[Trade] Luongo (15% retained salary) traded to Panthers for Jacob Markstrom & Shawn Matthias

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

Could have. But Schneider had other issues. He wasn't traded just to help clean up the Luongo mess. Management had other issues with him, rightly or wrongly, and decided Lack was the one to go with for the future.

bad decision, Gillis likely won't be around for long anyway

[Jacks]

Originally Posted by 19Yzerman19

Basically, the Canucks' cap benefit on this contract is $8.5M.

Not an expert on recapture penalties but does it end there?
Luongo is still being paid more than his cap hit until 2017 - 2018, if the Canucks are retaining some of that salary then they should still be accumulating recapture penalty no?

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by dino7c

bad decision, Gillis likely won't be around for long anyway

No, but that trade isn't the issue. Lack is going to be a good goalie, so I am not upset with that and if they saw something in Schneider that had them worried, then so be it. Whether it is a mistake will be seen in the years to come, but choosing one player over another can't be judged this early.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

No, but that trade isn't the issue. Lack is going to be a good goalie, so I am not upset with that and if they saw something in Schneider that had them worried, then so be it. Whether it is a mistake will be seen in the years to come, but choosing one player over another can't be judged this early.

They didn't choose Lack over Schnider....they ####ed up. They thought they would be a contender this year with Lou and they aren't

they blew it

my thoughts

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

I am also glad we got more than a 2nd rounder that was offered by the Leafs last year.

Did you though?

Matthias is a big, 26 year old, 30pt guy.

Markstrom is huge, but career stats are pathetic.


I feel like the Canucks just traded Luongo for Joe Colborne and Henrik Karlsson.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

I want to pass along my condolences.

I can count on one hand the amount of Vancouver Canucks fans that I've met or interacted with that I've liked personally who weren't d-bag hockey fans (lots of great people are bad fans so I want to make the distinction).

You are a good fan, a great poster and I can only assume your good qualities are applicable to you as a person as well. You don't deserve the clown show that is the Canucks head office.

I take great joy in watching the Canucks implode but I do understand there is collateral damage. On behalf of Flames fans i am sorry you have to suffer.

I'd rather go through this now than drag it out and try to keep drawing blood from a stone.

It's gonna suck, but if they make the right moves and get the stone rolling again in two years it won't be too bad. It's preferable to watching the same group of guys lose for the same reasons in a slightly more embarrassing fashion each time.

Two president's trophies and a trip to the finals. Not quite enough but a great ride. Start again, build around what you keep and add new parts.

Could be worse. Could be an Oiler's fan.

Originally Posted by dino7c

They didn't choose Lack over Schnider....they ####ed up. They thought they would be a contender this year with Lou and they aren't

they blew it

my thoughts

Internal thoughts from some people who have a proven track record say that Lack was chosen over Schneider. Lack then got hurt, so they wanted to wait to see how he rebounded. Cap issues came up, so they made the Schneider move earlier than they'd like. Not the best situation, but not the knee jerk reaction it was thought to be at the time.

[Henry Fool]

Matthias is a quality bottom-6 forward with speed and size and I'm sure the Panthers had other teams expressing interest.

But of course the trade is about Markström. Florida watched him falter this season and had serious doubts about him. Another bad season and he wouldn't have much value at all. Florida sold while they still could and Luongo is a tremendous return.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

Did you though?

Matthias is a big, 26 year old, 30pt guy.

Markstrom is huge, but career stats are pathetic.


I feel like the Canucks just traded Luongo for Joe Colborne and Henrik Karlsson.

They traded Lou (15% retained salary and likely cap penalties) and Schnider for:
Matthias
Markstrom
Horvat

I don't know how anyone can try and spin this disaster

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

Originally Posted by dino7c

They traded Lou (15% retained salary and likely cap penalties) and Schnider for:
Matthias
Markstrom
Horvat

I don't know how anyone can try and spin this disaster

Agreed terrible management of what was potentially the best 1 - 2 in the league, now they have neither and not enough to show for it IMO.

[Enoch Root]

The problem with this trade isn't the return (which is marginal), it is that they traded Scheider first.

Had they not ****ed up the Luongo situation, they could have moved him out for some similar, marginal return and gotten the cap space benefit from that. They then would have had Schneider (entering his prime) and Lack (young and promising) as their goaltending tandem. They could have then spent the cap space trying to support their core.

Instead, they drag their feet with Luongo, creating a massive mess with fans, and then - after one bad playoff series - panic and move Schneider.

