Our 6th Overall Pick: Elias Lindholm or Sean Monahan?

[The Yen Man]

So we just need Carolina to take Monahan, someone else in the top 5 to take Nichushkin, and Barkov will be ours!

[Dagger]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

Based on what?

Drafts Feaster has been apart of since his first full season

AGM:
1999: Traded out of first round when having first pick(Clouth
2000: Nikita Alexeev(8th) 6'6-230, Ruslain Zainulin(34th) - 6'2-218
2001: Alexander Svitov(3rd) - 6'3-245

GM:
2002: Traded for Fedotenko and 2 2nds
2003: Mike Egener(34th) - 6'4-216 - (traded back for 2nds and a 6th)
2004: Andy Rogers(30th) - 6'5-206
2005: Vladimir Mihalik(30th) - 6'7-240
2006: Riku Helenius(15th) - he's a goalie but was a huge reach/project
2007: traded pick for Shane O'Brien
2008: Stamkos(1st) - chosen by ownership/can't miss(if you do it's Doughty)

AGM(Flames):
2010: Traded(Jokinen deal)

GM(Flames)
2011: Baertschi(13th) 5'11-187
2012: Jankowski(21st) 6'2-172(and projects to grow more)

So in all of his tenure as GM or assistant GM, he's taken one player who was sub 6'2(Baertschi) inside the top 35. Now you say "maybe he's learned, look at him taking Baertschi instead of Armia." Well, he went ahead and grabbed Jankowski last year which is exactly the demographic Feaster usually drafts(big and is a project). He recently reacquired Zainulin's rights too, which can be interpreted any way you like.

I honestly don't see how Nichushkin isn't Feaster's guy if he's there. He took Jankowski early(I know all about the PHX/NJ stuff) because "he could be the best player from the draft 10 years from now." Nichushkin has that same potential, only should he hit his you've got a top 5-10 player in the league.

[Flames Draft Watcher]

I don't know how some of you are so convinced that Nichushkin could be a top 5-10 player in the NHL. To me that is extremely unlikely. Not many wingers are top 5-10 players in the league and expecting him to be one of the best wingers in NHL is more than a bit optimistic IMO.

He's got a chance to be a Rick Nash type player IMO. Not sure that is more valuable than a 1st line centre.

[ignite09]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I don't know how some of you are so convinced that Nichushkin could be a top 5-10 player in the NHL. To me that is extremely unlikely. Not many wingers are top 5-10 players in the league and expecting him to be one of the best wingers in NHL is more than a bit optimistic IMO.

He's got a chance to be a Rick Nash type player IMO. Not sure that is more valuable than a 1st line centre.

With all due respect, have you actually watched him more than anyone else here has? Unless you have some insight based on countless hours of watching him play I don't see how you can criticize anybody's opinion on him. You're the only person I've heard of so far that questions his actual abilities.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

He's got a chance to be a Rick Nash type player IMO. Not sure that is more valuable than a 1st line centre.

Judging by how franchises like the Flames and Jackets fared leaning on wingers as their best player for years it is sure looks to me like a bad way to build a team. I think it's proven by now that you need a top center and good 2nd and 3rd line centers to truly become an elite team.

[saillias]

Originally Posted by Dagger

He recently reacquired Zainulin's rights too, which can be interpreted any way you like.

Source?

[Erick Estrada]

After visiting HF Oilers they have the same poll and Monahan is winning by a fair margin. I think that makes sense given the already have RNH and Monahan looks like an ideal fit as 2nd line center. One thing hit me hard reading that is that there's a very real possibility that if Lindholm and Monahan are the players available when the Flames pick that the Oilers very well may go with the guy the Flames leave. It would really suck if the guy that has the better career is the one the Flames pass up for the Oilers and at this point it's a 50/50 proposition.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Dagger

