[Rumour] Sportak: Flames are trying to add second top-10 pick

[Coach]

^^^ The "Thanks" button is your friend.

[FBI]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I'd switch Poirier for Baertschi in the don't wanna move list.

Good point, forgot to add Poirier to this list. Still keeping baertschi on it though.

[Badgers Nose]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Bennett + Ritchie

Very cool.



With the organization's desire to get bigger, they could be using Sven/Backlund as pieces in order to add a prospect (Ritchie) that addresses a need they feel needs addressing.

And then Hunter Smith later on.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

I'd think Granlund, Baertschi, the 2nds and 3rds are among our most valuable expendable assets along with the obvious roster players

[Yamer]

Unpopular opinion alert!:

I'm not sold on Sven, despite his progress towards the end of the season in the A. If a package including him can get you another top pick in this draft then trade him.

[FakenHaken]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I'd think Granlund, Baertschi, the 2nds and 3rds are among our most valuable expendable assets along with the obvious roster players

I agree which is why I'm thinking Granlund + 34 OA to Carolina for 7th OA. May have to add to this with a b level prospect or exchange of roster players. I'm probably putting too much value on Granlund. My thoughts are lets say you draft one of Reinhart or Bennett at 4th OA which I think is a much better option in your top six than Granlund. Granlund as a top six in the Western Conference has got a whole lot of work. He's talented enough but not able to match up very well against the top two lines. Simply not suited for 3rd Line or 4th Line in my opinion. Use that 7th OA for Ritchie maybe and 3 years from now you are closer to being a contender than with Granlund.

[bax]

I can't believe how many people are okay with trading sven, but are appalled when it comes to trading gaudreau. They are equal in my mind. Sven absolutely dominated junior before making the jump. Lets just please keep both and develop our own talent

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by Yamer

Unpopular opinion alert!:

I'm not sold on Sven, despite his progress towards the end of the season in the A. If a package including him can get you another top pick in this draft then trade him.

I think this misses the mark. If another GM isn't sold on Baertschi then he's not being moved, that's such a contradictory statement. Yes trade him to get a top pick, but because he has value not because he doesn't which he invariably does. Sven has potential to play top 2 line minutes if he reaches that potential. He has playmaking ability, great eye hand and soft hands all of which are incredibly difficult to teach.

He just lacks the confidence and work ethic to be more solid on the puck as well as backchecking tenaciously enough (which is pretty much required to be on the flames). Odds are eventually he matures and develops his natural talents into a 2nd line player. We want a top line power forward and hopefully the other gm's recognize Sven's potential.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by bax

I can't believe how many people are okay with trading sven, but are appalled when it comes to trading gaudreau. They are equal in my mind. Sven absolutely dominated junior before making the jump. Lets just please keep both and develop our own talent

I think Gaudreau has a much better chance of becoming a legit 1st line, star player.

Baertschi is trending towards 2nd line type IMO. Dominating junior is not the same as dominating pro. Gaudreau at the world championships looked way ahead of Baertschi in pro IMO.

[belsarius]

Originally Posted by bax

I can't believe how many people are okay with trading sven, but are appalled when it comes to trading gaudreau. They are equal in my mind. Sven absolutely dominated junior before making the jump. Lets just please keep both and develop our own talent

Absolutely develop our own talent. But if management thinks the talent they can develop with another top 10 pick is going to be better than the talent Baertschi has then why not. It's not like we are talking of trading him for Olli Jokinen.

[_Q_]

Originally Posted by FakenHaken

I agree which is why I'm thinking Granlund + 34 OA to Carolina for 7th OA. May have to add to this with a b level prospect or exchange of roster players. I'm probably putting too much value on Granlund. My thoughts are lets say you draft one of Reinhart or Bennett at 4th OA which I think is a much better option in your top six than Granlund. Granlund as a top six in the Western Conference has got a whole lot of work. He's talented enough but not able to match up very well against the top two lines. Simply not suited for 3rd Line or 4th Line in my opinion. Use that 7th OA for Ritchie maybe and 3 years from now you are closer to being a contender than with Granlund.

As much as I think draft picks are over rated, I seriously doubt Carolina trades #7 for that package.

Generally, teams trade their firsts for a great "now" player. As much as I like Granlund, he's not enough to make Carolina give up their first, even with a second rounder included.

Think about it. Would you, as a Flames fan, have been OK with Feaster trading #6 for another team's Granlund plus a second rounder?

[DJones]

Imagine if Ekblad pulled a Seth Jones and we ended up with him and then we also got Ritchie.

Our height and weight averages would get quite the boost Haha

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by bax

I can't believe how many people are okay with trading sven, but are appalled when it comes to trading gaudreau. They are equal in my mind. Sven absolutely dominated junior before making the jump. Lets just please keep both and develop our own talent

Ohhh, but how wrong you are.

Gaudreau is in a whole other league of talent/IQ. One with very select company. Sven is highly skilled, no doubt. But JG has franchise player talent. His size/uncertainty is the only thing that keeps them remotely on the same level.

