[News] Flames offersheet O'Reilly UPDATE: Avs match

[Coach]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

That may be so. It doesn't change that the offer sheet is an overpayment.

It's for basically one season. Look at like we are trading a 1st a 3rd and 2.5 million for Ryan O'Reilly. Doesn't seem so bad.

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by Magnum PEI

I wonder if he remembers them like Tyler Seguin remembers his former classmates.

[Skaloper]

Solid move by Feaster don't worry about draft picks we can get some back if we are out of the playoff hunt with other veterans such as Cammy.

[burnitdown]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Why didn't Parise ask for $14M in free agency?

Just because you qualify a player doesn't mean he'll sign, either. The Avs qualified ROR and he still didn't sign.

The qualifying offer value means nothing. The player can assign any arbitrary value they want to determine how much they will sign for, just as ROR did with the Avalanche. What if ROR asks for $10M in 2 years. Woe is us. What will we do? He's the one who has to sign on the dotted line in the end.

What if Brodie asks for $5M? Will he get it?

The qualifying amount is absolutely meaningless. It's simply a number used to retain RFAs longer so you can negotiate with them more.

The Flames will have an entire year to negotiate with ROR.

I don't think you understand what a qualifying offer is. In order to keep a player a RFA (and not a UFA), a team must qualify them at a certain amount. The player has the option to accept this amount or hold out for more. Clearly, O'Reilly would just accept the QO if the Flames qualified him (unless he suddenly becomes a top 20 player in the league). But if the Flames decline to qualify him, it makes him a UFA. Then he's free game to all teams.

A qualifying offer is not some pie in the sky number of what the player wants. There's a huge difference between what the qualifying offer is and what the player is demanding.

[EddyBeers]

Originally Posted by Fischy13

Flames QO is 6.5, but like Backlund this past year, the player can still agree to less money. Even if the first year has to be 6.5, the subsequent years could be a lot lower bringing his AAV to a reasonable 4-5-6 mil which ever depending on his performance.

Backlund agreed to less because at his age the QO was a 2 way contract, O'Reilly's QO will be a one way contract. He does not have to worry about potentially make 100K a year in the AHL, he will make his QO wherever he ends up playing.

[Captain_Obvious]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

Whoa whoa whoa. Are you saying as of right now, the Flames are likely to make the playoffs?

Where did I say anything like that?

Do you know what a lottery pick is?

We're likely going to pick 8th - 16th.

The chances we pick top 3 are very slim.

[Frank MetaMusil]

Originally Posted by Captain_Obvious

The suggestion that he's a cancer was clearly based off the fact he held out.

Pretty sure moon said this about Turris as well.

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by Captain_Obvious

Where did I say anything like that?

Do you know what a lottery pick is?

We're likely going to pick 8th - 16th.

The chances we pick top 3 are very slim.

Every team who fails to make the playoffs is entered in the lottery. So, do you know what a lottery pick is?

[FacePaint]

For those calling O'Reilly a cancer you have to think that Michel Goulet has a pretty good idea about what kind of player the Flames are trying to sign

[jeffman]

Originally Posted by Captain_Obvious

Where did I say anything like that?

Do you know what a lottery pick is?

We're likely going to pick 8th - 16th.

The chances we pick top 3 are very slim.

So what O reilly was a 2nd rounder and i doubt hes even a #1 center

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I don't see this as a good thing at all. The guy reminds me of Langkow, and I don't mean that in a good way. Sure, some are going to jump all over me and say how awesome Langkow was and how we would be lucky to have a guy turn into someone like him..... Well you know how everyone has been saying that we haven't had a top line center in 20 years.... it's going to be even longer. O'Reilly is going to be a really really good second line center who's going to be forced into a top line role and probably not do that well with it. With the Av's he was behind Stastny, Duchene and playing with some decent others, he wasn't on the top line because they didn't see him as a top line center. If the Avs thought he was a top line center, theyw ould have traded Stastny and kept O'Reilly....they didn't.

I have such a bad feeling that this is going to turn into the Flames giving up a potential franchise player for a second line forward that's being over hyped.

