Is Edmonton intentionally tanking?

[Pliddy]

I know that this could also go in the Edmonton is no good thread, but I really think this needs to be discussed in addition to the fact that the Oilers blow goats.

While I am extemely proud of the way this team has approached the rebuild, and I loved the effort tonight, plus anytime Monahan scores I am happy, but the fact of the matter is these points are not helping us, as we now are 5 points up on 2nd overall. As I see this lunchbox crew, win tonight based on hard work and being too proud to see the home winless streak get any longer. I can't help but think "Why can't Edmonton do this?". The fact of the matter is, as much as I like to crap on Edmonton, thier roster is filled with real NHL players, guys who have been elite in almost all levels of hockey, several who were highly sought off draft picks and at least 6 or 7 that would have 25+ teams interested if they were shopped around. The point is you cannot reach thier levels unless you have a very high level of compete and personal pride attatched to you. That's what got them there ,yet upon arrival it seems to dissapear so universally that the only explanation is that the organization must have thrown in the towel and has given these former elite players reasons to lose, and my gut feeling says that this happened sometime in early December . What are your thoughts

[Hugh Jahrmes]

Yes

[Trailer Fire]

Just ask the "Edmonton is no good" thread.

[Dion]

They don't have the talent and coaching to get moving up in the standings. It's a 6 ring circus from the top to the bottom.

[btimbit]

I don't think it's intentional, I think management is just that incompetent.

[Yrebmi]

Ha. Possibly now, but losing most certainly was not intentional at the start of the season. It just came natural. Any claim to the contrary now, is just Pee Wee's meant to do that.

[macrov]

I agree that they have a very good top 6 or top 9 or even top 12. The forwards are above avg and the goaltending is average.

But...the defense is awful. They have 3 defensemen who would slot into a 5-6 spot. And 3 AHL caliber defensemen. On top of that the forwards don't play a good 2 way game.

Aka bad coaching and bad management

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[Caged Great]

They sucked to start the year, so they traded one of their only good defensemen to the team that they knew was going to be in competition with for the better pick.

Seems a bit like tanking to me.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Dion

They don't have the talent and coaching to get moving up in the standings. It's a 6 ring circus from the top to the bottom.

They have talent, they don't have a balanced roster. Their team is poorly built into a group of individuals who are all taking it upon themselves to do it all on their own. They don't play as a team, they only have one element of a successful team. They have good skill, but their defense, size, grit are lacking immensely.

[codynw]

No. I genuinely believe they are trying their best. They are just no good.

[Galakanokis]

Losing is contagious. The oilers have caught it from the bottom of the organization to the top. Once it seeps in and grabs a firm hold it can suck the very life out of you. This is what the Flames are battling against. I know wins "suck" for the rebuild but you have to do whatever you can to not let the losing creep in.

The oilers are to far gone, major changes are need to kill the virus of losing. I don't think another elite prospect will help at all, he will be powerless to stop the suckage.

Not intentional at all, Lowe and company really do believe it will magically turn itself around.

[nik-]

We could lose every remaining game and Edmonton still wouldn't catch us. They've already started the Ekblad PR campaign. Now Eakins comes out and states that he could be fired if they don't get it together pretty much ensuring all those kids up there are going to mail it in the rest of the year. They're in full Oiler mode. Anyone who was hoping for Ekblad, just accept it now, it's over.

[Hockey Fan #751]

Originally Posted by macrov

I agree that they have a very good top 6 or top 9 or even top 12. The forwards are above avg and the goaltending is average.

But...the defense is awful. They have 3 defensemen who would slot into a 5-6 spot. And 3 AHL caliber defensemen. On top of that the forwards don't play a good 2 way game.

Aka bad coaching and bad management

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

I agree about the forwards, I think it's a pretty good group for the most part. I also think they're getting better at the defensive side.

Goaltending is below average, well below average, probably the worst in the NHL. Last season, the team goals-against for the Oilers was 2.71. This year it's 3.45. The second worst team in the NHL is the Islanders at 3.19 and Calgary is third worst at 3.10. That's how bad it is.

If the Oilers even matched their GAA from last year, they would have allowed 50 less goals. That's one less goal against per game almost.