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by bax

I can't believe how many people are okay with trading sven, but are appalled when it comes to trading gaudreau. They are equal in my mind. Sven absolutely dominated junior before making the jump. Lets just please keep both and develop our own talent

Johnny has the ability to take control of the play and is by far the most talented player we've had since Theo Fleury or Iginla. I'm not saying he'll reach their accomplishments but he has the hands and vision of elite players.

[Yamer]

Originally Posted by bax

I can't believe how many people are okay with trading sven, but are appalled when it comes to trading gaudreau. They are equal in my mind. Sven absolutely dominated junior before making the jump. Lets just please keep both and develop our own talent

I would definitely be willing to give Sven more of a chance. However, I have seen him play now at the Junior, Minor, and Pro level and I am just not convinced that he has the capacity to reach the ceiling he is projected at. As for the Gaudreau = Sven argument I don't buy it. Johnny has shown more to me playing against men (NCAA, World Championships) than Sven has against the same. Much more excited about Johnny Hockey than Baertschi.

Originally Posted by AcGold

I think this misses the mark. If another GM isn't sold on Baertschi then he's not being moved, that's such a contradictory statement. Yes trade him to get a top pick, but because he has value not because he doesn't which he invariably does. Sven has potential to play top 2 line minutes if he reaches that potential. He has playmaking ability, great eye hand and soft hands all of which are incredibly difficult to teach.

He just lacks the confidence and work ethic to be more solid on the puck as well as backchecking tenaciously enough (which is pretty much required to be on the flames). Odds are eventually he matures and develops his natural talents into a 2nd line player. We want a top line power forward and hopefully the other gm's recognize Sven's potential.

It's not contradictory at all because I have no way of evaluating his value to any GM or scout inside or outside of this organization. I said that I wasn't sold on him, but if there is another GM that disagrees and is willing to take a flyer on him in a package for a top pick this year then it won't break my heart to see him in another team's silks.

There is no denying that the skill is there. I think we have all seen glimpses of it. I am just not convinced, and have grown less so over the past years, that he will be able to be that effective top 6 forward most of us saw in him the first year after being drafted. Odds are not in favor either way of him becoming a top flight forward or an on again/off again Swiss League veteran.

[FakenHaken]

Originally Posted by _Q_

As much as I think draft picks are over rated, I seriously doubt Carolina trades #7 for that package.

Generally, teams trade their firsts for a great "now" player. As much as I like Granlund, he's not enough to make Carolina give up their first, even with a second rounder included.

Think about it. Would you, as a Flames fan, have been OK with Feaster trading #6 for another team's Granlund plus a second rounder?

Problem is Feaster would, and I'm not even kidding about that. Another problem is that for the same reasons I'm thinking of trading Granlund he doesn't work on Carolina with the Staal Brothers occupying those two spots. Oh well back to arm chair GM'ing and 5:00 can't come soon enough.

[ForeverFlameFan]

It's not like we are trading Sven for scraps, we are getting another top 10 pick for this rebuild. I know we've put a lot of time into Sven, but if he can get us a top 15 pick, I'm all for it too.

[AcGold]

Originally Posted by Yamer

I would definitely be willing to give Sven more of a chance. However, I have seen him play now at both the Junior, Minor, and Pro level and I am just not convinced that he has the capacity to reach the ceiling he is projected at. As for the Gaudreau = Sven argument I don't buy it. Johnny has shown more to me playing against men (NCAA, World Championships) than Sven has against the same. Much more excited about Johnny Hockey than Baertschi.



It's not contradictory at all because I have no way of evaluating his value to any GM or scout inside or outside of this organization. I said that I wasn't sold on him, but if there is another GM that disagrees and is willing to take a flyer on him in a package for a top pick this year then it won't break my heart to see him in another team's silks.

There is no denying that the skill is there. I think we have all seen glimpses of it. I am just not convinced, and have grown less so over the past years, that he will be able to be that effective top 6 forward most of us saw in him the first year after being drafted. Odds are not in favor either way of him becoming a top flight forward or an on again/off again Swiss League veteran.

I understand. Reason I think Sven will make it is because he has a desire to make it and he has natural tools that most players in the NHL don't have. What he needs now is to mature and realize that all he has are natural tools right now and that his game is drastically more underdeveloped than he thought. If he had the natural talents of Backlund then I'd be more skeptical. If we could just combine the work ethic of Backlund with the skill of Sven we'd have something special.

[SuperMatt18]

I still like Sven and think he can be a great NHL player, but if a team wants to flip a top 10 pick for him I think I would do it.

[bax]

I hear what everyone is saying, but the NHL is an entirely different beats than the NCAA and the world championships. Don't get me wrong, I'm super excited about Johnny and see the potential I just don't think it should be a massive Johnny >>>Sven argument. Sven had an off year, but he is a young player and only a 13th overall pick. These types of player take time. We've put in this much development time already, I just think the best option is to keep both and stay the course