The New American Politics thread - Page 159 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:28 PM

CNN projects Cruz to win the Iowa caucuses.

That's how despicable Trump is. He lost to one of the most despicable GOP candidates in the race.

I'm calling it now though. With Rubio's strong showing tonight, he will eventually be the nominee for the GOP.

Senator Clay Davis · 02-01-2016, 08:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I disagree. I think the writing is on the wall for Trump. Just like the way Mike Huckabee and Michelle Bachman were leading polls in the past, but ultimately fell apart as candidates, Trump will go away at some point just like everyone predicted.

They never led for anywhere close to as long as Trump has, and it's Iowa and they voted for Huckabee and Santorum the last two times. Bigger issue for Trump is Rubio appears to have taken votes from him. But this would now be the 237th time Trump is being written off as being over, and yes this is actual votes but its one primary, a primary driven by religious nuts. Race still needs to be a two man race, Rubio is not going to be popular with the base against either Trump or Cruz. Ideally not Cruz because as I said before, miles worse than Trump.

peter12 · 02-01-2016, 08:30 PM

Clinton just declared victory. Significant risk as there are still lots of polls to be counted.

ernie · 02-01-2016, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DuffMan

Gawd, I hate Ted Cruz.

Everyone does!

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

They never led for anywhere close to as long as Trump has, and it's Iowa and they voted for Huckabee and Santorum the last two times. Bigger issue for Trump is Rubio appears to have taken votes from him. But this would now be the 237th time Trump is being written off as being over, and yes this is actual votes but its one primary, a primary driven by religious nuts. Race still needs to be a two man race, Rubio is not going to be popular with the base against either Trump or Cruz. Ideally not Cruz because as I said before, miles worse than Trump.

See that's where I disagree. If the base is the extreme right, then yes. But most Republicans are not extreme right, and Rubio is a far better candidate if you're a regular ol' republican.

And Trump will probably be relevant in the next couple of primaries, but you watch his numbers drop significantly in that process. There's no way he's going to be considered a serious candidate by most voters.

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peter12

Clinton just declared victory. Significant risk as there are still lots of polls to be counted.

LOL, What???!!!

It's now 49.9% for Clinton and 49.4% for Sanders!

That's a major misstep for her.

nik- · 02-01-2016, 08:36 PM

It's funny/horrifying. As ####ed up as Trump is, Cruz is the real scary one because he could win and there's no doubting what a zealot he is.

Senator Clay Davis · 02-01-2016, 08:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

See that's where I disagree. If the base is the extreme right, then yes. But most Republicans are not extreme right, and Rubio is a far better candidate if you're a regular ol' republican.

And Trump will probably be relevant in the next couple of primaries, but you watch his numbers drop significantly in that process. There's no way he's going to be considered a serious candidate by most voters.

See that's the thing about Rubio, he's John McCain, he's Mitt Romney. He's the safe choice to them, but they remember they voted for them and lost anyway. I think they're ready to ride the crazy train with either Trump or Cruz, because if they're going to lose, they might as well lose their way. The establishment still only got 30% of the vote in this primary. Whoever is the ultimate establishment choice will have money and the support of the higher ups, but the base will view him as someone like Hillary or Obama, just a political insider.

nik- · 02-01-2016, 08:38 PM

Rubio is no John McCain. He allows his religion to guide his policy a lot more than McCain does.

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

See that's the thing about Rubio, he's John McCain, he's Mitt Romney. He's the safe choice to them, but they remember they voted for them and lost anyway. I think they're ready to ride the crazy train with either Trump or Cruz, because if they're going to lose, they might as well lose their way. The establishment still only got 30% of the vote in this primary. Whoever is the ultimate establishment choice will have money and the support of the higher ups, but the base will view him as someone like Hillary or Obama, just a political insider.

All due respect to McCain and Romney, but Rubio is a much more dynamic candidate than either of them. Now, I'm not sure he's ready to be president, but based on this terribly weak field, he's the best choice for the republicans to challenge for the white house. There's zero chance Cruz or Trump could convince most of America to vote for them. Most of America doesn't respond well to veiled racism.

KootenayFlamesFan · 02-01-2016, 08:41 PM

Why is Rubio going on about the military? Doesn't the U.S. spend more than something like the next 7 countries combined? How much more does he want to spend??

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nik-

Rubio is no John McCain. He allows his religion to guide his policy a lot more than McCain does.

And that is the major issue for me. If he just left it at the door he would possibly be a good choice for president. But then if he didn't rely on his religion, he probably wouldn't be the GOP nominee.

nik- · 02-01-2016, 08:42 PM

I actually think that John McCain, while not exactly the most charismatic guy, would have likely been a pretty decent president. He was probably a little hawkish, but I mean who isn't at this point besides Sanders. Unfortunately he allowed his party to team him with a total bubblehead nutcase which has led to the clown car we see today.

It's a real shame what McCain allowed the party to do to him, I think he deserved better.

KootenayFlamesFan · 02-01-2016, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nik-

Rubio is no John McCain. He allows his religion to guide his policy a lot more than McCain does.

......and right on cue he thanked god. Thank you god for allowing me to finish 3rd in Iowa. You're the best.

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

Why is Rubio going on about the military? Doesn't the U.S. spend more than something like the next 7 countries combined? How much more does he want to spend??

Standard GOP platform: Spend all the GDP on defense, regardless of whether you need it or not.

troutman · 02-01-2016, 08:43 PM

Really bad results for Trump, methinks.

Senator Clay Davis · 02-01-2016, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

All due respect to McCain and Romney, but Rubio is a much more dynamic candidate than either of them. Now, I'm not sure he's ready to be president, but based on this terribly weak field, he's the best choice for the republicans to challenge for the white house. There's zero chance Cruz or Trump could convince most of America to vote for them. Most of America doesn't respond well to veiled racism.

Rubio as we see right now really isn't that dynamic. He's just a warmonger who can raise his voice because Murica has to be the goddamn police of the world, or we're ####ing weak!

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nik-

I actually think that John McCain, while not exactly the most charismatic guy, would have likely been a pretty decent president. He was probably a little hawkish, but I mean who isn't at this point besides Sanders. Unfortunately he allowed his party to team him with a total bubblehead nutcase which has led to the clown car we see today.

It's a real shame what McCain allowed the party to do to him, I think he deserved better.

I agree, but with one caveat. He's pretty extreme when it comes to foreign policy and military intervention. If he had his way America would have bombed the crap out of North Korea, Iran, and maybe Iraq again for ####s and giggles.

nik- · 02-01-2016, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I agree, but with one caveat. He's pretty extreme when it comes to foreign policy and military intervention. If he had his way America would have bombed the crap out of North Korea, Iran, and maybe Iraq again for ####s and giggles.

Yeah, that's why I said he's hawkish. He wants to bomb everyone. However, at this point the US has constant assassination machines patrolling the sky without any legal oversight or reliable intel, so it's really no better than just straight bombing.

Cali Panthers Fan · 02-01-2016, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

Rubio as we see right now really isn't that dynamic. He's just a warmonger who can raise his voice because Murica has to be the goddamn police of the world, or we're ####ing weak!

I really, really don't see him that way. Most of his policy is on free market economies, and has been for quite some time. If he's talking tough on defense now, it's only because people see him as weak on foreign policy.