Drafts Feaster has been apart of since his first full season

AGM:
1999: Traded out of first round when having first pick(Clouth
2000: Nikita Alexeev(8th) 6'6-230, Ruslain Zainulin(34th) - 6'2-218
2001: Alexander Svitov(3rd) - 6'3-245

GM:
2002: Traded for Fedotenko and 2 2nds
2003: Mike Egener(34th) - 6'4-216 - (traded back for 2nds and a 6th)
2004: Andy Rogers(30th) - 6'5-206
2005: Vladimir Mihalik(30th) - 6'7-240
2006: Riku Helenius(15th) - he's a goalie but was a huge reach/project
2007: traded pick for Shane O'Brien
2008: Stamkos(1st) - chosen by ownership/can't miss(if you do it's Doughty)

AGM(Flames):
2010: Traded(Jokinen deal)

GM(Flames)
2011: Baertschi(13th) 5'11-187
2012: Jankowski(21st) 6'2-172(and projects to grow more)

So in all of his tenure as GM or assistant GM, he's taken one player who was sub 6'2(Baertschi) inside the top 35. Now you say "maybe he's learned, look at him taking Baertschi instead of Armia." Well, he went ahead and grabbed Jankowski last year which is exactly the demographic Feaster usually drafts(big and is a project). He recently reacquired Zainulin's rights too, which can be interpreted any way you like.

I honestly don't see how Nichushkin isn't Feaster's guy if he's there. He took Jankowski early(I know all about the PHX/NJ stuff) because "he could be the best player from the draft 10 years from now." Nichushkin has that same potential, only should he hit his you've got a top 5-10 player in the league.

The game has changed. In the clutch and grab days you needed size and power. Now many of the top forwards are smaller. Top notch forwards who are sub 5'10 are plentiful in the NHL.

GMs, as a whole, have adjusted their drafting strategies accordingly. All things being equal, the bigger player is still desirable. But being small isn't nearly as prohibative as it was, and GMs are far more likely to choose a small player in the top 60 than they were even 2-3 years ago.

[Dagger]

Originally Posted by Flames Draft Watcher

I don't know how some of you are so convinced that Nichushkin could be a top 5-10 player in the NHL. To me that is extremely unlikely. Not many wingers are top 5-10 players in the league and expecting him to be one of the best wingers in NHL is more than a bit optimistic IMO.

He's got a chance to be a Rick Nash type player IMO. Not sure that is more valuable than a 1st line centre.

If he reaches his full potential it's completely conceivable. To begin with e's already 6'4 but he's only 196. He should be able to easily get to 215-220ish and maintain his speed. He's a fantastic skater that consistently shows good edge work and change of pace to fool and get by defeneseman. His hands are very good, he's shown he can use them in tight around the net to finish, and to make a quick move to send a defensemen the wrong way. His most impressive trait however is his shear strength. He has no problem holding off defensemen(some good enough to play in the NHL) whilst he's barreling to the net, in many cases having him one on one against a defensemen ends up with him creating a scoring chance, and at the very least a scramble in front of the net.

Maybe he does become like Rick Nash, but I'd be ecstatic if we found a Richard winner at 6.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by saillias

Source?

Don't know how he got there but on the Flames site

[CalgaryFan1988]

Originally Posted by ignite09

Wow. Listening to some of you give your backwards logic as too why we shouldn't draft Nuchushkin is starting to get painful.

All I'm saying is that at #6 it is too big of a risk, in my opinion. It's not simply because he is Russian, either. It's because he's a Russian that already plays in the KHL and that has never played in North America.

If the Flames weren't in a rebuild, with a lack of high end prospects, I'd be all for it. Heck, If I was the Oilers I'd even take the chance. Just too big of a gamble with guys players like Monahan, Lindholm or Barkov being potentially available.

[Dagger]

Originally Posted by blankall

The game has changed. In the clutch and grab days you needed size and power. Now many of the top forwards are smaller. Top notch forwards who are sub 5'10 are plentiful in the NHL.

