Who's getting the H1N1 shot?

[KTown]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I can't find the link, but on one of the BC government sites, they predicted that it would peak in Octiber and fall off by the middle of November. On the American news the other day, they mentioned the peak season as lasting until American Thanksgiving.

This could be correct.

It's spreading so quick that alot of the population would have allready been exposed to it. Not everybody will be effected by it. Also as the number of people become vaccinated it will curtail the spead of infections.

[Ashartus]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

I can't find the link, but on one of the BC government sites, they predicted that it would peak in Octiber and fall off by the middle of November. On the American news the other day, they mentioned the peak season as lasting until American Thanksgiving.

Historically pandemics have had 2-3 waves. From what I've heard a lot of experts predicted a wave peaking around the beginning of November (i.e. about now), and another wave later in the winter - by which time hopefully enough people will have been vaccinated to minimize it.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by Ashartus

Historically pandemics have had 2-3 waves. From what I've heard a lot of experts predicted a wave peaking around the beginning of November (i.e. about now), and another wave later in the winter - by which time hopefully enough people will have been vaccinated to minimize it.

Yes, but, and I think this is important, and might explain the heighened sense of panic that some people might be exhibiting. i.e The word "pandemic".

Historically pandemics by the WHO's definition were:

"The old definition was a new virus, which went around quickly, for which you didn't have immunity, and which created a high morbidity and mortality rate. Now the last two have been dropped, and that's how swine flu has been categorized as a pandemic."

http://www.healthzone.ca/health/news...obia-runs-deep

So in essence what we have now is (by the recently changed definition and criteria for acceptance) the swine flu pandemic which people naturally associate with other flu pandemics (e.g Spanish) that carried large mortalities when in fact the only reason this flu has gained pandemic status is because the WHO has lowered the criteria for membership of the pandemic club.

Might explain some of the heightened anxiety when if all was to be considered this virus, whilst novel and undoubtedly contagious is actually exhibiting no extreme end results and no different to the seasonal flu that would actually warrant it to be by definition an old school pandemic.

[killer_carlson]

any word from Peanut?

[Byrns]

I got a question, what happened to all the people wearing masks?

If you're worried enough about getting sick, why not start wearing one? Or better yet, as they do in Japan, wear one if you're the person who is actually sick. People are so much more polite over there.

[starseed]

I thought it was mentioned that masks do almost nothing to prevent the spread of infection?

[PYroMaNiaC]

Originally Posted by Byrns

I got a question, what happened to all the people wearing masks?

If you're worried enough about getting sick, why not start wearing one? Or better yet, as they do in Japan, wear one if you're the person who is actually sick. People are so much more polite over there.

I work in a pharmacy with a clinic next door. The masks are actually being handed out to people who have or are suspected of having H1N1 to reduce the possiblity of transmission to their families, doctors, pharmacists etc, while they are being treated.

[photon]

When I went to get my shot there were some people wearing masks in line, but not very many. Maybe 10 - 20 in the thousands I saw.

When I went to my doctor's for an appointment they had a sign up that it was mandatory to put on a mask if you were experiencing symptoms, and they had a specific area of chairs for "high risk" people to sit in (actually that's always something I've thought a doctor's office should have, is a area for sick people to sit, and an area for not sick people to sit, but maybe that's just because I don't like sitting next to sick people lol).

[metallicat]

That's why I hate going to medi-centres.

[Boo Radley]

Originally Posted by photon

(actually that's always something I've thought a doctor's office should have, is a area for sick people to sit, and an area for not sick people to sit, but maybe that's just because I don't like sitting next to sick people lol).

The pediatrician my son goes to, and the doctor I see, both have separate waiting rooms for people who are sick (as opposed for those there for a routine visit). They started doing this early in the year. Not sure how common this is but we appreciate it. In fact the pediatrician also removed all toys from the waiting room.

My son (three years old) thinks removing the toys was over kill

[HOOT]

Any one heard from Peanut?

[jammies]

Originally Posted by Devils'Advocate

This is why I drink and drive. I mean, there are so many things I could possibly die from.. getting hit by a bus walking to work, heart attack, murdered by a mugger. Not drinking and driving won't "save me". It would just "save me" from smashing a vehicle into a tree. So instead, I'm going to eat better and exercise more and continue to drink and drive.

It's about calculation of risk/reward. Is getting a flu shot - which for me, so far has been 100% in causing a couple days of illness and debilitation - on the minuscle chance you might die - worth it?

Too many people indulge in magical thinking, where the flu shot takes on a talismanic significance that makes them think that once they are immunized, they are "safe". I'm just pointing out that this is not so, and that this hysteria is an over-reaction.

Originally Posted by photon

As Jiri's post above yours indicates, there are other negative things about this than death.

As I said, many people getting the shot experience flu-like symptoms for a few days, so to me it seems that there are negatives on BOTH sides of shot/no-shot. I've been immunized twice, and both times I had a moderate reaction where I was out for 2-3 days. I've also had the flu a couple times, and both times it was mild and I was out for 3-4 days. To me it seems a better bet to forgo the certainty of being ill for a chance of being ill, even if actually catching the flu *might* be worse.

[Shazam]

Originally Posted by starseed

I thought it was mentioned that masks do almost nothing to prevent the spread of infection?

This is correct. They're basically N95 masks - they prevent the wearer from inhaling fine dust particles.

