Valeri Nichushkin Discussion

[Dagger]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

That's what the Jankowski pick was all about. What's best long term.

Check out Feaster's record with long term picks. They're busts. Every single one of them.

[Caged Great]

Originally Posted by Dagger

Check out Feaster's record with long term picks. They're busts. Every single one of them.

What was is not an indicator of what is to come.

[zunie75]

I don't understand what the scouts do if there are still questions about a player blocking shots, backchecking, being lazy etc. these guys are on every scouts first round possibilities, so aside from attending games, do they not watch every bit of video available?

I understand that potential is often difficult to judge and that a players personality is much the same, but it just irks me when you hear scouts/analysts discussing the aforementioned unknown variables.

Basically IMO the easiest thing for a scout to do would be able to grade at least the on ice productivity of a potential first round pick.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Dagger

Check out Feaster's record with long term picks. They're busts. Every single one of them.

Ok. So do you want Lindholm Nichushkin or Monahan?

[Bourque's Twin]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Ok. So do you want Lindholm Nichushkin or Monahan?

I think,
Monahan = safest pick
Lindholm = middle point (more risky than Monahan less risky than Nich)
Nichushkin = high risk, only potential 1st liner.

In my opinion, the Flames should gamble on Nichushkin

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

I think,
Monahan = safest pick
Lindholm = middle point (more risky than Monahan less risky than Nich)
Nichushkin = high risk, only potential 1st liner.

In my opinion, the Flames should gamble on Nichushkin

This feels like a bang on assessment, but what do we really know about these guys? Nothing.

I do know that a line of Baertschi and Nichushkin sounds like a nightmare for opposing defences. Particularly that group up the road.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

I think,
Monahan = safest pick
Lindholm = middle point (more risky than Monahan less risky than Nich)
Nichushkin = high risk, only potential 1st liner.

In my opinion, the Flames should gamble on Nichushkin

I feel Lindholm's two way game and ability to move to the wing make him just as safe as Monahan. But yes, Nichushkin is the least safe.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by nik-

I feel Lindholm's two way game and ability to move to the wing make him just as safe as Monahan. But yes, Nichushkin is the least safe.

And who has the highest ceiling? Because I think that's the definition of 'best player available'

[nik-]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

And who has the highest ceiling? Because I think that's the definition of 'best player available'

I really believe that Lindholm has the highest ceiling which is elite playmaker with a relentless two way game. Nichushkin has sizzle, but really this is all based on his size and skating ability, which, granted, is great. I honestly think he's become a bit overrated because of some mystique about a next Kovy. He's not bad in any way, but when some people say he's on the level of MacKinnon and Drouin if he didn't have the KHL baggage, well I just don't see it.

I guess Nichushkin has the highest ceiling based on hype? I dunno.

If Monahan's ceiling is a big number one center who can playmake and is cerebral, well then I see that as a more valuable ceiling too ... I guess the determination of "higher" is what you value more.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

Originally Posted by Bourque's Twin

I think,
Monahan = safest pick
Lindholm = middle point (more risky than Monahan less risky than Nich)
Nichushkin = high risk, only potential 1st liner.

In my opinion, the Flames should gamble on Nichushkin

I think all 3 have the possibility of developing into a 1st line player. Lindholm might be the least risky of the picks IMO as he doesn't have any weaknesses from what I've read but also might have the lowest upside of the three. Monahan still needs to gain leg strength and improve his skating. Most guides think Monahan has 1st line potential. Conroy today was saying Nichushkin hasn't really been taught defense very well.

So you've got the
-big, skilled playmaking centre, good at puck protection, great vision, good shot, good leader, skating still needs a bit of work (Monahan)
-skilled playmaking centre, relentless, two-way, competitive, battles for pucks, good leader, good skating, average size (Lindholm)
-skilled scoring winger, great skating, great size, drives the net, good playmaker, good puck protection, Russian Factor (Nichushkin)

Tough call. I tend to think #1 centres are more important. That said Nichushkin would probably be the best pure talent left at #6.

Monahan seems to be the ideal if the Flames think his skating won't be an issue. Big #1 centre.

Lindholm with his competitiveness, leadership and hockey sense combo seems to fit what I thought the Flames were looking for. Only average size though.

Nichushkin would certainly fit a need as we need size and power on the wings so, so badly as well. I tend to think wingers are slightly less important than centres. I definitely think the Russian Factor has to be a factor for us, especially given our lack of happy Russians on the team that could help his cultural and language transition. His size/talent is impressive, I certainly see why people are drawn to him.

For me heading into the draft I'd rank them:
1. Monahan
2. Lindholm
3. Nichushkin

I prioritize getting a potential #1 centre and minimizing the risk that the player will leave.

If we did draft Nichushkin I'd hope we would acquire a veteran Russian with good character to help him aclimatize.

[kyuss275]

^^^^^
Fully agree that if the flames draft Nichushkin that they will need to acquire another Russian and i don't think pressbox fodder will do in this situation. Look how hard it was for Cervenka and he at least had Hudler.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by nik-

I really believe that Lindholm has the highest ceiling which is elite playmaker with a relentless two way game. Nichushkin has sizzle, but really this is all based on his size and skating ability, which, granted, is great. I honestly think he's become a bit overrated because of some mystique about a next Kovy. He's not bad in any way, but when some people say he's on the level of MacKinnon and Drouin if he didn't have the KHL baggage, well I just don't see it.

