Mandatory sentencing for marijuana went into effect today

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Thor

I wish the liberals had the balls to legalize before they collapsed and become the joke of a party they are today.

Well, this way it can be part of the platform that brings them back to power.

[CaramonLS]

Grow up libbies.

These a distribution laws, not possession ones.

I don't believe I've ever seen a page of users on CP defend laws against drug dealers before. This is a new low.

Now this thread will be bumped in a year and we can hear about some poor senior citizen sneaking drugs to patients in retirement home for medical use, blah blah blah red herring.

[Thor]

Actually when you buy from dealers how are you then not just as guilty as the dealers?

Any user who thinks what they do is no big deal and then calls out drug dealers is a hypocritical fool. The exist because you smoke, and I'd rather we legalize and have those dealers be legit than mostly run my criminal gangs.

[bizaro86]

What value of marijuana would 6 plants produce? Are there any circumstances where someone using it for pain management would need that much?

Because to be honest someone who destroys a home (that usually belongs to someone else) while growing 100+ marijuana plants, to me 9 months feels like not enough jail time for that.

• Production of 6 - 200 plants: 6 MONTHS minimum
With Health and Safety Factors: 9 MONTHS minimum

[Cowboy89]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

What value of marijuana would 6 plants produce? Are there any circumstances where someone using it for pain management would need that much?

Because to be honest someone who destroys a home (that usually belongs to someone else) while growing 100+ marijuana plants, to me 9 months feels like not enough jail time for that.

That's my view too. I could not care less about the so called 'evils' of pot and pot smoking, to me it's the property destruction aspect of the cultivation and distribution end of it that grinds me. That all said, why not just legalize it and then no one has an incentive to fata up someone's home to grow it.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Cowboy89

That's my view too. I could not care less about the so called 'evils' of pot and pot smoking, to me it's the property destruction aspect of the cultivation and distribution end of it that grinds me. That all said, why not just legalize it and then no one has an incentive to fata up someone's home to grow it.

Agreed. I guess my point of view on this matter is that I foresee this throwing more people in jail for what effectively amounts to minor offences and that places a greater burden on the system. Both in concern with costs of incarceration as well as limiting future social productivity.

[polak]

To be honest, I think I'd prefer the non-violent drug dealers on the streets over the hardcore stoners.

At least drug dealers have some initiative and entrepreneurial spirit...

[vektor]

-legalize it
-don't let anyone under 21 buy it
-make selling to minors worse than selling alcohol to minors
-tax it

=

-no more drug dealers
-no more people in jail for a herb
-tax revenue

the problem is not the plant itself, the problem is people growing it more and more and it being low quality (i.e. stinky as hell) and drug dealers interacting with normal people. It's so ridiculous that it's illegal, I don't know a single person that has strong moral views against it. Even my girlfriend who was an ardent opponent of it now just hates the smell. I can understand someone not liking the smell, but beyond that just leave people alone.

If someone complains to me about the smell I will stop doing it around them because I can understand that, but the Canadian government needs to take their head out of their asses and leave people alone if they are hurting literally no one. I think it being illegal compounds the problem because of how bad it actually is for minors (purported neurotoxic effects), if it were legal you could tell kids "hey there's a plant you might like, but you should try it when you're older because it can poison your brain until it's done developing." Instead we get ######ed fear mongering that is blatantly untrue that does nothing but drive kids to try it because like me they can tell that the anti-drug programs are not based on educating but on enforcing and that does nothing to help the problem. I used to wear my DARE shirt to parties when I'd smoke, good work government, you are succeeding so well.

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

I don't believe I've ever seen a page of users on CP defend laws against drug dealers before. This is a new low.

No one is defending drug dealers. What most people recognize is that you can't put this war on such a readily available and wanted product like pot and expect things to change. The new low is the Harper government giving harsher penalties for growing 6 plants than someone who molests a 3 year old kid.

