Back yard fire pits

[Bagor]

Butters as Professor Chaos.

[Tower]

Ha ha ha aw gee thanks!!!

Too funny.

[Methanolic]

Originally Posted by Tower

Careful.... You are bordering Freeman movements here...

Just googled "Freeman Movement"

Never heard of this society before. Pretty weird to say the least.

Definitely not my cup of tea.

[mikey_the_redneck]

Why the hell would anyone vote for "get a permit"..........that would be just another cash grab for the city.....

[DESS]

Originally Posted by mikey_the_redneck

Why the hell would anyone vote for "get a permit"..........that would be just another cash grab for the city.....

+1. That's ######ed.

[Methanolic]

Originally Posted by mikey_the_redneck

Why the hell would anyone vote for "get a permit"..........that would be just another cash grab for the city.....

Agree, But that's one of the Cities solutions to this (Issue?)

Also, The proposed permit would be a one time use (per fire) permit that would have to be obtained prior to the "event".

I'd guess that most back yard fires are not planned, But more spure of the moment occurances. The permit idea would likely cause people to simply give up and get rid of their fire pits.

[FurnaceFace]

Originally Posted by Peanut

I'm not opposed to the smoke really at all, more the noise bothers me if I'm trying to sleep. So if my neighbours want to enjoy their fire-pit it's fine by me, as long as they turn down the music and the drunken voices around 11pm.

I return the courtesy when we use our firepit.

This would be one of my concerns and from experience the cause of any dislike for the firepits. There is a house across the alley and down the street from us who are loud when they have the firepit going. Whereas the people beside us have one and when they are out you'd hardly know it. There is also a concern if they are used improperly. If they are used as a garbage incinerator, are built up way too high, or are used during a very dry part of the year. I don't think they should be banned as I like them however it could be a tough balancing act to enforce the necessary regulations and it may be cheaper for the city in the long run to just ban permanently.

Talking to your neighbours if you have a concern is sometimes touchy. If they are the actual home owners, a dialog is often possible and the situation easily resolved. However if they are renters it's not as easy as the renter often doesn't see the need to care.

There is also the consideration a number of people will do everything to avoid conflict, and some - like the elderly - may be afraid of getting singled out and preyed upon if they do speak up. If a neighbour voices a concern and the other neighbour tells them to F off then what does the complaintant do? If they now call the city they are asking for potential reprisal as it's obvious who called the authorities. There is also the factor of having to go knock on a door or back gate when it's dark and you don't know what sort of reception you're going to be faced with. I don't think it's a bad thing to have a number people can call to voice their concerns in such situations.

I also think it's smart for the person with the firepit or who is having the backyard party to give their neighbours a heads up and make it clear you want them to let you know if they are being disturbed. This makes it less threatening for the old widow across the alley from you to call you asking if you can keep it quiet or the single mother who is having a hard time getting her kid to sleep because of the noise.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Methanolic

Also, The proposed permit would be a one time use (per fire) permit that would have to be obtained prior to the "event".

I'd guess that most back yard fires are not planned, But more spure of the moment occurances. The permit idea would likely cause people to simply give up and get rid of their fire pits.

A permit might educate people on the do's and don't's and what the bylaws are for these fire pits. It might also reduce the number of complaints the city would have to deal with.

I doubt that it would cause people to give up. If you're not breaking any rules then what's the worry? A few of my neighbours built some nice fire pits and am sure they wouldn't be offeneded by a one time permit.

[GGG]

Firepits should not be banned. They are an enjoyable way to spend an evening with friends and familty.

There seems to be two main issues with fire pits Noise and Smoke.

For noise i say suck it up, If it is actually causing a disturbance go over and discuss it or call bylaw, or close your window and ignore it. Noise is part of living in close proximity to neighbours.

As for Smoke this one is a little more touchy. The first thing is close you windows and buy air conditioning. I think that a person keeping there window open and a person having a fire are about equal on the list of things a homeowner should be allowed to do. Perhaps instead of a ban on fires we should have a ban on opening windows.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by GGG

For noise i say suck it up, If it is actually causing a disturbance go over and discuss it or call bylaw, or close your window and ignore it. Noise is part of living in close proximity to neighbours.

No. It's about not being a self centrered jerk and showing some respect for the neighbours around you. People shouldn't have to call 311 due to excessive noise. A little common sense is needed.

[Methanolic]

Originally Posted by Dion

A permit might educate people on the do's and don't's and what the bylaws are for these fire pits. It might also reduce the number of complaints the city would have to deal with.

I doubt that it would cause people to give up. If you're not breaking any rules then what's the worry? A few of my neighbours built some nice fire pits and am sure they wouldn't be offeneded by a one time permit.

I think you may have misunderstood. The proposed Permit structure is a "one time PER USE" Permit. This would mean basically all fires would have to be Planned and a permit obtained prior TO EACH FIRE.

10 fires per summer .....10 trips to city hall and 10 permits.


Even if the permits came at a cost of $5 bucks each, The policy would go over like a lead balloon and would just be taken as another City of Calgary "No Fun Allowed" policy.


