As soon as the police stopped he pulls out a knife and purposely displays it and then continues in their direction.
But sure call me "prejudiced". I'm not even defending the police here. I think they were in the wrong, and if they covered anything up, as alleged, they should all spend the rest of their lives in jail.
I will admit that without audio, you cannot tell conclusively whether he turned to them or was shot first. Either way, the correct response to police arriving on the scene is not to pull out a knife.
He continues walking, but is certainly not walking towards them. The distance between him and the officers is increasing and given his orientation will continue to increase. This is pretty clear.
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Right or wrong the cops have a right to shoot the kid for the failure of not dropping the 3 inch knife when told, what the cops don't have a right to do is to make sure he's dead by shooting his lifeless body 15 more times and erasing security tapes.
It's looks obvious a racist cop murdered this kid, but the others who tried to cover it up need to pay in a big way as well.
No...he's surrounded by police cars and walking quickly in the direction of two of the officers with a knife in his hand. At the time he's shot he's 1 lane of traffic away from the officers (approximately 8-10 feet) with a clearly visible knife.
He's walking quickly, but he's obviously not walking in their direction. They are on the left, he's going to the right. That's clearly what is happening. The cop firing his gun is actually walking towards the guy as he starts to shoot him. What you are saying happened is the opposite of what happened in the video we all can see.
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Originally Posted by blankall
Depicting this guy as a saint is a red herring. The police unloading an entire clip of bullets, shooting him on the ground, tampering with evidence, etc... is what needs to be investigated. By making the case that this guy was some kind of saint, you are giving ammunition and talking points to people who will want to distract from what the true issue is, the actions of the police officers.
Depicting this guy as being depicted as a Saint is the real red herring. It's like you just made that up. Really, who is depicting him as a Saint?
Right or wrong the cops have a right to shoot the kid for the failure of not dropping the 3 inch knife when told, what the cops don't have a right to do is to make sure he's dead by shooting his lifeless body 15 more times and erasing security tapes.
It's looks obvious a racist cop murdered this kid, but the others who tried to cover it up need to pay in a big way as well.
Everyone keeps mentioning these erased security tapes. From my research, the DA indicated, through forensic testing, that there was no tampering.
While it certainly doesn't change what happened during the shooting, I think it may put to rest the big conspiracy theory.
Also, cops get complaints. Dozens in a career. There are citizens that make a career out of it. Call police. Police attend. Complaint made. There are citizens that make complaints against the same officers over and over. There are hardened criminals in jail that still lodge historical complaints. It doesn't mean a complaint is at all legitimate. While I can't comment on the complaints surrounding this officer or the complaint process there, I just thought I would point it out.
Right or wrong the cops have a right to shoot the kid for the failure of not dropping the 3 inch knife when told, what the cops don't have a right to do is to make sure he's dead by shooting his lifeless body 15 more times and erasing security tapes.
It's looks obvious a racist cop murdered this kid, but the others who tried to cover it up need to pay in a big way as well.
Why do they need to shoot him at all? He's not threatening anyone or anything. Maybe it would have progressed to the time where he had to be shot if he would have done something threatening but there is nothing here that shows you had to get out of the car and give the guy a few seconds to drop a knife and then unload on him.
This whole thing is pretty damning and confusing. I've watched the video multiple times, and the victim was almost walking to get clear of the police who just arrived.
The cop jumped out of his car and basically started firing withing 5 or 6 seconds of arriving, so he had no idea what the up to date tactical situation was or the ROE.
Its pretty clear that the first couple of shots did the trick from the way he fell, then you saw multiple puffs of debris from the bullets striking the ground, I would assume after passing through his body.
The minute he started falling from the first few shots if there was a threat, but I didn't see it, but this guy fired 16 shots which is a full mag and then a reload and fire.
I can't get into the cops head, but the fact that he started firing at a guy who was taking a route around him within 5 seconds and kept firing and then reloaded and fired makes me think that he arrived on scene determined to kill this person.
Now the victim wasn't an angel, but at no point during the video was he a threat to the police. Now he was a threat when he attacked a police car and there could have been a justifiable shooting at that time.
I don't know how his lawyer can do anything but plea for a lower sentence in protective custody. But any court battle starts and ends with that video.
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Also, cops get complaints. Dozens in a career. There are citizens that make a career out of it. Call police. Police attend. Complaint made. There are citizens that make complaints against the same officers over and over. There are hardened criminals in jail that still lodge historical complaints. It doesn't mean a complaint is at all legitimate. While I can't comment on the complaints surrounding this officer or the complaint process there, I just thought I would point it out.
And reality is, only a small % of officers get numerous complaints, in Chicago, 6% of officers got more than 11 complaints in 2014. And also in Chicago in 2014, only about 30% of complaints were false. 97-99% (depending on who you believe) of complains do no result in any discipline. Most of the upheld complaints are filed by white people and mostly against black officers. So I'm going to say the conspiracy is back on.
Criminologists say the public’s ability to see civilian complaints against officers and similar data compels police departments to be more accountable, especially when it comes to officers who receive frequent complaints.“Look, it’s not unusual for a police officer to get a complaint, but the fact is that a complaint is a significant piece of information if it is a recurring thing,” Professor Harris said. “It is the patterns we worry about.”
And reality is, only a small % of officers get numerous complaints, in Chicago, 6% of officers got more than 11 complaints in 2014. And also in Chicago in 2014, only about 30% of complaints were false. 97-99% (depending on who you believe) of complains do no result in any discipline. Most of the upheld complaints are filed by white people and mostly against black officers. So I'm going to say the conspiracy is back on.
The department disputes the 97-99% were disciplined number the article goes on to say.
