Traffic delays up to 20% alongside downtown cycle lanes, city predicts

[Addick]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Filtering is dangerous and dumb.

Sorry for the delayed response but filtering is only dangerous when you allow road users to be dumb. If everyone was responsible for being fully attentive whilst using roadways, filtering wouldn't be any more dangerous than changing lanes or walking across the street.

[Weitz]

Originally Posted by Temporary_User

Clear bias in the Calgary Herald's reporting there. Definitely misleading.

18% satisfied and 42% somewhat satisfied equals 60% of respondents with some level of satisfaction.
Probably a 4 option poll:
Satisfied
Somewhat Satisfied
Somewhat dissatisfied
Dissatisfied

Then who knows from that article what Nenshi meant by "Spend more" was he even speaking about this poll directly?
Was he saying:
A) Spend more on bike lanes
B) Spend more than we already are spending on the bike lanes (what the article is suggesting he said)
C) Don't spend another penny on the bike lanes

From the poll it seems 33% are in group A, 20% in group B, and 47% in group C

The survey actually asked:

Investment for bikes on streets (in regards to 2014 spending):

47% said spend less
33% said spend the same
20% said spend more

So Nenshi is either confused, quoted improperly, or fudging the numbers.

[darklord700]

Originally Posted by Weitz

Investment for bikes on streets (in regards to 2014 spending):

47% said spend less
33% said spend the same
20% said spend more

So Nenshi is either confused, quoted improperly, or fudging the numbers.

I wouldn't put much weight on the 33% that said spend the same. If you don't come to downtown, you will rarely see a bike lane. And when people are asked a question they have no opinion of, they usually will say spend the same.

It is 47% spend less out numbering 2:1 the 20% spend more group.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by darklord700

I wouldn't put much weight on the 33% that said spend the same. If you don't come to downtown, you will rarely see a bike lane. And when people are asked a question they have no opinion of, they usually will say spend the same.

It is 47% spend less out numbering 2:1 the 20% spend more group.

That means we should likely spend more on bike lanes then if you want to base it solely on public opinion.

If less than 20% of people use bike lanes but more than 20% of people want to pay for them then I think there is case to be made for increased spending.

It like asking if you want an overpass at say 162nd and Mcleod trail. Most of the city probably doesn't care about it but the 10% of drivers who go through it each day would want it. So if it comes out 70%-30% against should you not build it.

Of course you wouldn't just factor in the majorities wants when the majority of people won't use something. You have to drill down a lot further.

[East Coast Flame]

Originally Posted by chemgear

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...sed-by-results

Mayor Naheed Nenshi said he’s “not fussed” about new polling numbers that show Calgarians remain divided over on-street bike lanes.

The 2015 survey shows just 18 per cent are very satisfied with Calgary’s on-street bike lanes, while 42 per cent responded as somewhat satisfied.

“The fascinating thing about the bike lanes thing is that after all the drama, after all the ink spilled on it, after so much whining about it … we still have a clear majority of people say, ‘spend more,'” Nenshi told reporters.

However, the report actually shows only 20 per cent of respondents want the city to spend more on bike lanes. One-third said keep spending levels the same, while 47 per cent said City Hall should spend less.

-70% of pollers surveyed on landline
-76% own their home, mean age of 44 years.

Exactly the people these bike lanes are for. Awesome poll.

[chemgear]

Were there any numbers about the number of vehicles per day that used the lane they removed for the bikes along 12th? Looks like there are about 150 people/bikes per day now.

[peter12]

Bike lanes are a big plus, especially in this weather. I just didn't feel safe sharing the road with drivers this morning.

[gasman]

Originally Posted by East Coast Flame

-70% of pollers surveyed on landline
-76% own their home, mean age of 44 years.

Exactly the people these bike lanes are for. Awesome poll.

I don't understand your correlation? Are you proposing that the vast majority of cyclists are middle aged homeowners who have landlines??? That sounds like an interesting study...

I live in the subburbs (about 15km from downtwon) I would have voted to spend more on bike lanes if I had been polled.

I am in my early 30's, use my cell phone exclusively, but I do own my home (or rather pay a mortgage) so maybe there is some merit to your conclusion.

[East Coast Flame]

Originally Posted by gasman

I don't understand your correlation? Are you proposing that the vast majority of cyclists are middle aged homeowners who have landlines??? That sounds like an interesting study...

I live in the subburbs (about 15km from downtwon) I would have voted to spend more on bike lanes if I had been polled.

I am in my early 30's, use my cell phone exclusively, but I do own my home (or rather pay a mortgage) so maybe there is some merit to your conclusion.

I meant the opposite. If you were to ask what group of people I would think were least satisfied with the bike lanes - I would guess that middle aged home-owners that primarily use a landline would be pretty high on that list.

