Just say no to the Russian. This draft is way too deep and important for this team to draft a huge question mark like that. Why pick someone with extra risk when there are a handful of other guys who are are much less of a flight risk, yet probably are within 5-10% of what his ceiling is?
Makes absolutely no sense for the Flames. That first 1st-round pick is one where Id much rather play it safe. Take your flyers with 1 of the other 2 first rounders if need be...but you gotta make sure that 1st pick is solid solid hit.
When a good portion of the hockey and scouting community are ranking this kid in the top 5, some top 3 I think the gap is much larger then you are suggesting, when comparing to guys in the 3rd level of the draft (I see the drops at 4 and 7/8). Risk reward as with any prospect but to me the reward with Nichushkin makes him a lot more attractive then anyone in the 3rd wave.
Different conversation if you're talking about taking him top 5...but if he is there at 8 I think you have to take him.
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Does anyone know where Monahan would have gone if he had been in last years draft?
I would take him over Lindholm if we had the choice. Lindholm sounds an awful lot like Backlund. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. We just already have a Backlund.
Wasn't that the thought with Grigorenko last year? Same fear of the Russian factor.
I'm not sure Grigorenko dropped on the Russian factor (flight risk). I seem to recall reading that he generally interviewed poorly and teams questioned his drive. I could be mistake though.
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Does anyone know where Monahan would have gone if he had been in last years draft?
I would take him over Lindholm if we had the choice. Lindholm sounds an awful lot like Backlund. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. We just already have a Backlund.
I don't know where Monahan would have gone last year, but Lindholm and Backlund are not really that similar. Lindholm is much more physical and IMO a more offensive player, better shot.
Edit: And to not pick Nischuskin at 8 would be insane, sure there is 'Russian factor' risk but he's a very good player, I doubt he makes it out of the top 5.
When a good portion of the hockey and scouting community are ranking this kid in the top 5, some top 3 I think the gap is much larger then you are suggesting, when comparing to guys in the 3rd level of the draft (I see the drops at 4 and 7/8). Risk reward as with any prospect but to me the reward with Nichushkin makes him a lot more attractive then anyone in the 3rd wave.
I don't care how if he's Malkin good. If there's a chance this guy never comes over to NA, you pass. Draft picks are already a bit of a gamble...we don't need additional risk. Especially when guys like Monahan or Lindholm are still available. They might never be as good as him (and that's up for debate), but the chances of them bailing are a lot lower. Personally, I'd never pick a Russian in the top 10.
This draft is crucial for the Flames...quite possibly the most important draft in a couple of decades. We don't have any room for risk with this pick... other teams might, we don't. The "safe" pick here is still a guy who is 90% of what Nichushkin could be at his best.
Wasn't that the thought with Grigorenko last year? Same fear of the Russian factor.
He had his character questioned after disappearing in the second half of the season. It turned out he had mono, but that didnt stop people from thinking he was the prototypical lazy Russian. They ignored him playing through a knee injury in the WJHC and followed a narrative that suited their needs, not facts.
If grigorenko busts, it won't be because he's a Russian.
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I don't care how if he's Malkin good. If there's a chance this guy never comes over to NA, you pass. Draft picks are already a bit of a gamble...we don't need additional risk. Especially when guys like Monahan or Lindholm are still available. They might never be as good as him (and that's up for debate), but the chances of them bailing are a lot lower. Personally, I'd never pick a Russian in the top 10.
This draft is crucial for the Flames...quite possibly the most important draft in a couple of decades. We don't have any room for risk with this pick... other teams might, we don't. The "safe" pick here is still a guy who is 90% of what Nichushkin could be at his best.
This is what interviews are for. If the guy wants to be in the NHL, I have to believe that will come across when teams meet with him. If he doesn't, rest assured bobby Mac and his ilk will be hammering that story home the entire lead up to the draft.
__________________ ”All you have to decide is what to do with the time that is given to you.”
I'm not sure Grigorenko dropped on the Russian factor (flight risk). I seem to recall reading that he generally interviewed poorly and teams questioned his drive. I could be mistake though.
I remember reading that as well, but I can't recall whether they were questioning his drive, or whether he was a flight-risk
I suspect the interviews will largely determine where Nichushkin goes in the draft. If teams walk away from the interview convinced he's going to come over I wouldn't be surprised to see him go top 5. Realistically even with the two-year contract he'll be coming to the NHL at the same time as most of the players in this draft after they finish out juniors. It jus a matter of determining if that is his intent.
That being said, if he is available at the 7/8 spot for us I suspect it will be because the teams ahead of us heard something in the interviews that confirms him as a flight risk, and would have to hope we pass.
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It's like a football player culture. Hip hip, big egos. That's not the kind of player that stays in a Canadian market.