The defence is also worst in the NHL. They have a 4-5 in Justin Schultz, a 4-5 in Jeff Petry and a 5-6 in Andrew Ference. Everyone else should be playing in the AHL.

The other problem for the Oilers is that they have zero prospects. Absolutely everyone on their farm team will be lucky to be a fourth line forward or third pairing defenceman. Plus, all their draft picks except maybe Darnell Nurse is projecting the same way. So the only way they can get better is if they move some of their top forwards for defence help.

Unfortunately for them, all that's going to do is shift their issues from defence to forward.

You look at the forwards they have: Eberle, Hall, Nugent-Hopkins, Perron, Yakupov, Gagner, Hemsky. Hemsky will be gone at the deadline for a 2nd or 3rd rounder (probably a 3rd), Gagner will be gone at the draft for not a whole lot, maybe in exchange for a bad contract like Clarkson or maybe for an okay defenceman like Hjalmarsson.

Suddenly, there's not a whole lot of scoring firepower. You have the three kids and Perron having to carry the load for the entire team (Yakupov is a wild card).

Oilers are in a world of hurt. And no, they're not trying to lose.

[CaptainCrunch]

They're a team built by people with no clue about how to build a winning team.

They've got decent top 6 wingers, but terrible center depth and a abysmal bottom 6. They're a soft group of forwards that don't have any fight to them

Their blue line might not even be AHL quality.

They have barely average goaltenders who are abandoned night after night.

They have a coach that seems to be fairly clueless

Their star players have gotten velvet handies since day one and are incredibly lazy without the puck

On top of that due to terrible scouting and drafting, their prospect pool has shiveled down to the size of a 1000 year walnut.

On top of that because of their management they're not going to be able to get good free agents, as well any GM worth its salt is going to be in a position of power in trade talks.

Anyone who thinks that merely firing Lowe is going to vault this mess of an organization into competitive hockey is fooling themselves.

This Edmonton team is probably going to have to burn the rot out with a flame thrower and rebuild from the ashes. They might be 5 to 7 years away from being anything.

But are they intentionally tanking? I think thats the wrong question.

[macrov]

Originally Posted by Hockey Fan #751

I agree about the forwards, I think it's a pretty good group for the most part. I also think they're getting better at the defensive side.

Goaltending is below average, well below average, probably the worst in the NHL. Last season, the team goals-against for the Oilers was 2.71. This year it's 3.45. The second worst team in the NHL is the Islanders at 3.19 and Calgary is third worst at 3.10. That's how bad it is.

If the Oilers even matched their GAA from last year, they would have allowed 50 less goals. That's one less goal against per game almost.

The defence is also worst in the NHL. They have a 4-5 in Justin Schultz, a 4-5 in Jeff Petry and a 5-6 in Andrew Ference. Everyone else should be playing in the AHL.

The other problem for the Oilers is that they have zero prospects. Absolutely everyone on their farm team will be lucky to be a fourth line forward or third pairing defenceman. Plus, all their draft picks except maybe Darnell Nurse is projecting the same way. So the only way they can get better is if they move some of their top forwards for defence help.

Unfortunately for them, all that's going to do is shift their issues from defence to forward.

You look at the forwards they have: Eberle, Hall, Nugent-Hopkins, Perron, Yakupov, Gagner, Hemsky. Hemsky will be gone at the deadline for a 2nd or 3rd rounder (probably a 3rd), Gagner will be gone at the draft for not a whole lot, maybe in exchange for a bad contract like Clarkson or maybe for an okay defenceman like Hjalmarsson.

Suddenly, there's not a whole lot of scoring firepower. You have the three kids and Perron having to carry the load for the entire team (Yakupov is a wild card).

Oilers are in a world of hurt. And no, they're not trying to lose.

The GAA is bad because the defensemen are bad and the forwards don't really play defense which exacerbates the problem.

3-4 of those defensemen wouldn't crack the NHL on any other teams roster. When you have ahl defensemen playing 30 minutes a night in the nhl, ur goalies are going to look awful.