Considering that this poll still came out with a 60% at least somewhat satisfied, I'd say that's a pretty good sign!

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by East Coast Flame

I would guess that middle aged home-owners that primarily use a landline would be pretty high on that list.

That's not what those numbers mean. Mean age of 44, for every 65 year old they surveyed there was a 21 year old; or two 32 year olds. Also the survey was mostly conducted on landlines, that doesn't mean the respondents primarily used a landline.

I have to agree with what was said earlier; if there was just "somewhat satisfied" or "somewhat dissatisfied", anybody who didn't have an opinion would say "somewhat satisfied." Seeing as there is no indication that anybody picked "neither satisfied nor dissatisfied", it's safe to say it wasn't an option.

Poll questions picked to elicit a specific response.

[peter12]

Originally Posted by ken0042

That's not what those numbers mean. Mean age of 44, for every 65 year old they surveyed there was a 21 year old; or two 32 year olds. Also the survey was mostly conducted on landlines, that doesn't mean the respondents primarily used a landline.

I have to agree with what was said earlier; if there was just "somewhat satisfied" or "somewhat dissatisfied", anybody who didn't have an opinion would say "somewhat satisfied." Seeing as there is no indication that anybody picked "neither satisfied nor dissatisfied", it's safe to say it wasn't an option.

Poll questions picked to elicit a specific response.

Given that the mean age of Calgary is 36.4, and that 60% of people under 35 exclusively use cell phones, I would say that her observation has a ring of truth to it.

[tete]

I answered the survey, I'm pretty sure you are right, Ken IIRC - there was no neutral options for any of the questions.

[Regorium]

The other hilarious demographic is that apparently 24% of people surveyed made more than $150,000 a year.

Rich white suburban folk talking about bike lanes. The fact that even 20% of that said spend more is amazing to me.

[ken0042]

Originally Posted by peter12

Given that the mean age of Calgary is 36.4, and that 60% of people under 35 exclusively use cell phones, I would say that her observation has a ring of truth to it.

If the mean age of Calgary is 36.4, and the survey was only open to people 18 and over (which is usually the first question I get asked on a phone survey), but excluding ~200,000 Calgarians 17 and under, I'd say it's a pretty fair representation.

And I got 200,000 Calgarians 17 and under based on 160,000 kids enrolled at the two school boards, and added another 40,000 for kids under 5.

I would be curious to see where you got that 60% of people under 35 do not have a land line in their house.

[jammies]

Originally Posted by Regorium

The other hilarious demographic is that apparently 24% of people surveyed made more than $150,000 a year.

Rich white suburban folk talking about bike lanes. The fact that even 20% of that said spend more is amazing to me.

So they polled CP, and the other 76% were "between $100,001 to $149,999"?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by ken0042

If the mean age of Calgary is 36.4, and the survey was only open to people 18 and over (which is usually the first question I get asked on a phone survey), but excluding ~200,000 Calgarians 17 and under, I'd say it's a pretty fair representation.

And I got 200,000 Calgarians 17 and under based on 160,000 kids enrolled at the two school boards, and added another 40,000 for kids under 5.

I would be curious to see where you got that 60% of people under 35 do not have a land line in their house.

Yeah, but you have still only eliminated one of the tails (bottom 20%, right), and given that 24% of the survey was of households making over $150,000, you have skewed it even further right.

Data is from Stats Canada 2013 Telephone Survey. The number is probably even higher now.

http://www.statcan.gc.ca/daily-quoti...40623a-eng.htm

Anyway, it is all moot given that the cycle paths are paid for by all taxpayers, and not just young people living downtown.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Regorium

The other hilarious demographic is that apparently 24% of people surveyed made more than $150,000 a year.

Rich white suburban folk talking about bike lanes. The fact that even 20% of that said spend more is amazing to me.

Really? They asked those polled their race? I think its hilarious because some of the highest wages are surely in Mount Royal, Elbow Park and those far flung areas of the city.

[ken0042]

Assuming people answered their income accurately.

[Regorium]

Originally Posted by Slava

Really? They asked those polled their race? I think its hilarious because some of the highest wages are surely in Mount Royal, Elbow Park and those far flung areas of the city.

http://www.calgary.ca/cfod/csc/Docum...ion_Survey.pdf

The demographics are the last 3 slides.

Also do note that they did correct for age and quadrant (NE/NW/SE/SW) to match the city of calgary demographics. Not sure why they didn't extend that into race and income.

The "white" part comes from the fact that 80% said that they were not a visible minority.

Edit: For the bike lane stuff, the actual question and results are shown on slide 49.

[Bill Bumface]

Who cares what anyone thinks. It will take several years of a real network to find out their true benefit.