NHL Conference Realignment

[blankall]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

It would be easy to blame Winnipeg for this... so I will. Screw the Jets; they can keep their crappy schedule if it won't end up in creating an imperfect standings like this will give us.

Switching Winnipeg and Detroit seems like a simpler solution than conference realignment.

[sbarnabe]

suppose to be a new proposeal coming out

[Magnum PEI]

Since the west has more travel miles, they should have the two 7-team divisions in the west, and two 8-team divisions in the east. Send Detroit and Columbus to the east and Winnipeg to the west. And then bring back the old names. Effing ######ed that they changed them. If a Canadian becomes commissioner of MLB I'd like to see them rename the National and American Leagues.

[Zarley]

I really like the alignment that was proposed initially in 2011. The main positive for me is the return to divisional playoffs, which should increase the intensity of rivalries with the teams that we see the most during the regular season.

I'm not all that concerned about the unequal sizes of each conference, the 4 best teams will make the playoffs regardless of whether there are 8 or 7 teams. If the league wanted to mitigate any inequalities they could institute a CFL style crossover, but the plan gives every indication that expansion to 32 teams is imminent so I'm not sure a crossover would even be necessary.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by Magnum PEI

Since the west has more travel miles, they should have the two 7-team divisions in the west, and two 8-team divisions in the east. Send Detroit and Columbus to the east and Winnipeg to the west. And then bring back the old names. Effing ######ed that they changed them. If a Canadian becomes commissioner of MLB I'd like to see them rename the National and American Leagues.

It is so logical, it hurts.

[nik-]

Originally Posted by Magnum PEI

Since the west has more travel miles, they should have the two 7-team divisions in the west, and two 8-team divisions in the east. Send Detroit and Columbus to the east and Winnipeg to the west. And then bring back the old names. Effing ######ed that they changed them. If a Canadian becomes commissioner of MLB I'd like to see them rename the National and American Leagues.

Because the NHL lets Pittsburgh and the Rangers stir the drink

[browna]

As was said in the OP, the 2011 proposal will be tweaked this time around.
I am guessing 8 and 7 in each.

And, we'd be in this format already if it wasn't the rallying point for the opening CBA salvo by Fehr a couple years back. He and the PA shot this proposal down without any debate, just because they could, and wanted to show their powers regarding affecting league business as a sign of things to come.

The fact that this realignment stuff has gone so quickly into the new season, smoothly and under the radar this time around is proof of that...is Fehr even involved?

[Sylvanfan]

Originally Posted by HOOT

87 games, everyone plays each other 3 times, top 16 make it. Done!

Teams in the the Eastern time zone also only get 42 home games too. Revenge for their powder puff travel lives this season.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by blankall

Switching Winnipeg and Detroit seems like a simpler solution than conference realignment.

For whatever reason the league wants to keep Detroit in the West. I assume it's because they are a good draw in some of the softer Western markets. Taking Detroit away and replacing them with Winnipeg cant be something that would please the Jackets, Predators, Blues, or Blackhawks as Winnipeg isn't going to bring out big crowds in most US cities while Detroit will fill seats.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by blankall

Switching Winnipeg and Detroit seems like a simpler solution than conference realignment.

The problem is that they have to come up with something that will actually pass a vote, and there are a bunch of teams that want to move around, and even teams that won't be moving have alignments that better serve their own best interests.

Detroit would rather be in the East. Columbus would rather be in the East. Winnipeg wants to be in the West, and the Central Division. Minnesota hates being the travel associated with being in the NW. Dallas hates the travel associated with being in the Pacific.

Swapping Detroit and Winnipeg would be welcomed by the Jets and Wings, but the western teams would hate losing the draw of an original six team. The Hawks would hate losing a long-time rival.

The Stars and Wild would complain about being forced to stay in their bad alignments, while the new team gets into the Central Division.


So, let's start the conversation where everyone can agree:

Winnipeg should be in the Western Conference. For that to happen, a team from the West has to move into the Eastern Conference.

Detroit has seniority. Columbus is slightly further east than Detroit (although, they basically overlap). If you move either the Wings or Jackets, they don't really fit into the SE Division, and they can't really re-align the NE or Atlantic Divisions. Nashville actually makes the most sense to be in the SE Division even though it's west of Detroit and Columbus.

Then, you move to the West, and Minnesota, Dallas, and Winnipeg all want the new open spot in the Central Division. Minnesota is the easternmost of those teams. Dallas currently has the worst Divisional alignment in the League. Vancouver, Calgary, and Edmonton would probably gladly swap Winnipeg for Minnesota as a Divisional rival, but Colorado would be opposed, and Winnipeg would rather not have to have all that western travel (and late road games).


The chances of getting 16 teams to all agree on one alignment while maintaining the 6 divisions will be virtually impossible.