Now they are left with Lack, who they have to throw into the #1 position WAY before he is ready, knowing the fans on the left coast are insane and will throw him under the bus after two bad starts.

Massive, massive failure by Gillis.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Quincy Egg

MAF once was a back-up for Team Canada.

yeah, but was it 9 days ago?

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by dino7c

They traded Lou (15% retained salary and likely cap penalties) and Schnider for:
Matthias
Markstrom
Horvat

I don't know how anyone can try and spin this disaster

It isn't a disaster yet. It easily can be. It depends what these guys become. Matthias gets more consistant, markstrom plays at an NHL level and horvat develops and we're happy. That doesn't happen? Then yeah, disaster.

[opendoor]

Schneider would be of little use if the Sedins are scoring at 55 point paces and Kesler is scoring at a 45-50 point pace. I don't really see how the Canucks' long term fortunes would be better if they had Schneider right now given that their real problems lie elsewhere.

[cam_wmh]

shamed

[opendoor]

Nm

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Blaster86

I'd rather go through this now than drag it out and try to keep drawing blood from a stone.

It's gonna suck, but if they make the right moves and get the stone rolling again in two years it won't be too bad. It's preferable to watching the same group of guys lose for the same reasons in a slightly more embarrassing fashion each time.

Two president's trophies and a trip to the finals. Not quite enough but a great ride. Start again, build around what you keep and add new parts.

Could be worse. Could be an Oiler's fan.



Internal thoughts from some people who have a proven track record say that Lack was chosen over Schneider. Lack then got hurt, so they wanted to wait to see how he rebounded. Cap issues came up, so they made the Schneider move earlier than they'd like. Not the best situation, but not the knee jerk reaction it was thought to be at the time.

Doesn't really pass the smell test though does it? They gave Schneider a contract for 4m/year just a season before. He then had a good year, while Lack struggled/was injured in the minors and they decided Lack was better? Sounds like spin from the front office.

[cam_wmh]

#####. wrong calculation.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by opendoor

Schneider would be of little use if the Sedins are scoring at 55 point paces and Kesler is scoring at a 45-50 point pace. I don't really see how the Canucks' long term fortunes would be better if they had Schneider right now given that their real problems lie elsewhere.

Depends - is it a retool or a rebuild?

If you're tearing it all down, then a tandom of Lack and Markstrom is fine.

But if you have the Sedins and Bieksa and Hamhuis and Burrows and... you now have one glaring hole in your lineup.

Gillis re-signed the Sedins what - 3 or 4 months ago? They were a contending team in DECEMBER. One bad month and GIllis is in full panic mode.

Edit: sorry, two bad months. Regardless, sounds like a hell of a plan he's got going there

[Flash Walken]

Schneider was obviously moved because of non-hockey related issues.

The Canucks didn't decide to go with the older goalie who doesn't want to be there over the younger, better goalie they had just signed. That wasn't a team building decision. It was an unplanned for scrambled decision.

I think the decision to move Luongo was under similar duress, namely, "trade me right tucking now."

[opendoor]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Depends - is it a retool or a rebuild?

If you're tearing it all down, then a tandom of Lack and Markstrom is fine.

But if you have the Sedins and Bieksa and Hamhuis and Burrows and... you now have one glaring hole in your lineup.

Gillis re-signed the Sedins what - 3 or 4 months ago? They were a contending team in DECEMBER. One bad month and GIllis is in full panic mode.

Edit: sorry, two bad months. Regardless, sounds like a hell of a plan he's got going there

Nothing they've done this year has suggested they thought they were a contender. Trading futures was never an option and they'd just come off a summer where they traded their most valuable asset for a draft pick.

If the Sedins come back and prove they're 1st liners again and the rest of the team proves it can score at a competent level then you worry about goaltending. Until then though, it's a secondary concern to the team's bigger problems. If the Sedins aren't better than they've shown this year then it will likely be a full rebuild rather than a retool. If they are still 70+ point guys who just had off years and Lack doesn't provide starter caliber goaltending then you find someone else. 7 of the top 10 goalies in terms of sv% this year have been traded or signed as UFAs in the last few years, so it's not like it's impossible to get competent goaltending if you're willing to pay the price.

And it hasn't been 2 bad months; it has been 1 good month. Outside of December they have an 18-24-8 record. For all their faults, I'm glad management has a reasonable idea of what the team is likely capable of this year rather than thinking they can paper over the team's holes.