Uber, your thoughts ?

[Resolute 14]

In short, like everything else Uber, their valuation is a lie.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by jammies

What do I think? 40 billion dollar valuation for a company that, more or less, has a mobile app and business practices that make Russian oil barons blanch?

I think the stock market is full of idiots, that is what I think.

They make an incredible amount of money. Their valuation isn't that out to lunch.

[Canehdianman]

Originally Posted by jammies

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jonathan...ers-valuation/

This article indicates that private investors are the ones being rooked into thinking it's worth 40 billion. Most telling is this quote:

"...the people who stand to make the most money are the ones providing the public estimates of its value."

In other words, it's valued that way because everyone agrees they can make a lot of money if it's valued that way. Cozy.

I'm not sure I understand your point. Their valuation is determined by what people are willing to pay to invest in them. Its the same as a publicly traded company (only their valuation isn't updated by the second throughout the day)

[Dan02]

Originally Posted by Azure

They make an incredible amount of money. Their valuation isn't that out to lunch.

do they though?

Did you read the link that was posted a couple posts up?

[jammies]

Originally Posted by Canehdianman

I'm not sure I understand your point. Their valuation is determined by what people are willing to pay to invest in them. Its the same as a publicly traded company (only their valuation isn't updated by the second throughout the day)

My point is that the valuation is based on the valuation. Nobody knows how much they really make. They don't have any patents on their business practices. They have no tangible assets, and this is seen as positive instead of a negative. They aren't even the only company in the business. They have all kinds of negative publicity around them that makes their "brand" a suspect asset.

It's a cabal. The old boys' club. Investment bankers creating value out of nothing.

They have a mobile app, customers, and a brand. Is that really worth $40 billion dollars? If it is, Microsoft should be worth 4 trillion, or 40 trillion, or some other absurd number that bears no relation to the return on investment you're going to get from actual profits and dividends from the company.

[Canehdianman]

I think whoever wrote that article is a moron. If some people are willing to pay $1.2 billion to invest in Uber for a small slice of it, that makes it worth $40B.

[jammies]

Companies aren't works of art, there is an objective value - theoretically based on how many assets it has, how much profit it can make, and how much growth it is likely to see - as well as a subjective value involved. The idea that things are worth what someone is willing to pay for them is nice and all, but is only partly applicable to things that actually have utility, not just circularly-derived value.

Of course, since the early 80s the entire basis of investing has been "how much can I flip my investments for?" and not "how much profit will my investments make me in dividends?". Concepts like utility and profit only distract us from churning out vast amounts of imaginary value, so go Uber go!

[username]

Originally Posted by nik-

I hate the taxi commission too, but Uber is kind of a piece of #### company who takes zero responsibility for even the product that they help sell.

The answer needs to be looser restriction on taxi licenses, not an app that lets some person who has absolutely zero passenger transport insurance, or requirements for car maintenance drive around picking people up.

I disagree - let comsumers decide on what service they want. It took me 45 minutes to get a cab on Saturday after the game....that's unreal. In San Francisco you wouldn't wait 4 minutes for an Uber.

I would take Uber 10 times out of 10 over a cab in Calgary. At least you know what you're getting when you request an Uber/Lyft. With a cab you have no idea what the driver is like or who he is. With Uber you know because you can check out their information and previous trip ratings to see what they are like. I also love the fact that you can see where they are when they are picking you up so you know exactly when you need to be ready.

Anyway, I think I might be venting after having to wait so long for something that shouldn't be an issue.

[ExiledFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by username

I disagree - let comsumers decide on what service they want. It took me 45 minutes to get a cab on Saturday after the game....that's unreal. In San Francisco you wouldn't wait 4 minutes for an Uber.

I would take Uber 10 times out of 10 over a cab in Calgary. At least you know what you're getting when you request an Uber/Lyft. With a cab you have no idea what the driver is like or who he is. With Uber you know because you can check out their information and previous trip ratings to see what they are like. I also love the fact that you can see where they are when they are picking you up so you know exactly when you need to be ready.

Anyway, I think I might be venting after having to wait so long for something that shouldn't be an issue.

Agreed. The more competition the better to end this taxi cartel monopoly.

[Cobra Jet]

Uber is an awesome service, Ive used it many times in Houston. Service is quick and easy to use. Plus it puts money into the hands of drivers who can make their own hours. Its a win win for everyone except the monopoly known as the taxi service.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Dan02

do they though?

Did you read the link that was posted a couple posts up?

There were rumors that they would hit $10 billion in revenue by the end of next year with $2 billion in net revenue. Their growth is also pretty crazy.

http://www.businessinsider.com/ubers-revenue-2014-11

Of course, that still doesn't mean they are not run by a bunch of d-bags. But they are being very successful. Have to think that the way to force their service into markets where there are regulatory issues is the only way to force disruption. I have no problem with that part as the taxi commission is a joke.