I bet we'll get exactly the alignment we were supposed to get this year. They could possibly have Detroit and Columbus in the NE instead of the Florida teams and put the Florida teams into the Central...

WEST: Anaheim, Los Angeles, Phoenix, San Jose, Colorado, Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton

CENTRAL: Winnipeg, Minnesota, Chicago, St. Louis, Dallas, Nashville, Tampa Bay, Florida

NORTHEAST: Detroit, Columbus, Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal, Buffalo, Boston

ATLANTIC: New York, New York, New Jersey, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Washington, Carolina


No matter what, the Flames will likely be in a Conference with 8 teams, unless Phoenix moves to Quebec City.

[Tsawwassen]

Originally Posted by blankall

Switching Winnipeg and Detroit seems like a simpler solution than conference realignment.

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

For whatever reason the league wants to keep Detroit in the West. I assume it's because they are a good draw in some of the softer Western markets. Taking Detroit away and replacing them with Winnipeg cant be something that would please the Jackets, Predators, Blues, or Blackhawks as Winnipeg isn't going to bring out big crowds in most US cities while Detroit will fill seats.

Originally Posted by getbak

The problem is that they have to come up with something that will actually pass a vote, and there are a bunch of teams that want to move around, and even teams that won't be moving have alignments that better serve their own best interests.

Detroit would rather be in the East. Columbus would rather be in the East. Winnipeg wants to be in the West, and the Central Division. Minnesota hates being the travel associated with being in the NW. Dallas hates the travel associated with being in the Pacific.

Swapping Detroit and Winnipeg would be welcomed by the Jets and Wings, but the western teams would hate losing the draw of an original six team. The Hawks would hate losing a long-time rival.

The Stars and Wild would complain about being forced to stay in their bad alignments, while the new team gets into the Central Division.


So, let's start the conversation where everyone can agree:

Winnipeg should be in the Western Conference. For that to happen, a team from the West has to move into the Eastern Conference.

Detroit has seniority. Columbus is slightly further east than Detroit (although, they basically overlap). If you move either the Wings or Jackets, they don't really fit into the SE Division, and they can't really re-align the NE or Atlantic Divisions. Nashville actually makes the most sense to be in the SE Division even though it's west of Detroit and Columbus.

Then, you move to the West, and Minnesota, Dallas, and Winnipeg all want the new open spot in the Central Division. Minnesota is the easternmost of those teams. Dallas currently has the worst Divisional alignment in the League. Vancouver, Calgary, and Edmonton would probably gladly swap Winnipeg for Minnesota as a Divisional rival, but Colorado would be opposed, and Winnipeg would rather not have to have all that western travel (and late road games).


The chances of getting 16 teams to all agree on one alignment while maintaining the 6 divisions will be virtually impossible.


I bet we'll get exactly the alignment we were supposed to get this year. They could possibly have Detroit and Columbus in the NE instead of the Florida teams and put the Florida teams into the Central...

WEST: Anaheim, Los Angeles, Phoenix, San Jose, Colorado, Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton

CENTRAL: Winnipeg, Minnesota, Chicago, St. Louis, Dallas, Nashville, Tampa Bay, Florida

NORTHEAST: Detroit, Columbus, Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal, Buffalo, Boston

ATLANTIC: New York, New York, New Jersey, Philadelphia, Pittsburgh, Washington, Carolina


No matter what, the Flames will likely be in a Conference with 8 teams, unless Phoenix moves to Quebec City.

Here we go again. First off, Winnipeg and Columbus should switch but Bettman's a butthead doesn't want to do the simple thing. Now Dallas should switch divisions with Vancouver, that would make both teams in a better timezone situation and in turn make the Wild happy too. There is nothing wrong with the 6 division set up. Common sense doesn't exist with Bettman. Play all in division teams 5 or 6 times, then play all the rest of the in conference teams 3 times, then all 15 out of conference teams twice.


4x5=20 or 4x6=24
10x3=30
15x2=30

and that equals 80 or 84 games.

I don't know about 16 teams agreeing to this 4 division alignment mess. The Avs like playing teams in the Central timezone plus less appearances by Detroit and Chicago coming out west is not good.

[King Theo]

I sat to hell with it all make it like the NFL or MLB. Teams from the same city are in 2 different conferences like the NY Jets & Giants. That way no one will be happy, a east coast team will have to travel as much as a west coast team.

[WilderPegasus]

Originally Posted by Tsawwassen

Here we go again. First off, Winnipeg and Columbus should switch but Bettman's a butthead doesn't want to do the simple thing. Now Dallas should switch divisions with Vancouver, that would make both teams in a better timezone situation and in turn make the Wild happy too. There is nothing wrong with the 6 division set up. Common sense doesn't exist with Bettman. Play all in division teams 5 or 6 times, then play all the rest of the in conference teams 3 times, then all 15 out of conference teams twice.

