Alright, this is a little too much from me... (Smoking ban with kids in car)

[Azure]

Originally Posted by J pold

The difference is that eating is a necessity, yes I know you don’t need to eat junk food but when you are a low income family and all you can afford too feed your children with is frozen crap that is full of preservatives and food that is healthy and full of nutrients is almost double the price the choice is pretty simple

Thats a good point.

Obesity rates almost double going from high-income families, to low income families.

Often because junk food costs a lot less than going to the local market and buying fruit.

Still no excuse though....families with a low-income get food stamps, and checks from the government that allow them to spend more money on food. Instead of using that money to buy health, nutritious food, they instead spend it on junk food.

[Azure]

Originally Posted by The Ditch

I agree with your points but supersize me was so sensationalist. The movie seemed so fake and he literally ate every meal there and he ate more than his body could handle. Not that I doubt there are people who would do that but I have never met any.

But I think you are correct in saying a parents bad eating habits could/will affect the rest of their kids live.

The guy admitted that he went to extremes in order to prove a point.

Still doesn't take away from the fact that a Big Mac Combo is usually around 1,500 calories. Yeah, eating that once a week won't cause SUCH a big problem, but the problem is that people can't control themselves.

Instead of eating out once a week, they eat out 5 times a week cause its much easier than cooking your own meals.

[J pold]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

This is BS.

My mother grew up in almost poverty in London England with 5 brothers raised by a single mother. None of them are fat, and all of them are fit, and judging by their old photos, they weren't malnourished. They have all gone on to have very successful careers, a couple even achieving financial freedom before they hit 40!

Ignorance is truly bliss

When your mother was growing up there wasn’t things like frozen diners, processed foods, fast food joints on every corner

The food she ate is probably what her family grew themselves or bought fresh at a local market that day

Even in the present day Europe is a much healthier place with less obesity than America so comparing the two is apples and oranges

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

This is BS.

My mother grew up in almost poverty in London England with 5 brothers raised by a single mother. None of them are fat, and all of them are fit, and judging by their old photos, they weren't malnourished. They have all gone on to have very successful careers, a couple even achieving financial freedom before they hit 40!

Its North American values. As opposed to eating properly and making your kids GO OUT to play and have a life, we saturate ourselves with crap in front of the TV playing Xbox. Through this, we learn to not dream. Can't win, don't try. Pass me a controller.

Good points.

There is a direct correlation between the increasing fame of video games, the rate of obesity almost doubling between 1991-2001.

You don't 'need' a gym to be healthy, nor do you need access to health promotions, and stuff like that.

[J pold]

Originally Posted by Azure

Still no excuse though....families with a low-income get food stamps, and checks from the government that allow them to spend more money on food. Instead of using that money to buy health, nutritious food, they instead spend it on junk food.

When you’re a single mother with 4 or 5 mouths to feed and you get a check for 100 dollars from the government it becomes a matter of utility

How much food can I get with the money I have, unfortunately the answer is buying frozen proceeds foods

[Azure]

Originally Posted by J pold

When you’re a single mother with 4 or 5 mouths to feed and you get a check for 100 dollars from the government it becomes a matter of utility

How much food can I get with the money I have, unfortunately the answer is buying frozen proceeds foods

I don't get what you're saying.

Frozen, processed foods is a lot better than taking your family to Mickey D's....3 times a week, which is what most low-income families do.

A very low percentage of the population is obese because they can't 'afford' to buy healthy foods.

[mykalberta]

I would agree with this but I know this will lead to the government coming into my home and telling my how to live or raise my kids. That is unaceptable so as a casualty of war I must disagree with Okotoks.

[psicodude]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

Dood, did you read the post?

If you eat crap all the time, your kids will learn the behavior of eating crap all the time.

How can you call condemning your kids to a life of suffering from YOUR BAD CHOICES "not hurting anyone else".

Also, what happens when you're too fat to attend their grad, make it to the hospital for life/death situations, hell, take them to the movies?

That was a very poor post.


EDIT: Looks like some others beat me to it.

No, a bad post is one that uses extreme examples to prove a weak point. What percentage of the population in Calgary are too fat to attend a grade or go to the hospital? Maybe 1 in 100,000? What percentage smoke with a child in the car? Maybe 1 in 50?

If you read my other post, I said that if not feeding a kid is child abuse, then way over-feeding (yeah, not a word) should be as well. But honestly, we are talking about a tiny number of people in Canada.

