The Dark Knight Rises: July 20, 2012

[Jbo]

Just a side question on geography...spoiler to be safe

Spoiler!

One thing I noticed after watching Batman Begins and The Dark Knight Returns was the geography of Gotham. In Batman Begins, the birdges are raised following the release of the toxic gas and everyone in the Burrows is left inside. In TDKR the bridges are blown up and all of Gotham is cut off. Seems like There is an Island within an Island there? Just a weird thing I picked up. Also what the hell happened to the Train that ran through town?

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

Do you have either of those trades that I may acquire from you for currency?

I have a set for myself. but as of right now i do not have any of them in stock. I sold a crap load of batman graphics at the comic expo.

I'm getting a huge collection in the next couple of weeks though.

[Cecil Terwilliger]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

Too bad they never showed the Doll House from Arkham Asylum, but i guess there is NO WAY Hollywood is touching that story. Spoiler is from the graphic novel.

Spoiler!

Amadaus Arkham Coming home to find his wife and daughter cut to peices by a seriaal killer:I see my wife first, my dear constance her bodie is in peices
harriet lies nearby,
violated,
almost i dly i wonder where her head is and then i look down at the doll house
and the doll house
looks
at
me

You need to read Cataclysm which is where a massive 9.0 earthquake wipes out gotham and then the after math of that in No Mans Land. All the bridges are blown out and no none is allowed to leave the island of Gotham. hmmm it's actually sound alot like DMZ which is the vertigo graphic.

One of the best story arcs ever for Batman and the ending which is pretty awesome. I must have read both of these over 10 times.

No Man's Land has been on my to do list for a while but it is a rather large investment because I think it is at least 3 or 4 books if not more.

I'm on a Marvel binge right now. When I finish with that I'll look at picking up Knightfall, Cataclysm and NML.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by J-bo09

Just a side question on geography...spoiler to be safe

Spoiler!

One thing I noticed after watching Batman Begins and The Dark Knight Returns was the geography of Gotham. In Batman Begins, the birdges are raised following the release of the toxic gas and everyone in the Burrows is left inside. In TDKR the bridges are blown up and all of Gotham is cut off. Seems like There is an Island within an Island there? Just a weird thing I picked up. Also what the hell happened to the Train that ran through town?

TDKR map is definitely the one used from No Man's Land. At the beginning of the next comic after a 'main event' happens they update the territorial map.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by Cecil Terwilliger

No Man's Land has been on my to do list for a while but it is a rather large investment because I think it is at least 3 or 4 books if not more.

I'm on a Marvel binge right now. When I finish with that I'll look at picking up Knightfall, Cataclysm and NML.

Skip knightfall. I'd rather read comics with Batmite in it than to re-read that.

I can't think of anything Marvel has put out that could be better than No Man's Land. Course i don't really read marvel stuff anymore.

[Bertuzzied]

Originally Posted by J-bo09

Just a side question on geography...spoiler to be safe

Spoiler!

One thing I noticed after watching Batman Begins and The Dark Knight Returns was the geography of Gotham. In Batman Begins, the birdges are raised following the release of the toxic gas and everyone in the Burrows is left inside. In TDKR the bridges are blown up and all of Gotham is cut off. Seems like There is an Island within an Island there? Just a weird thing I picked up. Also what the hell happened to the Train that ran through town?

Map of Gotham from No Man's Land.

Spoiler!

[Coach]

Yeah I always assumed that Arkham was on a Staten Island type place.

[SebC]

Originally Posted by rubecube

Spoiler!

The only really big plothole for me was the whole faked death. How did Bruce know he was going to get a chance to carry the bomb out of Gotham to make it look like he'd been blown up by it, if the whole plan was to re-attach the the core and disarm it?

Spoiler!

No auto-pilot would seem like something Bruce would want fixed even if he wasn't planning to fake his own death, and he wouldn't really have any reason to tell people either (it was in the logs, so on the other hand he wasn't really being secretive).

[Senator Clay Davis]

I think people are nitpicking just a little bit too much. All three movies have plotholes or events that don't seem to make sense or aren't realistic (for me, in TDK when the Joker burns the pile of money with Lau on top, yet we don't see Lau burn or hear him scream, which he undoubtably would be if he was getting burned alive). But every movie is like that, its just is it a move filled with that or are those minor slights to an overall great picture?

[trackercowe]

Originally Posted by Senator Clay Davis

I think people are nitpicking just a little bit too much. All three movies have plotholes or events that don't seem to make sense or aren't realistic (for me, in TDK when the Joker burns the pile of money with Lau on top, yet we don't see Lau burn or hear him scream, which he undoubtably would be if he was getting burned alive). But every movie is like that, its just is it a move filled with that or are those minor slights to an overall great picture?

Agreed, I saw it again last night and many of the small plot holes and inconsistencies people listed were either explained, or easily discernible after a second viewing.

Like a couple other noted it is best to watch all three movies in a row to accurately enjoy all three.

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

Agreed, I saw it again last night and many of the small plot holes and inconsistencies people listed were either explained, or easily discernible after a second viewing.

Like a couple other noted it is best to watch all three movies in a row to accurately enjoy all three.

lol

[trackercowe]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

lol

I don't see what's so funny. I have been reading many of the complaints and possible plot holes regarding DKR, and most of them were actually addressed in the film, It is quite possible some people either weren't paying attention, just missed the scene, or possibly didn't understand Bane's voice. Which is why a second viewing may be required to solve some of these issues. I am not saying DKR is as difficult to comprehend as your average Truffaut or Fellini, but it terms of your typical action movie it probably does require repeated viewings if you want to be able to thoroughly enjoy it.