That's the problem with a law like this. The only people that benefit from this law are the drug dealers and growers. The government will spend more money chasing its tail, they will continue to put people in jail that don't need to be there (and most cases come out worse than when they went in) and waste resources that could actually help people. Like treating and preventing use of harder drugs that actually bring down society with crime.

Not to mention laws like this are the reason there are drug dealers. If it was legal, taxed and controlled then people wouldn't be forced to buy from drug dealers. The government continues to write organized crime a blank cheque.

[Flash Walken]

I believe mandatory minimum sentences are a violation of my charter rights.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Flash Walken

I believe mandatory minimum sentences are a violation of my charter rights.

All of them or one in particular?

[HPLovecraft]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

If they ever get around to legalizing marijuana I hope they find a way of reducing the stench that comes from the smoke. Some people might like the smell, but I just can't stand it.

Once it's finally legalized, this is going to be the thing brought up most by people, I wager. I'd rather walk through a cloud of second hand smoke than be in the general vicinity of a few people smoking pot. Smells like a back alley full of tomcat urine.

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

All of them or one in particular?

Articles 9 and 12, but I also believe section 7 applies as well.

[polak]

Originally Posted by HPLovecraft

Once it's finally legalized, this is going to be the thing brought up most by people, I wager. I'd rather walk through a cloud of second hand smoke than be in the general vicinity of a few people smoking pot. Smells like a back alley full of tomcat urine.

Since it's an intoxicant, I doubt you'll be allowed to smoke it in public... just like drinking.

You would have Amsterdam-esque cafes where you can smoke, or you can do it in your own residence.

[bizaro86]

9. Everyone has the right not to be arbitrarily detained or imprisoned

Conviction by a court after due process overcomes this, imo.

12. Everyone has the right not to be subjected to any cruel and unusual treatment or punishment.

If imprisionment isn't cruel and unusual, then I don't see how a specific amount of imprisonment is cruel and unusual.

7. Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of the person and the right not to be deprived thereof except in accordance with the principles of fundamental justice

There might be a case for arbitrariness under the fundamental justice clause here, but I'm not sure. Basically, the SC could over rule this if they don't like it's implications, but it's not a slam dunk and a strict reading of the charter wouldn't necessarily disallow this law.

[Huntingwhale]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I was always under the impression that Canadians were more concerned about harsher sentences for violent offences like murder or rape. What ever happened to all the talk about no bail or parole for violent offences? What ever happened to longer sentences for repeat offenders? I find it extremely hard to believe that these marijuana law modifications were more important to Canadians then dealing with violent crimes. Again correct me if l am wrong, but I believe the last poll showed Canadians were in favor of legalizing/decriminalizing marijuana. What ever happened to government doing the will of the people?

[wookster]

I really kind of scratch my head when people say that legalizing pot will mean no more drug dealers. Does anyone actually believe that the criminal element will just go away if this happens?

[Azure]

If the state gives 'growers' the ability to sell their stuff legally, and direct to the customer, people won't go to the drug dealer. They'll just go to the local marijuana dealer and buy from him.

Why wouldn't the drug dealers become extinct if that happens?

[Mass_nerder]

Originally Posted by Azure

If the state gives 'growers' the ability to sell their stuff legally, and direct to the customer, people won't go to the drug dealer. They'll just go to the local marijuana dealer and buy from him.

Why wouldn't the drug dealers become extinct if that happens?

I guess it depends on how heavily it's taxed.
I don't remember it being much of an issue in Alberta, but after moving to Halifax, I've heard a lot about smuggled tobacco from the states.
I think legalizing pot would create a similar situation; people wanting to avoid huge taxes, kids wanting to buy before the legal age etc...they all go the illegal routes because of various reasons, despite it being 100% legal.

[wookster]

So you don't think that the majority of drug dealers might also be selling other "products" other than pot...."products" that they will still sell because there will still be a demand for it. Criminals are usually greedy, so if they can make $10,000 a week selling whatever illegally as opposed to making $2000 a week selling pot legally I'm pretty sure which route the majority will choose.