I'm very critical of what Bettman has done but the proposal realignment is not one of them. It is the most logical way to move forward considering where teams are located throughout the continent. Bringing back divisional playoffs is a great idea because it will create stronger rivalries. And when you've got stronger rivalries increasing the number of divisional games per season will increase interest. It has teams playing more games within an hour of their time zone.

Moving Winnipeg out for a team in the Central is not the best solution. Why should Winnipeg be in the Central instead of Minnesota or Dallas? Why would Vancouver want to be moved out of the same division as their long time rivals in Alberta? And if you keep the four Western Canadian teams in the same division it would be make the only American team in that division (Colorado) unhappy.

Moving to four groupings makes the most sense. And if the league expands (probably to Ontario and Quebec) then you can slots those franchises into the easternmost divisions.

[Bingo]

The two markets for expansion will be money generators and healthy, but won't they add to the issue of the last CBA where they boost HRR moving the cap up, the floor up, and add to the woes of the bottom five teams in the league?

I keep wondering if they should fold 2 teams, and move two teams and get a healthy 14 14 conference structure and go from there.

Fold Phoenix and Columbus
Move Tampa and Florida to Quebec and Markam

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by blankall

Switching Winnipeg and Detroit seems like a simpler solution than conference realignment.

Or Columbus. Detroit has so much history, I like having them in the West.



The NHL Realignment Plan - ie. how we plan on appeasing Eastern teams that are always whining about travel.

[Resolute 14]

Originally Posted by Bingo

The two markets for expansion will be money generators and healthy, but won't they add to the issue of the last CBA where they boost HRR moving the cap up, the floor up, and add to the woes of the bottom five teams in the league?

I keep wondering if they should fold 2 teams, and move two teams and get a healthy 14 14 conference structure and go from there.

Fold Phoenix and Columbus
Move Tampa and Florida to Quebec and Markam

Why would you move a team drawing 19,000 fans per game?


Anyway, the four-conference format begs for expansion, so nobody should get their contraction hopes up. The NHL isn't going to throw $400-$500 million away buying/folding teams when it can make the same expanding.

The only real problem the original proposal had from that perspective is the Florida teams in the wrong conference. Markham and Quebec are the most logical expansion sites, and they would belong in the same division as the other Canadian teams. That means someone will have to move from the NE to the SE when it happens.

Problem is, most of the Eastern teams are paired off. I think the best solution, really, is to put Washington and Carolina in the north and the Florida teams south. Once the league expands, move Carolina to the south where it belongs, and leave Washington in the north.

[Icon]

Did the 3 conference proposal ever get any legs?

Northeast
Boston
Buffalo
Montreal
New Jersey
New York Islanders
New York Rangers
Ottawa
Philadelphia
Pittsburgh
Toronto

Central/Southeast
Carolina
Chicago
Columbus
Dallas
Detroit
Florida
Nashville
St. Louis
Tampa Bay
Washington

West
Anaheim
Calgary
Colorado
Edmonton
Los Angeles
Minnesota
Phoenix
San Jose
Vancouver
Winnipeg

Then top 4 from each conference make the playoffs, plus 4 wildcards... sorting out who plays who would probably have to be set up based on points.

For expansion/relocation, Phoenix to Seattle keeps that conference the same. Adding Markham & QC would cause issues I suppose though.

[You Need a Thneed]

Originally Posted by Lil Pedro

I remember last year they discussed the idea that two teams from the same conference could potentially play in the SC finals...this would be a travesty if it occurs

No, two teams from the same conference could not play in the Stanley Cup Finals. Each of the four conferences would play the first two rounds of the playoffs to leave only one team left from each conference. The last four teams would be the playoff winners of each conference.

It's been said before, but the league proposing to go to 4 conferences makes it obvious that they were looking into a two team expansion. The conferences wouldn't be unequal for very long, at all.

A potential way to make sure worse teams wouldn't make the playoffs over better teams would be to have the top three teams in each conference make the playoffs, and then add 4 wild card teams, dispersing 1 wild card team into each conference for the playoffs.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by King Theo

I sat to hell with it all make it like the NFL or MLB. Teams from the same city are in 2 different conferences like the NY Jets & Giants. That way no one will be happy, a east coast team will have to travel as much as a west coast team.

The benefits of this conference realignment is that it limits travels for teams. The NHL wants to reduce it, rather than increase it.

[The Yen Man]

To keep it fair, if there are 30 teams, have 6 divisions. If there are 32 teams, have 4. Why change to 4 divisions right now when we can't divide all the teams up evenly? Just realign but keep it 6. Vancouver and Dallas swap; Winnipeg and Detroit or Columbus swap. Done. They're making it way more complicated than it needs to be.