Last year O Reilly was either the #1 or #2 center. Duchene played wing mostly. I agree that O Reilly will be a #2 but a very good #2. By the way Stastny is also a #2.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by burnitdown

I don't think you understand what a qualifying offer is. In order to keep a player a RFA (and not a UFA), a team must qualify them at a certain amount. The player has the option to accept this amount or hold out for more. Clearly, O'Reilly would just accept the QO if the Flames qualified him (unless he suddenly becomes a top 20 player in the league). But if the Flames decline to qualify him, it makes him a UFA. Then he's free game to all teams.

A qualifying offer is not some pie in the sky number of what the player wants. There's a huge difference between what the qualifying offer is and what the player is demanding.

I understand perfectly what a qualifying offer is, but no team is bound to limit themselves to this option. Again, yes, qualifying a player prevents them from becoming a UFA on July 1, 2014. Signing a 3 year deal at $5M per will also prevent him from becoming a UFA.

What benefit does ROR get by holding out on the Flames? He won't get $6.5M in free agency, so the only reason why he'd hold out is to screw over the Flames. Is that really going to happen?

[moon]

Originally Posted by Captain_Obvious

The suggestion that he's a cancer was clearly based off the fact he held out.

I thought it was also based on his dad getting involved and talk about him and Duchene not getting along last year before the holdout. Plus him wanting to come here doesn't nullify reasons why people think he is a cancer because of this holdout.

[M*A*S*H 4077]

Originally Posted by FacePaint

For those calling O'Reilly a cancer you have to think that Michel Goulet has a pretty good idea about what kind of player the Flames are trying to sign

Michel Goulet has reportedly been very involved with the talks

[ricosuave]

its funny, the team gets lambasted for not making moves

the team gets lambasted for making moves.

i have more faith in weisbrod et al that they do know what they are getting

[flamesfan6]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

Every team who fails to make the playoffs is entered in the lottery. So, do you know what a lottery pick is?

yea a weighted lottery (that's odds haven't changed and use the old weighting system) so finishing 8-16th is slow a low chance of getting a top 3 pick.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I don't see this as a good thing at all. The guy reminds me of Langkow, and I don't mean that in a good way. Sure, some are going to jump all over me and say how awesome Langkow was and how we would be lucky to have a guy turn into someone like him..... Well you know how everyone has been saying that we haven't had a top line center in 20 years.... it's going to be even longer. O'Reilly is going to be a really really good second line center who's going to be forced into a top line role and probably not do that well with it. With the Av's he was behind Stastny, Duchene and playing with some decent others, he wasn't on the top line because they didn't see him as a top line center. If the Avs thought he was a top line center, theyw ould have traded Stastny and kept O'Reilly....they didn't.

I have such a bad feeling that this is going to turn into the Flames giving up a potential franchise player for a second line forward that's being over hyped.

1) Odds are the Flames were going to get a 8-15 pick. Picks in that range do not on average produce players as good as Langkow.

2) He's nothing like Langkow. O'Reilly is much bigger. Langkow always had around the same number of give aways as take aways. O'Reilly led the league last year in take aways at 101 and had only 34 give aways.

[Captain_Obvious]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

Every team who fails to make the playoffs is entered in the lottery. So, do you know what a lottery pick is?

Let's not get stuck in semantics here... the percentage is based off the order the teams finish.

If you're suggesting finishing 8th-15th means we should turn down a move like this because it "might" be a first over-all pick... that's completely off the mark and not what's being suggested here at all.

Unless we finish dead last or just outside of that, the chances we're losing McKinnon and/or Jones in this deal are very remote.

[jeffman]

Originally Posted by FacePaint

For those calling O'Reilly a cancer you have to think that Michel Goulet has a pretty good idea about what kind of player the Flames are trying to sign

He's scouting European leagues, I dont think hes involved with o reilly

[WessThompson]

I would have rather seen te Flames dump Iginla, Bouw, etc and rebuild. Clearly that was never going to happen though...so I'm kind of happy. At least it's something, its exciting, and a bold move. It's an attempt to improve the team rather than stand pat. For that I am happy.