I am all for improving the health of our society. I just think the chances of my kid dying from second hand smoke is a lot higher than the chances of him dying from having 2 big macs a month.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by psicodude

No, a bad post is one that uses extreme examples to prove a weak point. What percentage of the population in Calgary are too fat to attend a grade or go to the hospital? Maybe 1 in 100,000? What percentage smoke with a child in the car? Maybe 1 in 50?

If you read my other post, I said that if not feeding a kid is child abuse, then way over-feeding (yeah, not a word) should be as well. But honestly, we are talking about a tiny number of people in Canada.

I am all for improving the health of our society. I just think the chances of my kid dying from second hand smoke is a lot higher than the chances of him dying from having 2 big macs a month.

Eating crap for 50 years or even much less would make you that person.

Yes, second hand smoke is more dangerous for the kid than 2 big macs. But if its planted in his psyche that its acceptable to be morbidly obese, then chances are he won't care if he himself becomes that way, because daddy is like that so its okay.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by J pold

Ignorance is truly bliss

When your mother was growing up there wasn’t things like frozen diners, processed foods, fast food joints on every corner

The food she ate is probably what her family grew themselves or bought fresh at a local market that day

Even in the present day Europe is a much healthier place with less obesity than America so comparing the two is apples and oranges

I'll meet you half-way about the fast-food joints for sure. And the sheer amount of processed food today does certainly outweigh that of the 50's-60's.

I was making the point that even in almost poverty one can still do their best to be healthy.

[BuzzardsWife]

Originally Posted by Azure

I don't get what you're saying.

Frozen, processed foods is a lot better than taking your family to Mickey D's....3 times a week, which is what most low-income families do.

A very low percentage of the population is obese because they can't 'afford' to buy healthy foods.

Most low income families go to Mickey D's 3 times a week? Whoa..what planet is this on? I was one time low income, and I cooked what I could afford and got very creative with leftovers too! I could not afford Mickey d's or Dairy Queen. That's generalizing, kind of like saying all men go home after work and do nothing And just for everyones info..processed and frozen food is way more expensive than cooking a chicken and some potatoes and a fresh veggie.

[Weiser Wonder]

In the States, the big thing with the poor and a fast food diet is often that poor urban areas are surrounded by fast food places and grocery stores are no where to be found. These people do not have cars, so they cannot drive to a supermarket and therefore eat fast food.

Is that true for Canada? I have no idea.

[LChoy]

Originally Posted by Traditional_Ale

I'll meet you half-way about the fast-food joints for sure. And the sheer amount of processed food today does certainly outweigh that of the 50's-60's.

I was making the point that even in almost poverty one can still do their best to be healthy.

I was feeling a little offended since I do work for the government department that works on the deterimants of health. I can tell you that it is not BS, and your environment does play an important part of one's health. I applaud that your family came out well and healthy, but for every success story like yours, I hear about families where the parents have 2 jobs each and can't afford, or don't have the time to feed their family a healthy meal. Unfortunately, those families at a lower background have more odds and challenges against them than families that are better off. Health is being seen now from a more multi-sectorial approach including looks at environment, education, housing, cultural..etc, all factors that contributes to ones health. We have been trying for the longest time to change the focus to a more prevention and promotion model. Try to catch people before they become burden with chronic but preventable disease. It's staggering how many kids are being diagnosed with Type I diabete or develop signs of early high blood pressure.

[Agamemnon]

I don't get it... people really should never have been allowed to smoke in front of kids in the first place (as witnessed by the total ban on indoor smoking that exists/is coming). To me this isn't a 'oh my god big brother is telling me what to do' issue... this is correcting something that never should have started.

Can you put your baby in a tanning bed? And if not... why not? It's your baby... right? Seems the same type of thing...

Though, to be honest, I can't imagine what's going through the mind of someone who's smoking with their kid in the car. You may as well just chop 10 years off their life. Great parenting.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by psicodude

No, a bad post is one that uses extreme examples to prove a weak point. What percentage of the population in Calgary are too fat to attend a grade or go to the hospital? Maybe 1 in 100,000? What percentage smoke with a child in the car? Maybe 1 in 50?

Where do you get these numbers? I hear that 67.2% of all statistics are made up on the spot...

