flames get 1st overall pick, today who would you pick?

[Poe969]

I think one thing that has to be considered is availability of position. As a few people have mentioned, #1 defensmen are a lot easier to come by than #1 centermen (Flames know about that all too well). If you look at successfull teams, they have a #1 center and may not always have a #1 defenseman but a solid group of good defensmen. If the Flames could give up JayBow for a #1 center, they would be a lot better off with a defense corps that had Wideman or Gio as their #1 guy.

The #1 center position is a lot more valuable than an elite #1 defensman.

[868904]

The season that Drouin is having is pretty special. To be basically the best forward for team Canada at the wjc in his draft year is special, something you usually only see from generational talents. And the season he is having in Halifax with or without Mackinnion is also impressive.

The kid seems to have the greatest skill of the top 4 and also performs at the highest level too. I'd have a real hard time passing on the kid even though our prospect depth on the lw is already stacked with Sven and Johnny.

[you got PHANUEFED]

Jones any day of the week but we then trade that pick for a legit number one center that has it all skill,size and speed.

[Sylvanfan]

What if you're sitting on the third pick, and Jones and MacInnon go in the first two picks. Do you take Barkov because you're desparate for a center, or do you take Drouin who could be the best offensive player in the draft?

[FlamingLonghorn]

Originally Posted by Poe969

I think one thing that has to be considered is availability of position. As a few people have mentioned, #1 defensmen are a lot easier to come by than #1 centermen (Flames know about that all too well). If you look at successfull teams, they have a #1 center and may not always have a #1 defenseman but a solid group of good defensmen. If the Flames could give up JayBow for a #1 center, they would be a lot better off with a defense corps that had Wideman or Gio as their #1 guy.

The #1 center position is a lot more valuable than an elite #1 defensman.

I guess it depends on your definition of elite dman.

[kyuss275]

Tsn announced that the odds of winning the #1 draft selection for this draft will not change. Sounds like they are changing odds for following year. Still any team has a chance at #1, just not a very good chance.

[868904]

I'd probably trade our first rounder for ROR right now and then trade Iggy and Kipper at the deadline to recoup some late first rounders. With where we are in the standings, I'd think Colorado might bite on that.

You get a sure thing at centre and still get two cracks at a deep draft.

I'd draft Petan with one of those late first rounders.

[Wronskian]

I'd be for absolutely dismantling the flames team and get mackinnon and drouin. I know junior chemistry should be taken with a grain of salt but these guys have something special together.

[Goodlad]

Originally Posted by Sylvanfan

What if you're sitting on the third pick, and Jones and MacInnon go in the first two picks. Do you take Barkov because you're desparate for a center, or do you take Drouin who could be the best offensive player in the draft?

Drouin all the way. I don't think it's close enough between the two to draft based on organizational need.

[mustache ride]

Originally Posted by 868904

I'd probably trade our first rounder for ROR right now and then trade Iggy and Kipper at the deadline to recoup some late first rounders. .

But then you still gotta pay this kid 5 million plus! Do you know who had similar numbers to this guy? Matt freakin Stajan! But Stajan actually had an extra year of 50 plus points. If people cant stand his contract at 3.5, what happens when O'reilly starts coming down to earth at 5 plus?

[Poe969]

Exactly! Stajan was supposed to be a pretty amazing player and he didn't turn out soo good. All this talk of trading a first rounder for someone who played well for a couple of seasons is crazy! I really hope we don't get ROR especially at the cost of a high end draft pick. Right now I'd take either Seth or McKinnon over ROR and I'm sure the owners would too considering how much they'd have to pay ROR compared to the other two.

[Tinordi]

Need to get a better read on whether this is a lottery team until you start throwing your first rounder around.

[868904]

Originally Posted by mustache ride

But then you still gotta pay this kid 5 million plus! Do you know who had similar numbers to this guy? Matt freakin Stajan! But Stajan actually had an extra year of 50 plus points. If people cant stand his contract at 3.5, what happens when O'reilly starts coming down to earth at 5 plus?

Firstly, I don't think anyone knows whether the kid really wants $5 million per year. It could be the first offer they sent to the Avs thinking that there'd be some negotiations, but instead the Avs have chosen not to budge. It is possible that ROR would settle at $4 million which is not unreasonable for someone who you have pegged as your 1st or 2nd line centreman.

Secondly, there's enough information out there from knowledgable hockey people (in particular GMs and scouts) to suggest that ROR is in fact better than Matt Stajan and that the guy is a legitimate 1st or 2nd line centre in the league.