The chances of jones coming here are almost non existent so I won't waste much time on this, but get it together sir. If seth jones was that guy, it would've shown itself by now. jay z wants to turn him into an icon if he goes to the right place. His interest in jones disappears if he plays for Edmonton.
I'm glad your concerns about football culture, hip hop and big egos have nothing to do with race.
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The chances of jones coming here are almost non existent so I won't waste much time on this, but get it together sir. If seth jones was that guy, it would've shown itself by now. jay z wants to turn him into an icon if he goes to the right place. His interest in jones disappears if he plays for Edmonton.
I'm glad your concerns about football culture, hip hop and big egos have nothing to do with race.
There are some big egos in the NHL, but you cannot deny it's nothing compared to the NFL.
Patrick Kane, Ovechkin, Kesler... all giant egos. Again, nothing to do with race. As a fan, I just find it easier to cheer for likeable players (and I'd be less concerned about them leaving once they reach UFA).
In all likelihood, Jones stays away from them anyway. But it would be a red flag otherwise.
I'm not sure Grigorenko dropped on the Russian factor (flight risk). I seem to recall reading that he generally interviewed poorly and teams questioned his drive. I could be mistake though.
I think the concern was he scored something like 75 points in the first 40 games and then 10 points in his last 25 games and was invisible in many games in the play-offs.
It was his drive and questions about his real age that seemed to the major issues over flight risks. I think the flight risks were only if he was dogging it and not making the team if he might leave after a few years, but his time in the Q seemed to alleviate most of the flight concerns.
I don't care how if he's Malkin good. If there's a chance this guy never comes over to NA, you pass. Draft picks are already a bit of a gamble...we don't need additional risk. Especially when guys like Monahan or Lindholm are still available. They might never be as good as him (and that's up for debate), but the chances of them bailing are a lot lower. Personally, I'd never pick a Russian in the top 10.
This draft is crucial for the Flames...quite possibly the most important draft in a couple of decades. We don't have any room for risk with this pick... other teams might, we don't. The "safe" pick here is still a guy who is 90% of what Nichushkin could be at his best.
Well either you can get comfortable with the Russian factor (even if in limit situations) or you can't. Lots of arguments to be made supporting either side.
I understand the importance of this draft for the Flames but I also think that expectations change. If this team is drafting top 3 or 5 then it is very much a "don't F' this up" scenario where anyone off the board is almost unacceptable. However, if the Flames were to drop to the 8th pick or lower then I think that tune has to change; the skill just is not the same at that point. If the Flames go Jankowski-style at 8 I could live with that, any higher and I'd be pretty worried.
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Roc Nation Sports is basically run by it's partner CAA (Creative Arts Agency). The same company that has Crosby, Tavares, Toews, Kane and the Sedins to name a few. Not to mention they are the largest talent agency in the world and represent Cristiano Ronaldo.
With that said, Roc Nation has already signed Robinson Cano of the NY Yankees and is in talks with Victor Cruz. I wouldn't worry too much about who Seth Jones signs with, agents don't really come in many different shapes and sizes.
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There are some big egos in the NHL, but you cannot deny it's nothing compared to the NFL.
Patrick Kane, Ovechkin, Kesler... all giant egos. Again, nothing to do with race. As a fan, I just find it easier to cheer for likeable players (and I'd be less concerned about them leaving once they reach UFA).
In all likelihood, Jones stays away from them anyway. But it would be a red flag otherwise.
So if Jones signs with Roc Nation instead of CAA, he has a giant ego? I think your concerns are completely unfounded. If he negotiated without an agent, like Ovechkin did with his last contract, that would possibly indicate an inflated ego.
Also, Patrick Kane has a big ego according to you. He is currently signed to the same agency as Sidney Crosby. So does that mean Crosby has a large ego?
Last edited by tendulkar23; 04-24-2013 at 11:18 AM.
Does anyone know where Monahan would have gone if he had been in last years draft?
I would take him over Lindholm if we had the choice. Lindholm sounds an awful lot like Backlund. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing. We just already have a Backlund.
Lindholm looks awesome. Good skill set and all-world compete level. I'd bet on a guy like him living up to his draft hype. He has no quit.
When a good portion of the hockey and scouting community are ranking this kid in the top 5, some top 3 I think the gap is much larger then you are suggesting, when comparing to guys in the 3rd level of the draft (I see the drops at 4 and 7/8). Risk reward as with any prospect but to me the reward with Nichushkin makes him a lot more attractive then anyone in the 3rd wave.
Different conversation if you're talking about taking him top 5...but if he is there at 8 I think you have to take him.
He's ranked in the 5-7 range by most scouting services right around where guys like Lindholm and Monahan are ranked. So yeah, no dropoff there at all. And it wouldn't surprise me if he were not top 6 or 7 on the Flames list.