[Iceman90]

I think it'd be good to have a local, home grown ride share solution pop up in Calgary, as opposed to Uber. What a mess that company has become.

[Canehdianman]

Uber already has a strong Calgary connection.

Garrett Camp, one of its founders is from Calgary. Got his engineering degrees from the U of C.

[Dan02]

Originally Posted by Azure

There were rumors that they would hit $10 billion in revenue by the end of next year with $2 billion in net revenue. Their growth is also pretty crazy.

http://www.businessinsider.com/ubers-revenue-2014-11

Of course, that still doesn't mean they are not run by a bunch of d-bags. But they are being very successful. Have to think that the way to force their service into markets where there are regulatory issues is the only way to force disruption. I have no problem with that part as the taxi commission is a joke.

agreed fantastic oppourtunity for growth but IMO it's also going to be a high competition low profit market as the market matures and competitors come online and taxi commisions start to adapt to preserve market share. It's also a very unregulated space at the moment which will probably change at it attracts more and more attention, increasing costs and putting downward pressure on profits.

They claim their revenue will increase because their 5 mature markets generate most of their revenue but those mature markets also happen to be some of the best setups for them. How many Cedar Rapids(one of their 150ish served cities) will it take to equal the profits of one NYC?? 1000??

What happens if NYC or London ban the service? instant 10 billion drop in valuation?

How high to these latest investors think Uber can go if they put their money in at a 40 billion valuation?

IMO tons of questions left to the be answered and IMO the CEO is one of the least of them even if he is a ######, to channel my inner kevin o'leary, money doesn't care.

I'd be interested to see what if any money they made off that $2 billion in net revenue, wouldn't be suprised if it's 0.

I forsee the amount they are going to spend on legal fees and lobbying as they spread is going to be astronomical. they probably be better off just sticking to cities with high urban populations rather then trying to reach every little city as well. Plus the cost of customer acquisition.

[troutman]

I liked the Colectivos (share taxis) in Latin America.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Share_taxi

[Azure]

Have to think that an opportunity for another company with better customer service and filled with less d-bags has opened up, as up till now Uber looked pretty unstoppable.

Only a matter of time till the taxi commissions in different cities fall. Too much money being thrown at companies like Uber.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Dan02

agreed fantastic oppourtunity for growth but IMO it's also going to be a high competition low profit market as the market matures and competitors come online and taxi commisions start to adapt to preserve market share. It's also a very unregulated space at the moment which will probably change at it attracts more and more attention, increasing costs and putting downward pressure on profits.

They claim their revenue will increase because their 5 mature markets generate most of their revenue but those mature markets also happen to be some of the best setups for them. How many Cedar Rapids(one of their 150ish served cities) will it take to equal the profits of one NYC?? 1000??

What happens if NYC or London ban the service? instant 10 billion drop in valuation?

How high to these latest investors think Uber can go if they put their money in at a 40 billion valuation?

IMO tons of questions left to the be answered and IMO the CEO is one of the least of them even if he is a ######, to channel my inner kevin o'leary, money doesn't care.

I'd be interested to see what if any money they made off that $2 billion in net revenue, wouldn't be suprised if it's 0.

I forsee the amount they are going to spend on legal fees and lobbying as they spread is going to be astronomical. they probably be better off just sticking to cities with high urban populations rather then trying to reach every little city as well. Plus the cost of customer acquisition.

I'm guessing they don't actual turn much of a profit either, but as the first to the line, they have a great chance of becoming very successful.

I'm actually surprised by some of the negative comments in this thread. Sure, their CEO is a dirtbag, and some of their higher ups are as well, but it is hard to believe that all their employees are. If they get proper guidance from their investors, they could turn around their culture. Money talks in bot ways and you'd have to think their investors will pressure the CEO and others to change.

Makes the success of Google even more incredible considering how successful they were, and how they managed to do all of that without coming across as dbags.

[shermanator]

You know what's even more frustrating than the city only handing out 126 new taxi licenses? The ones they handed out aren't on the streets yet! As of last Thursday, only 37 of the 126 are actually on the damn streets!

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...s-party-season

[ExiledFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by shermanator

You know what's even more frustrating than the city only handing out 126 new taxi licenses? The ones they handed out aren't on the streets yet! As of last Thursday, only 37 of the 126 are actually on the damn streets!

http://calgaryherald.com/news/local-...s-party-season

Pathetic.

I wonder how often non existent cabs directly lead to drunk driving. This is becoming a safety issue.

[Flames89]

On another note about Uber, on average the Uber taxis have been FAR nicer than the average taxi. Some taxis here in Toronto are pretty beat up and/or smell like death. Uber cars on average are much nicer.

Additionally, they do neat promotions. Order a poutine (http://blog.uber.com/Poutine), take a water taxi/boat instead of drinking and boating (http://blog.uber.com/tag/muskoka/), etc.

Their management may be ######s, but the product they are offering is great.