PP/PK discussion (update 12th/11th) - now with PP snek

[Calgary4LIfe]

With regards to the big shot from the point, I think it does two things:

1) It spreads out the PK'ers. If you don't have a big shot from the point, the PK'ers can cheat down-low.

2) Big shots on the ice (or just above the ice) allows for big rebounds.

With that being said, I guess the big shot is not as useful for the Flames because they still don't have that really great net-front presence yet. I mean, Tkachuk is getting much better at it, but back in the day you had Nieuwendyk standing fearlessly and tipping shots left right and center, and you had Roberts or Gilmour crashing the net hard and creating chaos, and everyone was good at putting the puck in the net.

Flames don't have that consistent great 'tipper', and they are also not big or 'mean' enough to crash the net yet. Tkachuk I think will be a huge weapon on the PP as he matures, and then the big shot from the point will be more lethal.

If I was Ferland, that is the job I want. He is hard to move, and he has a good sent of hands and has great mobility. I would be asking Hamilton, Wideman and Giordano to stay a bit longer after practice just to help him work on his tips and scrambles.

[activeStick]

I'd love to see Monahan work on his tipping as his size and strength would be good in that role, also allowing him to be in the area to scoop up pucks that lie around after others who are a better fit (like Tkachuk) crash the net for rebounds.

I agree that a big shot has a lot of value on the PP, but I'm thinking more like a Shea Weber canon. Unfortunately, the Flames dont have anyone able to do that.

[GioforPM]

Tipping just isn't as much a factor as when Neuwy and Ciccerelli and other like them were around. Maybe it's the butterfly/blocking style of goaltending versus the standup style of guys like Vernon. Tips used to go in through the five hole a lot, now they don't. Maybe it's better defence and shot blocking.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

With regards to the big shot from the point, I think it does two things:

1) It spreads out the PK'ers. If you don't have a big shot from the point, the PK'ers can cheat down-low.

2) Big shots on the ice (or just above the ice) allows for big rebounds.

With that being said, I guess the big shot is not as useful for the Flames because they still don't have that really great net-front presence yet. I mean, Tkachuk is getting much better at it, but back in the day you had Nieuwendyk standing fearlessly and tipping shots left right and center, and you had Roberts or Gilmour crashing the net hard and creating chaos, and everyone was good at putting the puck in the net.

Flames don't have that consistent great 'tipper', and they are also not big or 'mean' enough to crash the net yet. Tkachuk I think will be a huge weapon on the PP as he matures, and then the big shot from the point will be more lethal.

If I was Ferland, that is the job I want. He is hard to move, and he has a good sent of hands and has great mobility. I would be asking Hamilton, Wideman and Giordano to stay a bit longer after practice just to help him work on his tips and scrambles.

It doesn't need to be a cannon of a shot to get a good rebound. Just low and hard, and 99% of guys in the NHL can get a "hard" shot off.

I agree with you on Ferland though. He's got the right attitude and skills to be a Holmstrom Lite and make a career out of causing havoc in front.

[Rick M.]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

It doesn't need to be a cannon of a shot to get a good rebound. Just low and hard, and 99% of guys in the NHL can get a "hard" shot off.

I agree with you on Ferland though. He's got the right attitude and skills to be a Holmstrom Lite and make a career out of causing havoc in front.

The other thing we often lack this year is the fact that the point shot is so often off target. As an aside, Kylington seems to get his on net.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by Rick M.

The other thing we often lack this year is the fact that the point shot is so often off target. As an aside, Kylington seems to get his on net.

So did Nakladal

[FBI]

I'm not sure why Ferland isn't being tried more on the PP.. He was tried just a little bit and had 2 goals in front of the net on it.

But I also understand things are rolling right now so don't mess with it. Would like to see him pack there on line #2 again though in the future.

[Huntingwhale]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

So did Nakladal

Once upon a time Wideman had that skill. He used to be so damn good at getting pucks through, and he had a real rocket from the point. For whatever reason, he's lost that skill over the past 2 seasons. When was the last time he even tried a slapshot? Either he is being told to never use it (unlikely), or he just flat out refuses to do it.

For all the issues that revolve around Wideman, to me the loss of his point shot is easily the most frustrating. Even more so then his giveaways. At least his offence used to make up for his defensive deficiencies.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Huntingwhale

Once upon a time Wideman had that skill. He used to be so damn good at getting pucks through, and he had a real rocket from the point. For whatever reason, he's lost that skill over the past 2 seasons. When was the last time he even tried a slapshot? Either he is being told to never use it (unlikely), or he just flat out refuses to do it.

For all the issues that revolve around Wideman, to me the loss of his point shot is easily the most frustrating. Even more so then his giveaways. At least his offence used to make up for his defensive deficiencies.

The goal he scored last game? Was it not a slapper that got through?