GMs, as a whole, have adjusted their drafting strategies accordingly. All things being equal, the bigger player is still desirable. But being small isn't nearly as prohibative as it was, and GMs are far more likely to choose a small player in the top 60 than they were even 2-3 years ago.

I can appreciate that, but in many cases Feaster reached taking the big guys("projects") because he likes to swing for the fences. And had his drafting record been more evenly spread out, as opposed to 1 in 9(omitting Stamkos) for sub 6'2 players to 6'2+ he'd get a pass. But for me, 1 in 9 is tough to argue especially considering he reverted back to his old ways last year by reaching to take the 6'3 project.

[vman]

Trade up to #2 and take Mackinnon

[cKy]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Don't know how he got there but on the Flames site

Sweet, looks like we signed Brett Hull as well.
- http://flames.nhl.com/club/player.htm?id=8448091

[ignite09]

Originally Posted by vman

Trade up to #2 and take Mackinnon

I'm guessing it would take all three first round picks and then some to pull that off. Our prospect pool is way too shallow to make that move IMO.

[ricardodw]

Originally Posted by blankall

The game has changed. In the clutch and grab days you needed size and power. Now many of the top forwards are smaller. Top notch forwards who are sub 5'10 are plentiful in the NHL.

GMs, as a whole, have adjusted their drafting strategies accordingly. All things being equal, the bigger player is still desirable. But being small isn't nearly as prohibative as it was, and GMs are far more likely to choose a small player in the top 60 than they were even 2-3 years ago.

Just taking the top 30 scorers in the NHL this last season..... exactly one under 5' 11" St. Louis

Over 6-2 ie 6-3 and taller (7) Ovechkin, Staal, Getzlaff, Ladd, Nash, Kopitar and Wheeler

[T@T]

Originally Posted by ignite09

I'm guessing it would take all three first round picks and then some to pull that off. Our prospect pool is way too shallow to make that move IMO.

I would do 2 of the first rounders and any roster player not named Sven for Mackinnon.

Mackinnon is worth it easily.

[BACKCHECK!!!]

Originally Posted by blankall

The game has changed. In the clutch and grab days you needed size and power. Now many of the top forwards are smaller. Top notch forwards who are sub 5'10 are plentiful in the NHL.

This is not correct.

Only 9 players in the NHL under 5'10" scored even a modest 20 points this season (a 34 point pace).

So, no, top notch forwards under 5'10" are not plentiful in the NHL.

[BloodFetish]

Originally Posted by ricardodw

Don't know how he got there but on the Flames site

Probably from the last time an NHL team held his rights...

Traded to Phoenix by Tampa Bay with Mike Johnson, Paul Mara and NY Islanders' 2nd round choice (previously acquired, Phoenix selected Matthew Spiller) in 2001 Entry Draft for Nikolai Khabibulin and Stan Neckar, March 5, 2001. Rights traded to Atlanta by Phoenix with Kirill Safronov and Phoenix's 4th round choice (Patrick Dwyer) in 2002 Entry Draft for Darcy Hordichuk and Atlanta's 4th (Lance Monych) and 5th (John Zeiler) round choices in 2002 Entry Draft, March 19, 2002. Traded to Calgary by Atlanta for Marc Savard, November 15, 2002.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by BACKCHECK!!!

This is not correct.

Only 9 players in the NHL under 5'10" scored even a modest 20 points this season (a 34 point pace).

So, no, top notch forwards under 5'10" are not plentiful in the NHL.

NHL players all lie about heights. Include player at 5'11 and many at 6'0 and it's going to be a lot more revealing. 6'0 just sounds better, and a lot of players who are 5'10 will inflate their stats.

The point is that smaller players are more viable options in the NHL since the crackdown on obstructions, which is true. GMs, including Feaster are all adapting that new reality. So looking at Feaster's drafting record from 10 years ago and saying he likes only big players is pretty irrelevant.