[Rumour] UPD: Friedman: Thinks a deal will get done between Gaudreau and the Flames in the next week

[AltaGuy]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I'm sorry but hoping that these players don't become superstars is kind of a silly way to build your team.

You are suggesting that the team paint itself into a corner and not be able to handle contingencies where other players like Bennett and Tkachuk become stars as well.

Extremely short-sighted, IMO

Yeah, that's not what I said.... who is hoping they don't become superstars?

But seriously, do you think it's likely? Because it's not. We have this one freak fourth round midget superstar, so we should worry about all the young guys doing it?

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

Yeah, that's not what I said.... who is hoping they don't become superstars?

But seriously, do you think it's likely? Because it's not. We have this one freak fourth round midget superstar, so we should worry about all the young guys doing it?

They are not all going to do it. But to just ignore the possibility and shoot their wad on the first star that comes along is not exactly what I would call good management

[Mister Yamoto]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

The fact that there are bad contracts on the roster does not justify more bad contracts.

Those contracts you listed will be gone soon. If you want to be a contender in a cap world, you can't afford bad contracts. Period.

Continuing to hand them out is not the best way to eliminate the problem, IMO.

If they have the money for players who clearly don't deserve it, then they should pay at least the going rate for the players who do.

All the pressure is on Treliving IMO. Gaudreau has more leverage here than most people think.

[Enoch Root]

Scorpion: some of your examples are hilarious.

And I never said that no contenders have any bad contracts. But every bad contract causes problems for every competitive team.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

If they have the money for players who clearly don't deserve it, then they should pay at least the going rate for the players who do.

All the pressure is on Treliving IMO. Gaudreau has more leverage here than most people think.

And what is the going rate for talented RFAs? Tarasenko is overpaid. A case can certainly be made that Gaudreau deserves a little more money than MacKinnon and Forsberg. But does he deserve 20-25% more than them?

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Yes I believe $8M is a bad contract.

Hall had 50 points in 45 games (shortened season) in the 3rd year of his ELC at the age of 20. Had he not missed 3 games, he probably would have been top 5 or 6 in the league in scoring (missed top 6 by 3 points).

Every Oiler fan would have said at that point that he was a certainty to be a league star for the next 10-15 years.

There is always risk.

And he likely will be a league star for the next 10-15 years...

[Dajazz]

Take a seat young mr Gaudreau. We have your rights for a long time, take the deal and play.

If he's asking for 8 million, good riddance. Is there any WINGER in the league worth that money? Kane, yes, hardware says hi. Benn? Probably.

8 million second contract? No, Johnny. No. If he turns in to Kane 2.0 it's all good. If. IF. Two seasons on a run and gun offense under Hartley and no hardware to show.

I sincerely hope the rumors aren't true. Send him east for a king's ransom if he holds out for 8m.

[Corral]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

Gaudreau has more leverage here than most people think.

Only in the eyes of the fans.

Gaudreau has no leverage if you are the Flames owners. The Dome is sold out regardless of whether he signs - Rogers is paying regardless of whether he signs - and while the team performance would suffer without him, no one seriously expects the Flames to win in the playoffs anytime soon - so time is on their side.

[Machiavelli]

So this is basically a continuation of The Thread from Hell...

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Scorpion: some of your examples are hilarious.

I think they're all legitimate. Either overpaid or overlong, or both.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I think they're all legitimate. Either overpaid or overlong, or both.

Pitt doesn't make the playoffs this year without Fleury (just one example)

And Hossa was a bargain at that price while he helped Chicago win 3 cups

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Pitt doesn't make the playoffs this year without Fleury (just one example)

And Hossa was a bargain at that price while he helped Chicago win 3 cups

Hossa's being paid ridiculous money until he's well over 40.

Fleury's all but a backup for Pittsburgh at this point. He's had his position usurped by a kid who went on to win a Stanley Cup.

These contracts may have looked good in the past, but they're starting to look real bad -- Hossa's in particular.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Yes I believe $8M is a bad contract.

Hall had 50 points in 45 games (shortened season) in the 3rd year of his ELC at the age of 20. Had he not missed 3 games, he probably would have been top 5 or 6 in the league in scoring (missed top 6 by 3 points).

Hall had already inked his extension five months before that season ever started. Can't compare that with the procrastination on Gaudreau's deal.

[Mister Yamoto]

Originally Posted by Corral

Only in the eyes of the fans.

Gaudreau has no leverage if you are the Flames owners. The Dome is sold out regardless of whether he signs - Rogers is paying regardless of whether he signs - and while the team performance would suffer without him, no one seriously expects the Flames to win in the playoffs anytime soon - so time is on their side.

I'm not sure that is how ownership would look at it.

Everything fell into place for the 14/15 season. And then 15/16 was a disaster. A second straight season of regression during a rebuild would be unacceptable if I owned the Flames.

Treliving needs a good season. If his job doesn't depend on it, it should. Time is not on their side.

[Remember1989]

Everyone is missing the easy solution here if we pay Gaudreau $8M...unpaid interns on the fourth line.

[OldDutch]

Originally Posted by AltaGuy

I'd still give him 8x8 without blinking. Realistically, I think he'd take 7.5Mx8 and that's perfect to me. The kid is an incredible player, and I don't care much about his RFA/years in the league status.

People have to remember there is more to this than just "pay the kid"

1. Total of 2 seasons under his belt. Although extremely talented , he isn't proven. Cheechoo had 2 amazing seasons at one point.

2. The cap has to be managed. This will bite us when Benett et al. need to sign.

3. Most important the team optic. Other guys may have signed for closer to market because they wanted to win as a team. If Johnny signs for $8 mill that is running huge team chemistry risk. How would a guys who took a hit like to see that money just thrown to Johnny becuase he has 2 good seasons.

There is a pecking order for a reason. Just throwing money even at Johnny is an easy solution with massive risk. Flames really can't politically do it even if they want to.

I say hold fort. The kid has no leverage.

[corporatejay]

Originally Posted by Mister Yamoto

If they have the money for players who clearly don't deserve it, then they should pay at least the going rate for the players who do.

All the pressure is on Treliving IMO. Gaudreau has more leverage here than most people think.

Actually Gaudreau has no leverage. Not offer sheet eligible and no arbitration rights. All he can literally do is sit. That's his only move. Meanwhile the flames will go on with their season and will be waiting for him when he's done holding out.

[calgaryblood]

Originally Posted by OldDutch

1. Total of 2 seasons under his belt. Although extremely talented , he isn't proven. Cheechoo had 2 amazing seasons at one point.

Really? This isn't remotely comparable.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by corporatejay

Actually Gaudreau has no leverage. Not offer sheet eligible and no arbitration rights. All he can literally do is sit. That's his only move. Meanwhile the flames will go on with their season and will be waiting for him when he's done holding out.

Right. The Flames season doesn't matter all....I'm sure it will be business as usual without the teams best player for as long as a holdout goes on.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

Hall had already inked his extension five months before that season ever started. Can't compare that with the procrastination on Gaudreau's deal.

The point was in reference to risk.