Friedman: Gaudreau negotiations will be put on hold during World Cup - Page 55 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

GreenLantern2814 · 09-10-2016, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaudreauvertime

Why would you pay him at 29 for stuff he has done but is unlikely to continue doing? That's the problem with the current paradigm most teams subscribe to. That's why there are so many dead weight contracts in the NHL.

I mean we literally just made that mistake with Gio.

If we sign Johnny for 7.5M-8M for 8 years, that contract is going to look like a steal in a few years, when we should begin entering our cup window. Unfortunately, we'll also have a declining Gio on the books . . .

Right now Gaudreau has scored 16 fewer points then his centre over their respective careers. His centre, btw, who makes 6.38/year. And was playing in the NHL as an 18 year old.

Gaudreau plays the least valuable position on the ice, and none of his peers are making anywhere close to 8. He has no negotiating rights. He has one 78 point season, which is only barely better than Jordan Eberle's career high.

Simply put, he is not an $8M player in this economic reality. And if we're meant to think $8M is a bargain in two or three years (it won't be), imagine what a deal we'll think $7.1 is.

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by transplant99

Im curious...how does he leave after 3 years?

Any player can leave whenever they want, all they have to do is ask for a trade. It might take several months but eventually the player will be traded if they want to be.

transplant99 · 09-10-2016, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Any player can leave whenever they want, all they have to do is ask for a trade. It might take several months but eventually the player will be traded if they want to be.

OK...well he can ask for a trade anytime he liked regardless of what deal he signs...so why is it more of an issue because he signs a bridge deal?

Its a ridiculous argument.

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 07:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by transplant99

OK...well he can ask for a trade anytime he liked regardless of what deal he signs...so why is it more of an issue because he signs a bridge deal?

Its a ridiculous argument.

That's not what I'm saying. I'm just pointing out that RFA years aren't these magical things that keep a player tethered to a team unless he allows them to be.

GreenLantern2814 · 09-10-2016, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

That's not what I'm saying. I'm just pointing out that RFA years aren't these magical things that keep a player tethered to a team unless he allows them to be.

Right... But care to cite examples of RFA players who demanded trades three years into 7+ year contracts because of acrimonious negotiations to get to said contract three years earlier?

Is he now Johnny Passive Aggressive?

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Right... But care to cite examples of RFA players who demanded trades three years into 7+ year contracts because of acrimonious negotiations to get to said contract three years earlier?

Is he now Johnny Passive Aggressive?

Most teams treat their players well enough they wouldn't do it. However, just because something rarely happens doesn't mean it's something to disregard. I'm not saying the Flames are doing this, I'm just questioning the notion that the fact Gaudreau is an RFA means that he's forced to play ball the way the Flames want or not play at all. All, or even most, of the leverage isn't with the team here as most suggest imo. Gaudreau always has a nuclear option whether people want to admit it or not.

GreenLantern2814 · 09-10-2016, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Most teams treat their players well enough they wouldn't do it. However, just because something rarely happens doesn't mean it's something to disregard. I'm not saying the Flames are doing this, I'm just questioning the notion that the fact Gaudreau is an RFA means that he's forced to play ball the way the Flames want or not play at all. All, or even most, of the leverage isn't with the team here as most suggest imo. Gaudreau always has a nuclear option whether people want to admit it or not.

He can demand a trade all he wants. Jonathan Drouin demanded a trade. The Flames are under no obligation to grant his request.

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 07:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

He can demand a trade all he wants. Jonathan Drouin demanded a trade. The Flames are under no obligation to grant his request.

Drouin got what he wanted eventually. The Flames would eventually trade Gaudreau if he asked. That's just a fact.

Street Pharmacist · 09-10-2016, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Dronin got what he wanted eventually

So did Yzerman more importantly

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

So did Yzerman more importantly

He was thiiiiis close to getting hosed on value for Drouin. Don't act like it was part of a masterful plan by Yzerman.

MrMastodonFarm · 09-10-2016, 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

That's not what I'm saying. I'm just pointing out that RFA years aren't these magical things that keep a player tethered to a team unless he allows them to be.

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Drouin got what he wanted eventually. The Flames would eventually trade Gaudreau if he asked. That's just a fact.

Jonathan Drouin, who asked for a trade and never got traded, is the example you choose to give?

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrMastodonFarm

Jonathan Drouin, who asked for a trade and never got traded, is the example you choose to give?

He wanted to play.