You put two top 3 defensemen on that team and have the forwards commit to a 2 way game and the team would be competing for a playoff spot (7-10 in the standings).

[nik-]

Originally Posted by macrov

The GAA is bad because the defensemen are bad and the forwards don't really play defense which exacerbates the problem.

3-4 of those defensemen wouldn't crack the NHL on any other teams roster. When you have ahl defensemen playing 30 minutes a night in the nhl, ur goalies are going to look awful.

You put two top 3 defensemen on that team and have the forwards commit to a 2 way game and the team would be competing for a playoff spot (7-10 in the standings).

Two incredibly hard to obtain pieces and a complete culture change. The Oilers are so f'd.

[CaptainCrunch]

Originally Posted by macrov

The GAA is bad because the defensemen are bad and the forwards don't really play defense which exacerbates the problem.

3-4 of those defensemen wouldn't crack the NHL on any other teams roster. When you have ahl defensemen playing 30 minutes a night in the nhl, ur goalies are going to look awful.

You put two top 3 defensemen on that team and have the forwards commit to a 2 way game and the team would be competing for a playoff spot (7-10 in the standings).

If Edmonton wants 2 top 3 defensemen then Hall or Hopkins or their first round pick is on the way out of town.

And that team still would have terrible center and bottom 6 problems.

They're not as close as your stating.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Pliddy

...The point is you cannot reach thier levels unless you have a very high level of compete and personal pride attatched to you. That's what got them there ,yet upon arrival it seems to dissapear so universally that the only explanation is that the organization must have thrown in the towel and has given these former elite players reasons to lose...

No. That is not the only explanation for the Oilers' magnitude of suck. The other, much more plausible reason is that they are really, honestly, truly THAT bad. Talented forwards, yes. But virtually all of their impact players are supplementary pieces to any other team in the NHL. CC nailed it twice in this thread by pointing to the Oilers' dearth of centre depth. THAT, and their want for NHL quality defensemen is what is killing this team. They are not losing on purpose. They are struggling because Nugent-Hopkins and Gagner form one of the weakest, least intimidating, and ineffective puck possession/distribution units in the entire league.

There is no quick fix to this, and because the Oilers wasted their top picks and their formative years in a hopeless situation, it likely means starting from scratch, and facing down another four or five years of rebuilding to correct the fundamental structural errors committed in shaping the present laughable roster.

[formulate]

Originally Posted by nik-

We could lose every remaining game and Edmonton still wouldn't catch us. They've already started the Ekblad PR campaign. Now Eakins comes out and states that he could be fired if they don't get it together pretty much ensuring all those kids up there are going to mail it in the rest of the year. They're in full Oiler mode. Anyone who was hoping for Ekblad, just accept it now, it's over.

Still a 14.2% chance the Flames win the lottery (assuming the standings hold up as they are). Or even the smaller (larger?) chance that Nylander or Kapanen go on a huge scoring streak and Katz forces MacT to make the 'sexy' pick. Either way fingers crossed.

[stemit14]

I think something that is constantly overlooked is that the oilers might have the lowest hockey IQ in the NHL... It explains a lot of their problems.

They may have talented players in hall, eberle, RNH, gagne, yakupov, Hemsky, and Perron... But when I see the terrible decisions those guys make night after night it becomes obvious that they all have a low hockey IQ. Similar to the problem with butler on the flames. It also explains why changing the coach and the system doesn't seem to help them. These players only seem to be able to play one way and they can't seem to grasp playing differently.

For example, Taylor hall reminds me of the forward version of dion phaneuf... Lots of skill but prone to so many stupid mistakes and doesn't respond to coaches very well.

It is an alarming problem for the oilers cause in most cases, players don't increase their hockey IQ very much. That's why they still suck and will continue to suck as long as their core players are all have low hockey IQ.

And let me be clear... We will see same thing next year. It seems we CP guys are the only ones that can see this... cause nearly every analyst gives this team the benefit of the doubt every season no matter what happens... They are treated like it's only a matter of time before the oilers are dominating the NHL. It's hilarious hearing "this is the year" from these people season after season and I can say without any doubt in my mind that it won't be every time. Nothing will change until they get a huge influx of hockey IQ on this team.