Friedman: Gaudreau negotiations will be put on hold during World Cup

[TheScorpion]

^ Of which there is no evidence of its existence. I know I've brought it up before, but the more I think of it the less plausible it seems.

[Machiavelli]

How can there be a Gio cap when he's not the best player on the team?

[Bourque's Twin]

The Gio cap doesn't make sense after the season Johnny just had. He creates most of the Flames offense and is the team's best player.

The Gio cap made sense when Brodie and Hamilton signed, even Monahan. But it's different for Johnny and now the organisation is in a difficult position. They made everyone else do it and now they're trying to make Johnny do it in order to honour what they preached.

Just give the kid what he deserves, which is more than 6.75 long-term and move on. I don't think Gio or anyone else is going to care. It's a better decision than letting this drag out any longer.

[CroFlames]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Yeah, just like Ovechkin had to do before he was considered a top 5 player.

A few 50 goal seasons are an exception to leading a team to a WCF.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Machiavelli

How can there be a Gio cap when he's not the best player on the team?

Well that's certainly debatable. For the last 3 years Gio has put up excellent offensive d-man numbers on a per game basis, all while playing the toughest competition solid defensively and leading the team on and off the ice.

PPG:
2015/16: 0.68 *Scored 21 goals! (10th overall in PPG, but a tough year for the entire team)
2014/15: 0.79 (2nd only to Erik Karlsson)
2013/14: 0.73 (3rd to Duncan Keith and Erik Karlsson)

When you're putting up production in the same breath as Erik Karlsson and Duncan Keith, you deserve to be called the best player on your team. Sorry, I love Johnny and Monahan and all the rest of our young and exciting players, but Giordano is the real f'ing deal and people need to start appreciating him again. Even at his current contract, he's a bargain*.


*Currently. 4 or 5 years, who knows?

[Bingo]

A guy that finished top 10 in NHL scoring should put up points shouldn't he? I don't see that altering the negotiation at all.

"see my client can score!"

"we knew that"

as others have said it's exhibition games against a team that is old and disinterested. If Gaudreau's hockey season was measured on 82 games against the Oilers he'd have 250 points.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Yeah, just like Ovechkin had to do before he was considered a top 5 player.

AO is a sure fire HOF player that's amongst the all time NHL greats in goal scoring. Not sure exactly what point you are trying to make here as he's a prime example of a player deserving of his big contract. Johnny is a great player and all but in a discussion of salary justification comparing them in any manner is kind of silly.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Well that's certainly debatable. For the last 3 years Gio has put up excellent offensive d-man numbers on a per game basis, all while playing the toughest competition solid defensively and leading the team on and off the ice.

PPG:
2015/16: 0.68 *Scored 21 goals! (10th overall in PPG, but a tough year for the entire team)
2014/15: 0.79 (2nd only to Erik Karlsson)
2013/14: 0.73 (3rd to Duncan Keith and Erik Karlsson)

When you're putting up production in the same breath as Erik Karlsson and Duncan Keith, you deserve to be called the best player on your team. Sorry, I love Johnny and Monahan and all the rest of our young and exciting players, but Giordano is the real f'ing deal and people need to start appreciating him again. Even at his current contract, he's a bargain*.


*Currently. 4 or 5 years, who knows?

I like Gio and all but IMO Brodie is the better on ice defenseman on this team. I realize Gio is the captain and leader of the team so he is a big cog in the wheel. He's fairly paid today but the issue becomes three years in the deal when he's no longer top pairing for this team. It's one of those contracts that a lot of teams have where it's pay later to be better today.

[Gaudreauvertime]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

^ Of which there is no evidence of its existence. I know I've brought it up before, but the more I think of it the less plausible it seems.

I've heard numerous people in the media reference the idea that they decided on using Gio contract to set the internal cap structure. There's no hard evidence of anything we've been discussing, but where there's smoke, there is typically fire.

And if that is the case, I don't see a long term deal in the cards. Johnny would be giving up way too much, and his agent knows it.

[CroFlames]

Millions speculated on a Gio cap, and that was the extent of it. If anyone ran with it, that's shoddy journalism.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I like Gio and all but IMO Brodie is the better on ice defenseman on this team. I realize Gio is the captain and leader of the team so he is a big cog in the wheel. He's fairly paid today but the issue becomes three years in the deal when he's no longer top pairing for this team. It's one of those contracts that a lot of teams have where it's pay later to be better today.

Giordano is still a better defender and has a superior shot compared to Brodie. Gio's compete level is still very high and gives maximum effort whenever he's out there. Sometimes I long for Brodie to be a little tougher along the boards and in front of the net. One thing I'll say is that Brodie is a much better passer and a better skater. Both players are pretty equivalent in hockey IQ and reading the play.

If you ask me who to pick at this very moment, I still take Giordano by a hair. Long term it's Brodie, no question.