[twotoner]

Originally Posted by jammies

I've also had the flu a couple times, and both times it was mild and I was out for 3-4 days. To me it seems a better bet to forgo the certainty of being ill for a chance of being ill, even if actually catching the flu *might* be worse.

This might be true for a normal flu season.

With H1N1, most people (except perhaps the very old) have never before been exposed to this. It makes it potentially more lethal. So instead of 3-4 days, it may be the ICU or worse depending on how your body reacts to it.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by HOOT

Any one heard from Peanut?

She is a friend of mine. I will talk to her tomorrow and if she wishes, give an update here. Please continue to keep her daughter in your thoughts and prayers.

[T@T]

Special on swine flu on discovery right now

[HOOT]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

She is a friend of mine. I will talk to her tomorrow and if she wishes, give an update here. Please continue to keep her daughter in your thoughts and prayers.

Thanks! I sent her a PM just to say hi and hope everything is okay.

I don't need details just let her know a lot of us are thinking of her and family.

[NuclearFart]

Originally Posted by jammies

It's about calculation of risk/reward. Is getting a flu shot - which for me, so far has been 100% in causing a couple days of illness and debilitation - on the minuscle chance you might die - worth it?

Too many people indulge in magical thinking, where the flu shot takes on a talismanic significance that makes them think that once they are immunized, they are "safe". I'm just pointing out that this is not so, and that this hysteria is an over-reaction.



As I said, many people getting the shot experience flu-like symptoms for a few days, so to me it seems that there are negatives on BOTH sides of shot/no-shot. I've been immunized twice, and both times I had a moderate reaction where I was out for 2-3 days. I've also had the flu a couple times, and both times it was mild and I was out for 3-4 days. To me it seems a better bet to forgo the certainty of being ill for a chance of being ill, even if actually catching the flu *might* be worse.

Might be worse? I can tell you getting the flu is worse. As you've already stated, death is a possibility, but there's also other possibilities such as a death watch admission to the ICU on a ventilator for a couple weeks. You think this hysteria is an over reaction? We just admitted a physician to the ICU this weekend - young and healthy a couple days ago before contracting H1N1.

You know what's even scarier, and has yet to make the media? If the trend continues, and the average ICU stay is 1-2 weeks, and we only have ~10-20 ventillators per hospital, we are rapidly going to run out of ventillators. You can figure out the implications.

The other thing people don't know is that it's not really the virus that kills you; it's the body's immune system over-reacting and flooding the lungs with reactive cells and fibrotic tissue. Why is this relevant to you? Because it means having a "competent" or "healthy" immune system is 1) not as protective against H1N1 as against the usual/seasonal flu strain, and 2) could theoretically exacerbate H1N1 complications. Hence why we are seeing a disproportionate amount of young, healthy adults being admitting to hospital and requiring ICU admission.

However miniscule you perceive the risk, if it includes death, a couple days of mild malaise is a small price to pay for some degree of protection.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by NuclearFart

You know what's even scarier, and has yet to make the media? If the trend continues, and the average ICU stay is 1-2 weeks, and we only have ~10-20 ventillators per hospital, we are rapidly going to run out of ventillators. You can figure out the implications.

What figures/trends are you basing this on? i.e. What fold of an increase of H1N1 admissions are being observed compared to average admissions from seasonal flu?

I accept that this is a 20 day old report.


"It is more difficult to interpret the Canadian data as it does not cover all ICU beds in the country, but if we use all 215 confirmed, probable and suspect cases for the 38 reporting ICUs (the characteristics of patients in the paper only include the 168 confirmed and suspected cases) and use the figure in the paper that there were a total of 278 admitted to ICUs in the country with a 2009 population of 34 million, this represents about 8 ICU admissions per million population.

Assuming similar age structures for these three developed countries, the Canadian population demand for ICU admission is about a third of the southern hemisphere figure. This could well be because the Australia/New Zealand data were from the usual influenza season while the Canadian data were from a prodromal or herald wave that occurred outside of flu season. I expect we'll find out soon enough.

It is worthwhile noting, however, that even with triple the demand for influenza-related ICU admissions, the two southern hemisphere countries were able to cope by making adjustments in schedules and practices.

The comparison just made is imperfect, at best. It doesn't take account of the uneven distribution of demand, temporally and geographically, that is typical of influenza in general, and pandemics in particular. It doesn't differentiate the adult and pediatric distribution nor the varying availability of skilled nursing and medical care.

It is clear in the Canadian indigenous First Nations population there was greatly increased risk, and these are also the populations with the least timely, least well-staffed and least accessible critical care beds.

National averages don't tell the whole story. But the small part of the story they do tell suggests that the infrastructure to handle this pandemic exists in both Canada and the US and what is needed is planning to use it most efficiently."


http://scienceblogs.com/effectmeasur...d_use_in_c.php

[Dion]

Alberta's top doctor takes blame in H1N1 clinic chaos

Dr. Andre Corriveau said it was his decision to initially open clinics to all Albertans last Monday, close them Saturday and not reopen them until at least Tuesday. When they do reopen, the vaccine will initially be restricted to those in high-risk groups, including pregnant women, kids under six and those under 65 with chronic health conditions.

Corriveau said health officials didn't anticipate the overwhelming numbers of people who turned up at the clinics. That was then complicated by the news later in the week that Alberta would only receive an additional 80,000 doses, compared to the 220,000 that were expected.

http://www.calgaryherald.com/health/...416/story.html