Maybe not too fat to attend school, but eating so unhealthy that they have developed diabetes? Or can't take a flight of stairs w/o being flushed and short of breath? I bet that number is higher than 1/100000...

[Ford Prefect]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

Where do you get these numbers? I hear that 67.2% of all statistics are made up on the spot...

Maybe not too fat to attend school, but eating so unhealthy that they have developed diabetes? Or can't take a flight of stairs w/o being flushed and short of breath? I bet that number is higher than 1/100000...

Whatever that number is, it could probably be said that it's hit critical mass.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by lchoy

I was feeling a little offended since I do work for the government department that works on the deterimants of health. I can tell you that it is not BS, and your environment does play an important part of one's health. I applaud that your family came out well and healthy, but for every success story like yours, I hear about families where the parents have 2 jobs each and can't afford, or don't have the time to feed their family a healthy meal. Unfortunately, those families at a lower background have more odds and challenges against them than families that are better off. Health is being seen now from a more multi-sectorial approach including looks at environment, education, housing, cultural..etc, all factors that contributes to ones health. We have been trying for the longest time to change the focus to a more prevention and promotion model. Try to catch people before they become burden with chronic but preventable disease. It's staggering how many kids are being diagnosed with Type I diabete or develop signs of early high blood pressure.

I'm lucky that I was taught the value of home-cooking. As in, learning to cook, appreciating food and preparing it. My S.O. loves cooking.

People who "dont have time" to feed their families healthy, home cooked dinner I find generally don't know how to cook properly anyway, and were never taught how to appreciate it.

[psicodude]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

Where do you get these numbers? I hear that 67.2% of all statistics are made up on the spot...

Maybe not too fat to attend school, but eating so unhealthy that they have developed diabetes? Or can't take a flight of stairs w/o being flushed and short of breath? I bet that number is higher than 1/100000...

Of course they are made up. They come from my 35 years of using my eyes. Personally, I have never met a person too overweight to make it to the hospital if they had to, so that sort of leads me to believe there aren't a lot of them around. And see where I said "maybe" and put a question mark at the end? That means I am making an educated guess. But hey, if you need to challenge me to back up my life experience with stats to make your argument more plausible, then you win I guess.

The post I responded to was talking about parents that were so fat that they could not attend a grad or bring someone to the hospital. That is a seriously far cry from getting flushed when you go up some stairs. Pretty much everyone over 65 gets flushed going up stairs. I guess we need to keep them away from kids so they don't corrupt them with their unhealthy lifestyle.

Anyway, this thread is majorly off topic now. I will just leave things by saying I am happy when lawmakers at least try to help those who can't help themselves.

[Traditional_Ale]

Originally Posted by psicodude

I will just leave things by saying I am happy when lawmakers at least try to help those who can't help themselves.

I think we just agreed.

[Dion]

Originally Posted by Azure

We are.

Obesity will kill approximately 400,000 people in the US this year. Smoking will kill 430,000.

The rate of people dying from smoking has fallen considerably, while the rate of obesity is shooting through the roof.

So, considering that obesity is going to be a much bigger problem than smoking in about 5 years, should the government start regulating how much we eat, and God forbid, WHAT we eat?

Also, according to the book written by the guy who produced 'Super-size Me'.....almost 80% of the kids who grow up in a home where unhealthy eating habits are normal....will become overweight, and obese. And more than 50% of those kids will have health problems by the time they are 25 years old.

In fact, there are more kids suffering from Type 2 diabetes as a direct result of poor eating habits, than there are kids suffering from the effects of second hand smoke.

So, which is more harmful?

That 50% of kids you talked about for sure will have health problems, still they have opportunity as adults to make lifestyle changes. For sure some won't, but it doesn't negate the fact they still have that option.

As for second hand smoke........

http://www.bchealthguide.org/healthf...0a.stm#E46E291

Children exposed to second-hand smoke have a greater risk of suffering from lung cancer, nasal sinus cancer, heart disease, stroke, and breathing problems, including increased coughing, wheezing, pneumonia, bronchitis, and asthma.

Second-hand smoke can affect childrens behaviour and their ability to understand and reason. Studies have shown that children who are regularly exposed to second-hand smoke score lower on tests in reading, math, logic and reasoning skills.

Infants who breathe second-hand smoke have a greater chance of dying from Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS), also known as crib death. More than three times as many infants die from second-hand smoke-related SIDS as from child abuse or homicide.