I still stand by the statement though that in a career, or even in a 10 year span, a cop will have dozens of complaints. That, in it of itself, isn't the smoking gun, nor, in my opinion, show a pattern of behavior. Further, complaints can be anything from a cop swearing to excessive force and everything in between.
He continues walking, but is certainly not walking towards them. The distance between him and the officers is increasing and given his orientation will continue to increase. This is pretty clear.
He starts off about 50 feet away from the cops, and ends up about 8 feet away. He angles his path so that he's not directly in their faces, but he's still far closer than he was at the beginning of the footage.
Anyways, it's all a bit of a moot point, as we both seem to agree that there was serious misconduct and potentially murder here.
He starts off about 50 feet away from the cops, and ends up about 8 feet away. He angles his path so that he's not directly in their faces, but he's still far closer than he was at the beginning of the footage.
Anyways, it's all a bit of a moot point, as we both seem to agree that there was serious misconduct and potentially murder here.
You are correct, the cops were still driving vehicles towards him when the footage started, so he is closer to them than at that point.
I was just referring to the part he had control over, the walking direction and speed.
I honestly don't really have an opinion on it being murder or not, as that is more of a technical legal thing, but I can't see much reason for the dude being shot given that limited clip.
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You are correct, the cops were still driving vehicles towards him when the footage started, so he is closer to them than at that point.
I was just referring to the part he had control over, the walking direction and speed.
I honestly don't really have an opinion on it being murder or not, as that is more of a technical legal thing, but I can't see much reason for the dude being shot given that limited clip.
The police car in question is actually driving away from him at the time the footage of him walking starts. They stop their vehicle further up the road and then exit their vehicle and remain close to it. The camera, which is following McDonald also moves forward.
As soon as the police car stops and the officers exit, McDonald then pulls out the knife and displays it in his right hand. All the while, he continues walking up the street. He starts up about 50 feet from their stopped position and ends up about 8 feet from the officers.
McDonald turns his face, and right shoulder towards the officers. Without sound you cannot tell if he's been shot before doing this. Just before reaching the officers he seems to go into almost a fast skip and picks up the pace of his movement but then slows down again when he is close to the officers.
Daniel Holtzclaw, a former Oklahoma City police officer who was accused of sexually assaulting 13 black women while on duty, was found guilty of rape and sexual battery on Thursday.
During the trial, 13 women testified that Holtzclaw sexually assaulted them. The charges included six first-degree rape counts.
Prosecutors argued that Holtzclaw systematically targeted black women with prior criminal records and substance abuse problems because he thought they wouldn't be believed if they reported the assaults.
According to The Oklahoman, Holtzclaw worked from 4 p.m. to 2 a.m., often by himself, patrolling one of the state's poorest neighborhoods. The women's testimonies revealed a similar pattern: Holtzclaw would stop them, search them for drug paraphernalia and run criminal background checks. Then he'd force them into sex, threatening them with arrest if they didn't comply.
An expert testified that DNA on Holtzclaw's uniform pants matched that of the youngest accuser, who said she was 17 when Holtzclaw raped her on her mother's porch.
She told the court that she didn't tell authorities because she didn't see the point. "What kind of police do you call on the police?" she asked.
The assaults occurred over a period of seven months, with Holtzclaw becoming "more bold, more brazen and more violent" as time went on, prosecutors argued.
One woman, who has been identified by local media as a 57-year-old grandmother, sparked the investigation after she told police that Holtzclaw forced her to give him oral sex during a traffic stop.
Holtzclaw's case was among those profiled by the AP in a yearlong investigation that revealed about 1,000 law enforcement officers had lost their licenses over a six-year period for sex crimes and other sexual misconduct. The AP's finding is undoubtedly an undercount of the problem of sexual abuse in law enforcement. Not every state has a process for stripping problem officers of their licenses, known as decertification. And of those states that do, great variations exist in whether officers are prosecuted or reported to their state licensing boards.
He just got 235 years in prison. That should serve a message to the corrupt cops; the system isn't completely broken, you aren't above the law. Not that I would ever fantasize about torture or violence but Holtzclaw is in deep trouble if he's ever allowed among the general prison populace. Such a thing has to be a cops absolute worst nightmare.
Maybe this will spare some vulnerable poor minorites in the future. One of the worst abuses of power I've ever heard of, his conviction speech had over 30 counts.
He just got 235 years in prison. That should serve a message to the corrupt cops; the system isn't completely broken, you aren't above the law. Not that I would ever fantasize about torture or violence but Holtzclaw is in deep trouble if he's ever allowed among the general prison populace. Such a thing has to be a cops absolute worst nightmare.
Maybe this will spare some vulnerable poor minorites in the future. One of the worst abuses of power I've ever heard of, his conviction speech had over 30 counts.
Yeah, I was wondering what they're going to do with him in prison. There's no way in hell they can put him in with the general population.
And the DA calls the shooting "accidental". He walks towards the car, pulls his gun out, aims, fires twice, and puts the gun away without any apparent hesitation.
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And the DA calls the shooting "accidental". He walks towards the car, pulls his gun out, aims, fires twice, and puts the gun away without any apparent hesitation.
This was just an execution.
Police officer decided that the drunk driver needed to die. The way he re-holsters his gun as soon as the guy is shot shows that he never assumed there was a threat.
A longer video of the event here:
After the shooting, the cops then spend the rest of the time looking for the shells on the ground instead of helping the guy who just got shot.
On one hand this #### is horrifying, on the other it's been going on forever. Only now with the internet, streaming videos and cell phone cameras is the police corruption coming to light. This kind of stuff surfacing will surely hamper their propensity for corruption.
when told, what the cops don't have a right to do is to make sure he's dead by shooting his lifeless body 15 more times and erasing security tapes.