Frankly, Wideman gets way more than his share of criticism this year. He's actually been more solid defensively than Brodie - he's just been playing better positionally as is more physical. He's better than the bottom pair (Engelland is good enough until it's time to move the puck out of the defensive zone - talk about giveaways). Offensively, his pinches have been way smarter than Brodie's this year, and he sure has been maing nice passes.

To me the game threads are silent about him though a lot of minutes of solid play, until he makes the odd mistake, and then there's 10 posts calling for him to be executed.

I sound like a Wideman fan. I'm not. I figured he was way too slow and a huge liability and wanted him gone, prior to his benching a couple years ago. He sure improved that season, and I'm seeing a lot of the same this year (after last year's multi-level debacle).

[GranteedEV]

FWIW Wideman's decline is probably moreso the league getting deeper, quicker, smarter, with more defensive pressure. Even guys like Gio, Duncan Keith and Drew Doughty have declined a bit to my eyes just by how much more difficult it is to get shots through. Guys like Burns, Hamilton, and Karlsson are just becoming that much more valuable on the points.

[FBI]

I'm happy that Wideman has played well enough to hopefully get some sort of low pick at the deadline. Still excited to move on from him.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The goal he scored last game? Was it not a slapper that got through?

Frankly, Wideman gets way more than his share of criticism this year. He's actually been more solid defensively than Brodie - he's just been playing better positionally as is more physical. He's better than the bottom pair (Engelland is good enough until it's time to move the puck out of the defensive zone - talk about giveaways). Offensively, his pinches have been way smarter than Brodie's this year, and he sure has been maing nice passes.

To me the game threads are silent about him though a lot of minutes of solid play, until he makes the odd mistake, and then there's 10 posts calling for him to be executed.

I sound like a Wideman fan. I'm not. I figured he was way too slow and a huge liability and wanted him gone, prior to his benching a couple years ago. He sure improved that season, and I'm seeing a lot of the same this year (after last year's multi-level debacle).

Standing and watching, while Brodie does ALL of the heavy lifting defensively, does not make Wideman "more solid defensively than Brodie".

It never ceases to amaze me how people can't see that a big difference in Brodie's play this year is because he is the one in the corner all night fighting the forwards by himself.

Who your partner is, makes a HUGE difference for how defensmen perform.

[thymebalm]

Originally Posted by FBI

I'm happy that Wideman has played well enough to hopefully get some sort of low pick at the deadline. Still excited to move on from him.

I hope we keep Wideman. It would be a sign we are going for a run in the playoffs. He's been everything he needs to be this year.

[MisterJoji]

Originally Posted by CsInMyBlood

Where is the love for Cameron?



Especially from all of you that were calling for his head?



He definitely deserves some credit after all the crap thrown his way from some around here.

God this annoys me. Trying to call out other posters in a "told you so" kind of way when the team plays well. Yes, the special teams turn around is remarkable but why do you have to try and thump your chest about it. Especially for a poster who was all crapping all over Dougie at the beginning of the season. You know, the guy who now leads the team in points for defensemen.

[FBI]

10th and 16th now!
We now eclipse 100% combined.

Snek snek snek

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Standing and watching, while Brodie does ALL of the heavy lifting defensively, does not make Wideman "more solid defensively than Brodie".

It never ceases to amaze me how people can't see that a big difference in Brodie's play this year is because he is the one in the corner all night fighting the forwards by himself.

Who your partner is, makes a HUGE difference for how defensmen perform.

I'm seeing a completely different game than you. IMO Wideman does far more in the corners and behind the net than Brodie. And he's far more often (this year) on the right side of the puck than Brodie, who is chasing more.

[Bandwagon In Flames]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I'm seeing a completely different game than you. IMO Wideman does far more in the corners and behind the net than Brodie. And he's far more often (this year) on the right side of the puck than Brodie, who is chasing more.

You have some very uneducated posts but I think this one is king of the crop.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon In Flames

You have some very uneducated posts but I think this one is king of the crop.

Thanks for your detailed analysis. Back atcha.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by FBI

10th and 16th now!
We now eclipse 100% combined.

Snek snek snek

Absolutely amazing, considering the start they had. Our special teams are so good that I'm excited every time we get a PP (duh) or a penalty. Fun to watch, Gulutzan really looks like a genius.

[Huntingwhale]

The turnaround in special is teams is a miracle. Don't think I've ever seen a team turn around their special teams like this. And I certainly wasn't expecting the Flames to do it.

Special teams was losing us games to start the season. Now it's winning us games. It was brought up in another thread, but is it likely that teams are taking less liberties with the hacks and slashes because the opponents know there is a good chance the Flames score on the PP?

This is what it feels good to strike fear into the opposition's heart when were on the PP. I've never felt this way before....