Street Pharmacist · 09-10-2016, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

He was thiiiiis close to getting hosed on value for Drouin. Don't act like it was part of a masterful plan by Yzerman.

His plan all along was to either 1) get Drouin to earn his way to being an important and good player for the team, or 2) failing that, get proper value for what he admitted was a very good player.

I'd say they both got what they wanted

JiriHrdina · 09-10-2016, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

He was thiiiiis close to getting hosed on value for Drouin. Don't act like it was part of a masterful plan by Yzerman.

How was he thiiiiis close to getting hosed on value? He didn't make a trade. You have no clue what the offers were or how close he was to making a deal.
If anything I think how things played out shows how GMs can ensure they DON'T get hosed simply by not bending to the demand.

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Street Pharmacist

His plan all along was to either 1) get Drouin to earn his way to being an important and good player for the team, or 2) failing that, get proper value for what he admitted was a very good player.

I'd say they both got what they wanted

Yeah it could've worked out bad for Yzerman but it didn't. It was pretty much always going to end up as a win-win for Drouin though once he decided to take his ball and go home. Only to the point where he eventually proved his worth on the ice obviously.

Imagine if he looked bad in the playoffs? Or got benched? Good bye trade value. Yzerman must be thanking his lucky stars that everything worked out the way it did.

For the record I don't like Drouin, I think he's a prima donna. I'm just choosing to not ignore how much power an RFA has.

Enoch Root · 09-10-2016, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Yeah it could've worked out bad for Yzerman but it didn't. It was pretty much always going to end up as a win-win for Drouin though once he decided to take his ball and go home. Only to the point where he eventually proved his worth on the ice obviously.

Imagine if he looked bad in the playoffs? Or got benched? Good bye trade value. Yzerman must be thanking his lucky stars that everything worked out the way it did.

For the record I don't like Drouin, I think he's a prima donna. I'm just choosing to not ignore how much power an RFA has.

Yeah, he would have really showed them then!

GreenLantern2814 · 09-10-2016, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Drouin got what he wanted eventually. The Flames would eventually trade Gaudreau if he asked. That's just a fact.

But why would he ask for a trade midway through his deal?

If he wants money, he can't get it from anywhere else. He's already got the #1 LW spot and PP time.

Since 2005, there is one RFA who has missed NHL games in a contract dispute. Ryan O'Reilly's relationship with the Avalanche was always rockier than Johnny's with the Flames, which has never been anything but positive.

Johnny's leverage is time before the season starts. He will take the best deal he can get before he is in danger of missing time. He will come to camp in fighting shape after the world cup, and in a month we will all forget this stupid thread ever existed.

Street Pharmacist · 09-10-2016, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Yeah it could've worked out bad for Yzerman but it didn't. It was pretty much always going to end up as a win-win for Drouin though once he decided to take his ball and go home. Only to the point where he eventually proved his worth on the ice obviously.

Imagine if he looked bad in the playoffs? Or got benched? Good bye trade value. Yzerman must be thanking his lucky stars that everything worked out the way it did.

For the record I don't like Drouin, I think he's a prima donna. I'm just choosing to not ignore how much power an RFA has.

It's a giant risk for Drouin because Yzerman could've just held him out and he'd have missed millions in cities earnings.

They both had risks, but Yzerman want just risking Drouin. He was risking the next time a kid that wasn't getting the playing time they thought they deserves would do the same thing again

JiriHrdina · 09-10-2016, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheoFleury

Yeah it could've worked out bad for Yzerman but it didn't. It was pretty much always going to end up as a win-win for Drouin though once he decided to take his ball and go home. Only to the point where he eventually proved his worth on the ice obviously.

Imagine if he looked bad in the playoffs? Or got benched? Good bye trade value. Yzerman must be thanking his lucky stars that everything worked out the way it did.

For the record I don't like Drouin, I think he's a prima donna. I'm just choosing to not ignore how much power an RFA has.

What power?
Nothing happened.
He only played because the Lightning wanted him to play, not because they gave into his demands.

TheoFleury · 09-10-2016, 08:09 PM

Too much to respond to, phone beeping like crazy as I type lol. Sorry I'm not going to get to it all. I just don't think RFAs are as beholden to teams as some here think. That's all. I also think Tampa had much more to lose in the Drouin debacle than Drouin did. Drouin was always going to get another chance and Yzerman's position was not improving with the holdout, I'm not sure how anyone could argue that. If he hadn't performed in the playoffs, that would make it worse. I'm not sure where all this contention is coming from, I'm not trying to say the sky is green here.