Like I said, I predict fire pits will be banned in "The City that Fun Forgot" by summers end.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Dion

No. It's about not being a self centrered jerk and showing some respect for the neighbours around you. People shouldn't have to call 311 due to excessive noise. A little common sense is needed.

Your version of common sense may be a hell of a lot different from mine though.

I've had people call the cops at 1101pm to complain about noise. Even midnight or 1am is excessive. I say common sense doesn't kick in until 2am. And even then I think everyone is entitled to partying all night every once and a while.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Methanolic

I think you may have misunderstood. The proposed Permit structure is a "one time PER USE" Permit. This would mean basically all fires would have to be Planned and a permit obtained prior TO EACH FIRE.

10 fires per summer .....10 trips to city hall and 10 permits.


Even if the permits came at a cost of $5 bucks each, The policy would go over like a lead balloon and would just be taken as another City of Calgary "No Fun Allowed" policy.


Like I said, I predict fire pits will be banned in "The City that Fun Forgot" by summers end.

Fair enough - i see your point

[Methanolic]

Originally Posted by Dion

No. It's about not being a self centrered jerk and showing some respect for the neighbours around you. People shouldn't have to call 311 due to excessive noise. A little common sense is needed.

Well said.

And yeah, Common Sense. Talk about a diminishing trait!!

[Dion]

Originally Posted by flip

Your version of common sense may be a hell of a lot different from mine though.

I've had people call the cops at 1101pm to complain about noise. Even midnight or 1am is excessive. I say common sense doesn't kick in until 2am. And even then I think everyone is entitled to partying all night every once and a while.

It appears it is. I tend to think of how my actions might affect the people around me as opposed to i'm going to do whatever i want and to hell with what people think. Just because i might want to party all night doesn't give me the right to disturb my neighbours peace when he's trying to sleep.

[flip]

Originally Posted by Dion

It appears it is. I tend to think of how my actions might affect the people around me as opposed to i'm going to do whatever i want and to hell with what people think. Just because i might want to party all night doesn't give me the right to disturb my neighbours peace when he's trying to sleep.

See and this is exactly what is wrong with people with your viewpoint. You always feel it is zero sum. If I'm going to have a good time it has to be at someone else's expense and that I don't care about those around me.

In fact it is the opposite. I have enough respect for my neighbors to know that if they want to party until 2am, or 5am for all I care, I'm not going to get on their case about it, so long as they don't do it every Friday. I also expect that they'll have enough respect for me to let me party until the wee hours occasionally. You think it is a lack of respect, when I think tattling on your neighbors, when they're good 360 days a year and like to party for 5 of those, is the disrespectful act, not the partying.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by flip

Your version of common sense may be a hell of a lot different from mine though.

I've had people call the cops at 1101pm to complain about noise. Even midnight or 1am is excessive. I say common sense doesn't kick in until 2am. And even then I think everyone is entitled to partying all night every once and a while.

But if someone has a young child that needs to sleep and wakes to peopel screaming next door, and that guy and his his child need to be up at 6 am the next morning for daycare/work, then I would say 2am would be very excessive.

[flip]

Originally Posted by flameswin

But if someone has a young child that needs to sleep and wakes to peopel screaming next door, and that guy and his his child need to be up at 6 am the next morning for daycare/work, then I would say 2am would be very excessive.

Sure but occasionally just dealing with it is a solution too. If I'm having a party I inform my neighbors a few days in advance. If they know that they have a swim meet the next morning then I consider it their responsibility to set up a way to sleep undisturbed. Close the windows, sleep in the basement whatever it may be it is up to them.

BUT and that is a big but, I always assume that there will be a time when I'll be forced to make a sacrifice for them to be able to have fun.

And if it turns out they never party, or their kids never make noise on a Sat morning, or they don't ever have fire pits in their backyard, then you know what? They're just good neighbors. You can't always have your way and personally I think having to end a party early just as bad as some guy getting not as much sleep as he's used to the night before work.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by flip

See and this is exactly what is wrong with people with your viewpoint. You always feel it is zero sum. If I'm going to have a good time it has to be at someone else's expense and that I don't care about those around me.

In fact it is the opposite. I have enough respect for my neighbors to know that if they want to party until 2am, or 5am for all I care, I'm not going to get on their case about it, so long as they don't do it every Friday. I also expect that they'll have enough respect for me to let me party until the wee hours occasionally. You think it is a lack of respect, when I think tattling on your neighbors, when they're good 360 days a year and like to party for 5 of those, is the disrespectful act, not the partying.

The problem here is you expect the people around you to tolerate your all night parties that happen say 5 times a year. That to me that is self centered.

People around you calling the cops suggests to me that they don't agree with your line of thinking. Is thier right to peace not a valid issue?

[Dion]

Originally Posted by flip

Sure but occasionally just dealing with it is a solution too. If I'm having a party I inform my neighbors a few days in advance. If they know that they have a swim meet the next morning then I consider it their responsibility to set up a way to sleep undisturbed. Close the windows, sleep in the basement whatever it may be it is up to them.

That sounds like an ultimatum as opposed to can we work something out here. It is not the responsibility of the family to set up a way to sleep undisturbed. You should respect the fact the family has to get up early for a swim meet.