Take the cops being moderately clean, and not looking disheveled after being trapped in the sewers for 5 months. Well there is a scene where you see Bane's mercs lowering down a care package to the cops in the sewers, which obviously would contain the needed items to keep them clean. Also during the battle sequence many of the cops do have beards and unkempt uniforms. So it is pretty clear that Nolan did not necessarily ignore that one.

The second point regarding the police force is why they do not have guns to take on the mercs in the final battle. Well obviously they did not have access to weapons after just breaking free of the sewers; they were only able to take what they were carrying at the time which were mostly just handguns. The opposing side did use firearms supplied by Bane, but were defeated because of the sheer numbers the cops had over them; only 1000 prisoners were released from Blackgate, a number far less than what the cops side had. And many cops were killed anyway, so the arms advantage did matter in that regard.

Then there are the complaints of how Bruce was able to survive the explosion at the end of the movie. Well it is quite logical that Batman was able to jump out of the ship when he blew up that building before passing over the bridge and was able to control the Bat by auto-pilot from there, which is far enough to stay away from the detonation. So no real plot hole there.

Finally Bane does clearly explain why he let Gotham stand for the five month period, it was all part of his plan.

Are there some plotholes, logical gaffs, and inconsistencies? Sure, but about the same numbers Dark Knight, or any other big budget action movie.

Some people just had such high, possibly unrealistic expectations going into this movie before going in that for some it was doomed to fail before even seeing it. However, it does have a 9.2 rating on IMDB, an A rating on CinemaScore, and an 87% on RT, so clearly it is a very good movie, just maybe not as good as Dark Knight.

[TurnedTheCorner]

I've never heard of an accurate way to enjoy...anything, is all. The phrasing struck me funny.

Carry on.

[WhiteTiger]

Just finished watching this, and really enjoyed it. Not as good at TDK, but better than Begins, I felt.

A few things that caught my attention:

-Anne Hathaway looks really good in long hair. Makes that butcher job done on her for her next role even harder to look at.

-Will he be Batman, Nightwing or Robin? And are we going to find out?

-A place the size of Gotham (Manhattan) only has 3000-ish cops? It was said that "all the cops" were down in the sewers, and that they had 3000 of them. You figure that some didn't go, and estimate that generously at 1000.

I had to do some math here. There are roughly 35,000 police in all of New York. There are 5 boroughs, and I can't find exact breakdowns, so split it evenly, and call it 7000. Ok, not too bad. But the current population of Manhattan is 1.6 million...and in the movie, they were talking about the bomb killing 12 million people. That's 7.5 times as many people, so you'd need 52500 cops to keep an eye on them all. Gotham either has an incredibly low crime rate to have 4000-ish cops watching over 12 million people, or is a retired Batman worth 48500 cops?

[WhiteTiger]

Originally Posted by Bertuzzied

Yeah that was pretty annoying. Not sure why they went that route and wrecked his mouth.

I kind of wondered this myself, but it seems to me that it was the only way you have the general feel of Bane's costume without the backstory of the venom. This guy got beaten about the face so badly that he needs the mask to help him breath. At least, that's how it seemed to me.

[Hockeyguy15]

The mask doesn't help Bane's breathing, it is to control the constant pain he is in.

The mask releases an analgesic that prevents him from feeling pain from past injuries, and since he feels no pain he is even more dangerous when fighting Batman. This is why the second time Batman fights him he targets the mask and when he breaks the mask Bain is in so much pain he loses focus and loses the fight. It is also why he is laying on the floor with tears in his eyes, he is in so much pain.

Originally Posted by Hockeyguy15

From Wikipedia

"According to costume designer Lindy Hemming, the character wears a mask that supplies him with an analgesic gas to relieve pain he suffers from an injury sustained "early in his story", while Nolan explained that the character was chosen because of the desire to "[test] Batman both physically as well as mentally".

So I'm thinking he isn't on the Titan formula?

[Tinordi]

Saw it last night. Good but not great, probably the weakest of the three movies.

[GreenLantern]

Originally Posted by trackercowe

*All good points*

I would also like to add that Bane/Talia/Selena were all played very well as villains, but none hold a candle to Heaths performance as the Joker.

I feel like this is why for many it just wasn't as good. You can't perfect perfection.

That being said, Hathaway did really blow me away as Selena Kyle, I was not expecting that at all. And Bane had a great personality which I was scared Nolan might skip over. In the comics he is a real treat to follow.

[Yeah_Baby]

I'd be willing to argue that Nolan's portrayal of Kyle might be the most true to the comics we've seen.

[GreenLantern]

-Anne Hathaway looks really good in long hair. Makes that butcher job done on her for her next role even harder to look at.

Yes and yes, didn't mind seeing her ride the bat bike.

-Will he be Batman, Nightwing or Robin? And are we going to find out?

His name was Robin, so I am guessing he is Robin. Nightwing was also a Robin at one point. We won't find out because Nolan has retired from the Batman franchise. If you desire more Nolan related comic book stories, see Man of Steel (produced by Nolan) out next Summer.

I had to do some math here. There are roughly 35,000 police in all of New York. There are 5 boroughs, and I can't find exact breakdowns, so split it evenly, and call it 7000. Ok, not too bad. But the current population of Manhattan is 1.6 million...and in the movie, they were talking about the bomb killing 12 million people. That's 7.5 times as many people, so you'd need 52500 cops to keep an eye on them all. Gotham either has an incredibly low crime rate to have 4000-ish cops watching over 12 million people, or is a retired Batman worth 48500 cops?

Or it's a movie set in a fictional city within the story? Don't look too far into these things guys, enjoy the story. If you want to start comparing the movie to the comics as well it will all fall apart. Just take it for what it is and have fun with it.