I guess Nichushkin has the highest ceiling based on hype? I dunno.

If Monahan's ceiling is a big number one center who can playmake and is cerebral, well then I see that as a more valuable ceiling too ... I guess the determination of "higher" is what you value more.

I don't think we're getting a bad player with any of these guys. The ability to physically dominate the way Nichushkin can is tantalizing. Lindholm looks like he'll be a great player. Monahan seems to be the least electric player of the bunch, and I want someone to get excited over.

It's emotional and possibly foolish but if this team has lacked anything for the past four years, it's emotion.

[PlayfulGenius]

Volchenkov!!

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by kyuss275

^^^^^
Fully agree that if the flames draft Nichushkin that they will need to acquire another Russian and i don't think pressbox fodder will do in this situation. Look how hard it was for Cervenka and he at least had Hudler.

Bryzgalov is available.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Bryzgalov is available.

Thats one way to warp a young mind. Imagine in 3 years Nichushkin giving interviews about the moon, bears, ect because that is all Bryz would talk to him about.LOL.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I think Nichushkin is ranked higher than Lindholm and Monahan on most professional scouting lists out there because Nichushkin has the higher ceiling and higher floor. Out of the 3, he is the most likely to play next year in the NHL - the most 'NHL-ready' of the bunch. His offensive ceiling combined with the physical size he possesses (harder to shut down, ability to dictate play on the ice) is higher.

Lindholm I have often rated as having a higher offensive ceiling than Monahan, and a lot of scouting lists agree with this. However, tough to gauge because of the different leagues and role (Lindholm was playing wing most of last season), and Monahan was the only star forward on a very lousy team.

I don't think the Flames can possibly go wrong here. I hope they manage to jump up a bit and take Barkov - safe, cerebral, big and with a huge ceiling and high floor. Nichushkin I have heard comes with a higher ceiling than Barkov, but Barkov's floor is much higher than Nichushkin's. I personally would prefer the Flames to select Barkov (as I am sure 90%+ of the posters on here would as well).

Moon brought up an interesting point. I haven't seen it touched on any other threads yet - and that will be Feaster's review. I would assume he had some dialogue with Edwards and King. The Flames are in a rebuild. How do people think Feaster's job will be reviewed here? Would the expectation be an increase in points from this upcoming season to the following? Or would it be based upon how the prospects are seemingly doing? I would hope it is more judged on the drafting and development side of things in terms of asset management, rather than standings. Will be interesting to see what happens with management in the next 1-3 years.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I think all 3 have the possibility of developing into a 1st line player. Lindholm might be the least risky of the picks IMO as he doesn't have any weaknesses from what I've read but also might have the lowest upside of the three. Monahan still needs to gain leg strength and improve his skating. Most guides think Monahan has 1st line potential. Conroy today was saying Nichushkin hasn't really been taught defense very well.

So you've got the
-big, skilled playmaking centre, good at puck protection, great vision, good shot, good leader, skating still needs a bit of work (Monahan)
-skilled playmaking centre, relentless, two-way, competitive, battles for pucks, good leader, good skating, average size (Lindholm)
-skilled scoring winger, great skating, great size, drives the net, good playmaker, good puck protection, Russian Factor (Nichushkin)

Tough call. I tend to think #1 centres are more important. That said Nichushkin would probably be the best pure talent left at #6.

Monahan seems to be the ideal if the Flames think his skating won't be an issue. Big #1 centre.

Lindholm with his competitiveness, leadership and hockey sense combo seems to fit what I thought the Flames were looking for. Only average size though.

Nichushkin would certainly fit a need as we need size and power on the wings so, so badly as well. I tend to think wingers are slightly less important than centres. I definitely think the Russian Factor has to be a factor for us, especially given our lack of happy Russians on the team that could help his cultural and language transition. His size/talent is impressive, I certainly see why people are drawn to him.

For me heading into the draft I'd rank them:
1. Monahan
2. Lindholm
3. Nichushkin

I prioritize getting a potential #1 centre and minimizing the risk that the player will leave.

If we did draft Nichushkin I'd hope we would acquire a veteran Russian with good character to help him aclimatize.

I know that there's been a shift to Monahan over the past month but I've been doing more reading on Lindholm and he sounds to me like a Landeskog type player except he's a center. I'm starting to get the feeling that this kid could be a special player. Maybe not the next Crosby but a Jonathan Toews type player. I won't be disappointed at all if he's taken by the Flames at 6.

[PlayfulGenius]

All I know is, one of these 3 is about to be my new favorite player

[dammage79]

Isn't it nice to swoon over three absolutely awesome players at our pick for once? Yeah its no MacKinnon/Drouin/Jones debate but these three kids we get to choose at 6 are awesome. God the draft cannot get under way fast enough.

I agree about Lindholm though, I feel we'll be remiss for not taking him in this draft later on.
Same goes for Monahan and Nichushkin too. The goods we are about to reap has me genuinely excited.

1.Nichushkin
2.Lindholm
3.Monahan

[Calgary4LIfe]

I know 100% that I will have mixed feelings regardless of who the Flames take.

Really excited about the prospect, and also stupid buyer's remorse about not choosing one of the other 2.

Whomever they choose, it will end up being a huge step forward to the organization, and none of these guys will make me 'upset' after the Flames call his name.