I can see Reliving going out and getting one more stout defender leaving one slot open for an Anderson or Kylington.

[TheIronMaiden]

What is a good timeline for expecting when moves might start happening?

Do the Flames have enough players to expose in the expansion draft? If that is the case then I can imagine that they wont try to extend Stone until after the 21st. Moreover, trades probably wont happen in earnest until after the play-offs are over.

June 18, 2017 - NHL Expansion Draft player list released
June 21, 2017 - NHL Expansion Draft picks revealed
June 23-24, 2017 - NHL Draft, takes place in Chicago, IL
June 24th, 2017 – Free Agent Interview Period Opens
June 26th, 2017 - RFA Offer Deadline
July 1st, 2017 – Start of Free Agency

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Funny how some fans are ready to give up on guys like Kulak and Wotherspoon just as those guys might reasonably expect to step in. They've been cooking in the minors for a while and IMO both are ready to push for spots. Doesn't mean they'll win them but the amount of people wanting to cut bait on them just as their development should be nearing its end is puzzling.

Kulak, Wotherspoon, Andersson. We could probably see two of the 3 make the team next year.

[Backlunds_socks]

Don't be surprised to see a "core" D man traded this year......

personally it won't be Gio or Hamilton.

[Isikiz]

Originally Posted by Backlunds_socks

Don't be surprised to see a "core" D man traded this year......

personally it won't be Gio or Hamilton.

Source?

[smiggy77]

Originally Posted by Cycling76er

Apparently CP has an in with his cousin.

I can't tell you who my source is...but I'm cousins with a guy who's name rhymes with Brody Bransen.

[Teroy]

Wotherspoon has the best stats in Stockton and deserves a chance. Besides Kylington and Andersson are young and could use another year with the Heat.

[Mass_nerder]

Originally Posted by Backlunds_socks

Don't be surprised to see a "core" D man traded this year......

personally it won't be Gio or Hamilton.

I really think that would be counter-productive.
Might depend on how tre values positions though. Does he want to trade the stability of our defense to fix goal tending or scoring? I'm sceptical.

[memphusk]

It's time to part ways with Engelland due to age, but #### is this team going to get bullied without him.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I don't think the Flames move on from Wotherspoon or Kulak - well, at least definitely not both.

A team needs depth on defence, and both these guys were able to get called up and play some stretches in the NHL. They would also be good for Stockton.

Wotherspoon
Kulak
Anderrson
Kylington

These guys will function as the top 4 next season, and become the first call-ups when/if injuries hit the Flames.

You will have Kanzig and Falkovsky moving up to the Heat from the ECHL I would think as well. Adam Ollas-Mattsson needs a spot too. That's 7 D. Flames will probably re-sign one of their vets or sign another vet from another team next season to round-out their group I would guess. Gone would be Morrisson and Culkin (as well as Kostka. Hickey and Fox are both returning to the NCAA. I don't think they sign Riley Bruce, but if they do, I would imagine he would start in the ECHL first.

Unless either Kulak or Wotherspoon are demanding too much, I don't see why the Flames wouldn't try and retain them this season. They are at least trending as decent 6th defencemen in the NHL, or quality AHL defencemen to help shoulder the load with younger and more inexperienced guys. As long as there is room, I don't see the point of letting either one go.

As we saw last season, Treliving is not shy from walking away from prospects he feels don't fit long-term, but I think it was mostly to make room and give other prospects the chance to play more important minutes. I wouldn't think that Kulak and Wotherspoon are blocking some of the D that the Flames are probably higher on at this point either.