Do you want to know why this case has sparked so much outrage? Because it's not a rare occurrence in the US.
If you want to see why I get so frustrated about this issue? Watch this video. Black man is sitting outside of a store alone, waiting for his children to get out of some school function. Just waiting. Paranoid store clerk calls the police. Police insist that he identify himself--which if he's done nothing wrong, if he has done nothing suspicious, why should he have to identify himself? He speaks politely and calmly with the police and then a male officer arrives and he gets to be arrested in front of his children and other onlookers while having done absolutely nothing wrong other than being black and sitting on a public bench.
I admittedly only made it halfway through that video, it was just entirely too bothersome for me to listen to a poor innocent man freaking out because he's being unjustly arrested while his children watch.
This is a major, ongoing problem with law enforcement in this country, and there are a million examples of it. This isn't a problem for Ferguson, or St Louis, or Missouri. This is a major problem for the entire United States, and if Michael Brown's death sparks controversy and outrage and speculation about the consistently growing police problem in the US, then that is a good thing for the citizens of this country.
And yes, I realize this is a different case, different officers, a different city, etc. Fact of the matter is that it's all the same underlying issue: police deeming it necessary, on a regular basis, to use excessive force with black people in general, but especially black men. I'm sure other races get it as well, but it's an epidemic with black men, and it needs to be scrutinized as a nation-wide issue, not just a small town problem with one police force.
Last edited by wittynickname; 08-28-2014 at 04:39 PM.
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Do you want to know why this case has sparked so much outrage? Because it's not a rare occurrence in the US.
If you want to see why I get so frustrated about this issue? Watch this video. Black man is sitting outside of a store alone, waiting for his children to get out of some school function. Just waiting. Paranoid store clerk calls the police. Police insist that he identify himself--which if he's done nothing wrong, if he has done nothing suspicious, why should he have to identify himself? He speaks politely and calmly with the police and then a male officer arrives and he gets to be arrested in front of his children and other onlookers while having done absolutely nothing wrong other than being black and sitting on a public bench.
I admittedly only made it halfway through that video, it was just entirely too bothersome for me to listen to a poor innocent man freaking out because he's being unjustly arrested while his children watch.
This is a major, ongoing problem with law enforcement in this country, and there are a million examples of it. This isn't a problem for Ferguson, or St Louis, or Missouri. This is a major problem for the entire United States, and if Michael Brown's death sparks controversy and outrage and speculation about the consistently growing police problem in the US, then that is a good thing for the citizens of this country.
And yes, I realize this is a different case, different officers, a different city, etc. Fact of the matter is that it's all the same underlying issue: police deeming it necessary, on a regular basis, to use excessive force with black people in general, but especially black men. I'm sure other races get it as well, but it's an epidemic with black men, and it needs to be scrutinized as a nation-wide issue, not just a small town problem with one police force.
Looking forward to the law and order types to explain what police school technique that video was from. In what world are the cops allowed to steal your property for 6 months as well? What could possibly been on that phone that they needed to steal it for 6 months?
Last edited by Aarongavey; 08-28-2014 at 05:55 PM.
Looking forward to the law and order types to explain what police school technique that video was from. In what world are the cops allowed to steal your property for 6 months as well? What could possibly been on that phone that they needed to steal it for 6 months?
Actually there is a law in the US that allows the US to cease anything. Its pretty crazy how its abused. Cant remember the name of it but John Oliver and Colbert did bits about it. Police budgets are being funded by it. Its crazy.
3. The autopsy revealed that the shots were not close range, which I understand, means at least 12''. Impossible to determine range outside of that, whether it was 2 feet or 50 feet. CSI has apparently been lying to me.
4. There was no incident report.
5. The police force completely militarized to react to a protest, which escalated the situation way more than was necessary.
Now, I'm not saying that the cop is obviously guilty of race-based, rage induced murder. But I am saying that he's guilty of incompetence leading to the death of an unarmed man, which I believe should be at least manslaughter.
I talked to my buddy the other day, who is a cop that primarily works in downtown Edmonton, so he sees a lot of things. I asked him if he could imagine a scenario where this could have happened with him, and he said their procedures would never have allowed the situation to escalate to the point where he would have to empty 10 rounds into someone. The video that Flash showed earlier also shows a competent takedown in Canada, which IIRC included one shot. In that case I don't even think it was a real bullet, but that's irrelevant to my point.
Competent officers are able to assess a situation before placing themselves into it, they're able to control a situation once they are in it, and by and large they are able to perform their duty without emptying 10 rounds into an unarmed man. The actions of this one officer as well as the police force in responding to protests illustrate to me that we have both an incompetent officer and police force as a whole.
This was just an escalation of a mess that should have been avoided.
I don't know what worries me the most though. The fact that this happened and seems to happen way more than it should in the states, or the fact that so many here are fine with the fact that a police force is free to act this way.