As for the risk of him dropping off the top pair...I'll believe it when I see it. If it happens, it'll largely be because Hamilton has surpassed him, not necessarily because his level of play will drop off that badly. You have to consider that Hamilton would be on any other team's top pairing straight away (maybe not the Predators with Josi and Subban).

[bettman]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

Millions speculated on a Gio cap, and that was the extent of it. If anyone ran with it, that's shoddy journalism.

To be precise, I believe he said it was a managerial philosophy. A "Gio Cap" is a creation of someone else.

[FlamesAddiction]

It was widely speculated during the Iginla days that there was an "Iginla-cap", but it's a different management now. Unless it is a concept dictated from the owners, then I don't thing there is really grounds to assume a "Gio-cap" exists.

[The Fonz]

Can still give Gaudreau the contract he's after, while staying true to the 'Gio-cap', should it exist. They could sign him to an 8yr deal @ 7.275M, while staying compliant to that rule.

6.700
6.700
6.700
6.700
6.700
6.700
9.000
9.000
= 7.275 AAV

[MrMastodonFarm]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

It was widely speculated during the Iginla days that there was an "Iginla-cap", but it's a different management now. Unless it is a concept dictated from the owners, then I don't thing there is really grounds to assume a "Gio-cap" exists.

Don't recall that Iginla cap thing at all. It's not like anyone really came close to earning the same contract as him anyways.

As for this Gio-Cap nonsense... didn't Francis put it to bed last week, saying the Flames had a range for Gaudreau, between Monahan and Gio, but that it could go over that and Giordano isn't one to care if a guy is paid more.

Anyone still pushing this thing hasn't been paying attention and just wants to push some pro-Gaudreau talking points.

[Frequitude]

The more I think about it the more I favor a 6 year deal. Basically, don't pay for that 7th or 8th expensive UFA year to help keep the cap hit down. Keeps our salary structure in better shape while we compete and have to extend Bennett and eventually Tkachuk.

Basically, take 6 years of pleasurable cap situation in exchange for either:
a) losing him 2 years early (because if he's leaving after 6, he's leaving after 8)
b) paying him big dollars 2 years early (because if he's getting paid after 6, he's getting paid after 8)

6 years at a friendly cap hit is way more valuable to me than that extra year or two. And 6 years is a long freakin' time.

[Bingo]

Plus it doesn't take much to take a Flames stance on salary and apply a Gio cap when there wasn't one.

The Flames may think he should be paid between 6.5 and 6.75 based on math, not based on Giordano being the highest paid player as a rule.

As I've said numerous times my starting point was always 5.5x5 + 8.5x3 for $6.6 and I certainly wasn't aiming to be under Giordano.

The 5 years of RFA drag the deal down, not a captain that signed a UFA deal.

[TheoFleury]

I don't think Gaudreau signs for 5.5m x 5 even though that takes him to UFA, he's worth more than 7.5% of the cap, RFA years or not. 5.5m is what he gets for 3 years, I think. Years 4 and 5 are worth 7m. 6-8 are worth 9m.

3 years @ 5.5m
2 years @ 7m
3 years @ 9m

8 years 57.5m for a $7.19m cap hit is the least I can imagine over a max term deal. No way all those RFA years are worth the same. Gaudreau know that if he signs a 2 or 3 year bridge, the cap hit on his next deal will start with at least a 7.

I imagine if Gaudreau can't get them to see this he'll eventually just sign that bridge contract.

[taco.vidal]

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

I don't think Gaudreau signs for 5.5m x 5 even though that takes him to UFA, he's worth more than 7.5% of the cap, RFA years or not. 5.5m is what he gets for 3 years, I think. Years 4 and 5 are worth 7m. 6-8 are worth 9m.

3 years @ 5.5m
2 years @ 7m
3 years @ 9m

8 years 57.5m for a $7.19m cap hit is the least I can imagine over a max term deal. No way all those RFA years are worth the same. Gaudreau know that if he signs a 2 or 3 year bridge, the cap hit on his next deal will start with at least a 7.

I imagine if Gaudreau can't get them to see this he'll eventually just sign that bridge contract.

I agree with your line of thinking.

I think its the back end dollars that are the sticking point. If youre a player signing for 7 or 8 years today, youve seen how the salary cap has gone up and you would want to make sure that what you are earning in the later years of that contract will be market value at that time. What're UFA stars going to be signing for in 7 or years? 12 million per season? More? 13?

If its 8 years, something like this
5,5,6,7,8,9,10,10.5
8 year, 60.5 total, 7.56 aav

[TheoFleury]

^ I think accepting a little less than superstar money in years 7-8 is fair. There is still some risk for Calgary that Gaudreau doesn't become Pat Kane. He has to give a little here, just as the Flames have to give a little on his RFA years. This is hardly a regular RFA negotiation.