Thirdly, the guy projects as a Ryan Kesler / Craig Conroy type player. A guy who will be in contention for a Selke Trophy and also be able to play with top skilled players in your top 6. I think if you can get a guy like that with a top 5 pick, you'd be doing pretty well. Ryan Kesler doesn't put up the points that Henrik Sedin does, nor does he make as much money as Henrik Sedin, but Kesler is the better and more valuable player. I don't care that Henrik won an Art Ross trophy or a Hart trophy, Ryan Kesler and players of that ilk are much more important to winning teams than pure scorers. ROR is that type of player and that is why many teams are interested in acquiring him.

Fourthly, I don't want to bash Stajan, cause I think he's a good 3rd line centreman who is simply overpaid by about $1 million. ROR has a lot more to his game than Stajan. Like I said, ROR is closer to Kesler and Conroy (at his peak) than he is to Stajan. No one ever thought Matt Stajan was a top two line centreman, other than Darryl Sutter. Even Leaf fans who overate their players never thought that Matt Stajan was a top two line centre.

[Poe969]

ROR is better than Stajan now, but when Stajan was younger people thought he would be pretty good. In a couple of years ROR could be where Stajan is now.

As for what he's asking, it's been published and talked about on any and every hockey show. ROR is seeking at least 5 mill. He isn't worth that, not yet anyway.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by Poe969

ROR is better than Stajan now, but when Stajan was younger people thought he would be pretty good. In a couple of years ROR could be where Stajan is now.

As for what he's asking, it's been published and talked about on any and every hockey show. ROR is seeking at least 5 mill. He isn't worth that, not yet anyway.

ROR is seeking $5 million on a long term deal that eats into UFA years. Don't be surprised when he is traded that he signs a 3 year contract at $4 million a year. The Av's gave him a take it or leave it offer at $3.5 million.

[868904]

Originally Posted by Tinordi

Need to get a better read on whether this is a lottery team until you start throwing your first rounder around.

That's the whole point though. Right now the Flames first rounder is "high", because the Flames are low in the standings. But we all know that ownership and Feaster are not going to tear this thing apart like the Oilers. They might trade Iggy and Kipper, but they won't tear it down completely. They will still try to make the playoffs even after trading Iggy and Kipper.

What I'm suggesting is you trade the illusion of a top 5 pick, because i'm pretty sure this team will not suck enough to get a top 5 pick. Feaster and ownership will not allow it.

So in essence, you are trading a pick in the 8 to 15 range for ROR.

[mustache ride]

Originally Posted by 868904

No one ever thought Matt Stajan was a top two line centreman, other than Darryl Sutter. Even Leaf fans who overate their players never thought that Matt Stajan was a top two line centre.

The guy had two consecutive years of 50 plus points. He was considered a top two center if not a first line center. Anything else is hindsight.
There is a difference between first line center and franchise center. If you keep your potential lottery pick you have a shot at the franchise kind. If you trade for O'reilly you have a shot at the first line kind.

[PeteMoss]

I will drive from Ontario to Calgary to fight Jay Feaster if he trades this year's 1st round pick for O'Reilly.

[speeds]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

You take your most glaring need, or just ask yourself what would Edmonton do and do the exact opposite.

EDM's drafting with their recent #1 picks has not been a problem.

They took Hall 1st in 2010, if you want to say they should have picked Seguin, I disagree, but that's fine and either way you'd have picked a F. In 2011 they took RNH, some had Landeskog ahead, a few had Larsson but I don't think you can look at that and say they clearly made a mistake, although it's obviously too soon to be certain for any of the 3. In 2012 Yakupov was arguably considered the most consensus #1 of the 3 years, I think it would have been a mistake to pick anyone but Yakupov at the time (based on the information I've seen), but that of course does not mean he's guaranteed to be the best player or anything.

[Tinordi]

Originally Posted by 868904

That's the whole point though. Right now the Flames first rounder is "high", because the Flames are low in the standings. But we all know that ownership and Feaster are not going to tear this thing apart like the Oilers. They might trade Iggy and Kipper, but they won't tear it down completely. They will still try to make the playoffs even after trading Iggy and Kipper.

What I'm suggesting is you trade the illusion of a top 5 pick, because i'm pretty sure this team will not suck enough to get a top 5 pick. Feaster and ownership will not allow it.

So in essence, you are trading a pick in the 8 to 15 range for ROR.

The same reasoning lead to Toronto trading their #2 overall for Kessel. Preferred we played it safe. And besides that, ROR is not the guy to push us over the edge to be a contender. He may help us squeak it but I'm in the business of actually trying to win a cup.