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Do you want to know why this case has sparked so much outrage? Because it's not a rare occurrence in the US.
If you want to see why I get so frustrated about this issue? Watch this video. Black man is sitting outside of a store alone, waiting for his children to get out of some school function. Just waiting. Paranoid store clerk calls the police. Police insist that he identify himself--which if he's done nothing wrong, if he has done nothing suspicious, why should he have to identify himself? He speaks politely and calmly with the police and then a male officer arrives and he gets to be arrested in front of his children and other onlookers while having done absolutely nothing wrong other than being black and sitting on a public bench.
I admittedly only made it halfway through that video, it was just entirely too bothersome for me to listen to a poor innocent man freaking out because he's being unjustly arrested while his children watch.
This is a major, ongoing problem with law enforcement in this country, and there are a million examples of it. This isn't a problem for Ferguson, or St Louis, or Missouri. This is a major problem for the entire United States, and if Michael Brown's death sparks controversy and outrage and speculation about the consistently growing police problem in the US, then that is a good thing for the citizens of this country.
And yes, I realize this is a different case, different officers, a different city, etc. Fact of the matter is that it's all the same underlying issue: police deeming it necessary, on a regular basis, to use excessive force with black people in general, but especially black men. I'm sure other races get it as well, but it's an epidemic with black men, and it needs to be scrutinized as a nation-wide issue, not just a small town problem with one police force.
Exactly. And even in a city as 'liberal' or 'forward thinking' as New York, they have a stop and frisk policy. And of course, African American citizens, Hispanic decent citizens, and Indo-Asian decent citzens, make up nearly 90% of the people being stopped and frisked.
Racial profiling and unfair police practices is a problem literally EVERYWHERE in the US right now. Of course a lot of these shootings are racially motivated.
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Do you want to know why this case has sparked so much outrage? Because it's not a rare occurrence in the US.
If you want to see why I get so frustrated about this issue? Watch this video. Black man is sitting outside of a store alone, waiting for his children to get out of some school function. Just waiting. Paranoid store clerk calls the police. Police insist that he identify himself--which if he's done nothing wrong, if he has done nothing suspicious, why should he have to identify himself? He speaks politely and calmly with the police and then a male officer arrives and he gets to be arrested in front of his children and other onlookers while having done absolutely nothing wrong other than being black and sitting on a public bench.
I admittedly only made it halfway through that video, it was just entirely too bothersome for me to listen to a poor innocent man freaking out because he's being unjustly arrested while his children watch.
This is a major, ongoing problem with law enforcement in this country, and there are a million examples of it. This isn't a problem for Ferguson, or St Louis, or Missouri. This is a major problem for the entire United States, and if Michael Brown's death sparks controversy and outrage and speculation about the consistently growing police problem in the US, then that is a good thing for the citizens of this country.
And yes, I realize this is a different case, different officers, a different city, etc. Fact of the matter is that it's all the same underlying issue: police deeming it necessary, on a regular basis, to use excessive force with black people in general, but especially black men. I'm sure other races get it as well, but it's an epidemic with black men, and it needs to be scrutinized as a nation-wide issue, not just a small town problem with one police force.
" I want to know who you are and what was the problem back there?"
Part a) I am not legally obligated to tell you who I am.
part b) there was no problem back there
Vague....my name is so and so and i am waiting for my kids...probably puts you in better standing...but hey that video did tug at my heart strings a lil
the mindset of the cop for their protection is to assume the worst, now a small minority do take that too far, but there is a incredible ignorance and "leave me the eff alone" attitude amongst a lot of people
it's pretty simple sometimes
"if the police are looking for someone else, you may avoid being arrested by showing that you are not that person."
"If the police think that you have committed an offence and you do not tell them who you are, they may arrest you and hold you at a police station until they find out who you are."
"If the police think that you have committed a minor offence and you identify yourself to their satisfaction, they may give you a ticket or a notice telling you when to appear in court rather than arresting you."
and these are Canadian Police guidelines...not the states, which we know can have different standards
Last edited by MelBridgeman; 08-29-2014 at 03:01 PM.
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Part a) I am not legally obligated to tell you who I am.
part b) there was no problem back there
I saw the video and I simply don't see how anyone could proclaim based on that video that we absolutely know there was no problem back there. A store called the police. Maybe the employee was racist and called the police because a black man in front of the store scared them or maybe, just maybe there was more to it. I just don't get why everyone always jumps to a conclusion based on video evidence that doesn't show all the events. Why did the man not have his phone recording while sitting in front of the store? Why just when approached by officers does he turn it on. Would it have not been more prudent to film yourself sitting there doing nothing prior to being approached so prove you were in fact causing no trouble? Then we could draw a much clearer conclusion.
