Reading a lot of the vile hate being thrown around twitter and various comments sections on news stories is actually depressing. It's times like these I very much doubt that humankind can even survive itself. Twitter pulling the trend on #godisnotgreat is absolutely gutless.
Good point, I figured someone would bring that up after I posted that.
However, concerning a more important development in this thread...
Welcome back Reggie!
Is it the real Reggie? Was there not a lifetime ban in effect? I know life is short and the CP jail is probably getting too full. Or was there a time off for good behaviour clause envoked?
As far as outspoken atheists go, Hitchens >>> Dawkins.
I think he was good at what he did and a skilled debater, although I wasn't really his target audience. I have never really been that attached to any entertainer to feel actual mourning for when they die, but it's always sad in a way.
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"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
I've read God is not Great and its a good read. I started the Dawkins book (the God delusion? IIRC) and couldn't get through it. I read a fair amount of Hitchens essays and works and found them to be pretty good. I grew tired of the "fanatic" atheism though, more from Dawkins than Hitchens to be sure, but it just kind of turned me off.
I'm not an incredibly religious person, but there seems to be a lot of stereo-typing on both sides of the argument. I get that religion (taken to its extremes and perverted for personal gain) has been the root cause of some horrific events in human history. I also think that there are a number of atheists/agnostics who have commited horrific acts though.
I suppose I'm somewhat agnostic....although I definitely think that nearly all religions have good characteristics and good points for people. Frankly if people find things of value for them within these teachings then good for them; I wouldn't accuse every catholic or every muslim of the attrocities that some might feel their respective religions are responsible for. That kind of rational middle ground always seems lost with guys like Hitchens and Dawkins though.
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i'm a little late to the party here and have been soaking up the clips, memorials and anecdotes. I always wonder if the weight of my own death will "help" me find god on my death bed. I think i can confidently say hitchens did not find god. i think it takes a lot of courage when facing death, to not resist repenting just for the sake of covering your ass.
I've read God is not Great and its a good read. I started the Dawkins book (the God delusion? IIRC) and couldn't get through it. I read a fair amount of Hitchens essays and works and found them to be pretty good. I grew tired of the "fanatic" atheism though, more from Dawkins than Hitchens to be sure, but it just kind of turned me off.
I've challenged a lot of people to answer this honestly, and to this day I can't get a straight answer. Slava your one cool dude and I'd love your very honest answer.
What makes Hitchens or Dawkins fanatic atheists?
Quote:
I suppose I'm somewhat agnostic....although I definitely think that nearly all religions have good characteristics and good points for people. Frankly if people find things of value for them within these teachings then good for them; I wouldn't accuse every catholic or every muslim of the attrocities that some might feel their respective religions are responsible for. That kind of rational middle ground always seems lost with guys like Hitchens and Dawkins though.
The thing is there is no middle ground in logic, if something is logical it is just that, if its illogical then its illogical.
That mindset is the basis of rationalism, reductionism, and the scientific method. If an idea is to stand up to anything it has to logicly work, and if it doesn't, discard it.
This is very antithetical to religious beliefs, and faith based ideas. Because we can destroy utterly any and all religious arguments, so its left to believers to hang on to 'but its my faith."
Not at all suggesting its that simple, faith is more complex than that, but I'm giving you the rational cold mind version, not something the vast majority of atheists have since we all live in a society with religion holding center stage.
The fervor with which they attack Christian beliefs.
While I admire your confidence, no you can't.
so in your way of thinking...every Pastor, Priest, "church leader", and committed member(s) are the same? Certainly thats the main title of another thread parallel to this one isn't it?
The fervor with which they attack Christian beliefs.
Well they attack all religious beliefs, they like you think Mormons, Muslims, hindu's, scientologists are all utterly ridiculous.
Attack is an interesting word. If we rewind back 50 years, if someone of black skin in the US speaks up against segregated seating, they are called radicals. In fact much was attempted to make any and all blacks in the US who sat up and said "No more" to be made out as radicals and aggressors.
Modern atheism is a response to modern religiosity, its an answer to whats been happening in the modern world. We have the muslim nations who are being radicalized, we have Israel losing more power to radicals, we have the USA the biggest nation in the world having evangelicals and the religious right fighting HARD to effect everything from supreme court decisions to state laws which make science books treat evolution as something controversial.
Atheists and non believers are the minority, when a majority person stands up and suggest those in the minority are militant when all they do is argue against an idea, you lose a lot of credibility.
Its more like, "I don't like atheists because they don't hold back against religious beliefs, and say mean things."
This makes them militant?
I thought militant was Christians bombing abortion clinics, the Phelps church, cults, suicide bombers, etc..
When you throw that word against atheists because they speak their mind, openly and without hesitation, you completely disrespect the word 'militant' or in this case 'aggressive.'
Arguments are by their nature aggressive, so if you think politicians should stop debating because they are 'aggressive' to each other then by all means call atheists aggressive or militant. Otherwise, get over your offense and stop trying to label those you disagree with false labels you yourself deep down know are unjust and unfair.
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