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I saw the video and I simply don't see how anyone could proclaim based on that video that we absolutely know there was no problem back there. A store called the police. Maybe the employee was racist and called the police because a black man in front of the store scared them or maybe, just maybe there was more to it. I just don't get why everyone always jumps to a conclusion based on video evidence that doesn't show all the events. Why did the man not have his phone recording while sitting in front of the store? Why just when approached by officers does he turn it on. Would it have not been more prudent to film yourself sitting there doing nothing prior to being approached so prove you were in fact causing no trouble? Then we could draw a much clearer conclusion.
Do you record yourself doing mundane activities all day in case you're approached by police? Say it out loud and see how stupid it sounds. Edit: you know what sounds more suspicious than sitting on a bench? Sitting on a bench recording yourself the whole time.
I feel like I"m taking crazy pills.
He's a black guy sitting on a bench, approached by police. We're talking about this in a thread created because an unarmed black man was shot to death by police for at this point, no reason.
Are you really trying to understand things here, because I don't see much effort on your part.
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it's a case of the criminals making everyone look bad...
chill out, be cool, no problem...even the slightest unwillingness raises eyebrows, as that's generally what someone who has something to hide acts.
Unfortunately that's not how our legal or enforcement system is supposed to work. The police have zero right to harass you and we need to know our rights and stick with them when we can.
Because when you don't, stuff like this happens. If it happened to you once, or repeatedly, you might be singing a different tune.
And the whole point of setting up the system like that, you know, innocent till proven guilty, police not having the right to question you or search you for the heck of it, is so we don't regress into a police state.
These are very important rights for everyone, and even more important when you see the minorities getting abused by denial of them.
I wholeheartedly disagree with the entire feeling of your post. No one, black or white, should have to volunteer anything they aren't legally required to. That may make the situation better, but it makes the system and police forces worse. It is the definition of slippery slope.
The man was as polite and forthcoming as he needed to be. Period. Police cannot impel you to jump through hoops to make their job easier. Especially when stuff like this happens all the time with no real need for it.
Unfortunately that's not how our legal or enforcement system is supposed to work. The police have zero right to harass you and we need to know our rights and stick with them when we can.
Because when you don't, stuff like this happens. If it happened to you once, or repeatedly, you might be singing a different tune.
And the whole point of setting up the system like that, you know, innocent till proven guilty, police not having the right to question you or search you for the heck of it, is so we don't regress into a police state.
These are very important rights for everyone, and even more important when you see the minorities getting abused by denial of them.
I wholeheartedly disagree with the entire feeling of your post. No one, black or white, should have to volunteer anything they aren't legally required to. That may make the situation better, but it makes the system and police forces worse. It is the definition of slippery slope.
The man was as polite and forthcoming as he needed to be. Period. Police cannot impel you to jump through hoops to make their job easier. Especially when stuff like this happens all the time with no real need for it.
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Do you record yourself doing mundane activities all day in case you're approached by police? Say it out loud and see how stupid it sounds.
I feel like I"m taking crazy pills.
He's a black guy sitting on a bench, approached by police. We're talking about this in a thread created because an unarmed black man was shot to death by police for at this point, no reason.
Are you really trying to understand things here, because I don't see much effort on your part.
No but if approached by the police would never get the urge to record it unless I maybe actually did do something to warrant it as I may be able to use the video to deflect what I may have done and turn it into something that makes the police look bad.
No but if approached by the police would never get the urge to record it unless I maybe actually did do something to warrant it as I may be able to use the video to deflect what I may have done and turn it into something that makes the police look bad.
Let me guess, you're a white Canadian.
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Unfortunately that's not how our legal or enforcement system is supposed to work. The police have zero right to harass you and we need to know our rights and stick with them when we can.
Because when you don't, stuff like this happens. If it happened to you once, or repeatedly, you might be singing a different tune.
And the whole point of setting up the system like that, you know, innocent till proven guilty, police not having the right to question you or search you for the heck of it, is so we don't regress into a police state.
I don't disagree, but sometimes "theories" don't translate into reality. Again I don't see the big deal in "My name is John Doe and i am waiting for my kids, I don't know what you mean by "problem" back there....ect" -
These are very important rights for everyone, and even more important when you see the minorities getting abused by denial of them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daradon
I wholeheartedly disagree with the entire feeling of your post. No one, black or white, should have to volunteer anything they aren't legally required to. That may make the situation better, but it makes the system and police forces worse. It is the definition of slippery slope.
The man was as polite and forthcoming as he needed to be. Period. Police cannot impel you to jump through hoops to make their job easier. Especially when stuff like this happens all the time with no real need for it.
I am not surprised and don't blame you, I am just a little annoyed at videos like these that show one part of a situation and everyone is a rush to judge....kinda like the cops?
must be human nature...
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No but if approached by the police would never get the urge to record it unless I maybe actually did do something to warrant it as I may be able to use the video to deflect what I may have done and turn it into something that makes the police look bad.
I actually laughed out loud at this.
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Originally Posted by MisterJoji
Johnny eats garbage and isn’t 100% committed.
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