Blue Jays offseason - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

flambers · 10-31-2009, 11:37 AM

Have not seen a thread yet.... below are a few moves so far.

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news...=.jsp&c_id=tor

"The Jays made a waiver claim Thursday, grabbing left-handed reliever Sean Henn from the Orioles.
To make room for Henn on the 40-man roster, the Jays designated catcher Michael Barrett for assignment. "

From a Coaching perpective a few moves were announced yesterday

http://www.tsn.ca/story/?id=296641

"Gone from 2009's dysfunctional group are pitching coach Brad Arnsberg, who leaves for the same role in Houston after he and Gaston butted heads for much of the year, and hitting coach Gene Tenace, a close friend of Gaston who retires after failing to form a productive working relationship with most of the team's batters."

Article states Cito will retire after next season.

flambers · 10-31-2009, 11:42 AM

Here is an interesting article from the Toronto Sun....first time I have read an article where it shows a specualated trade involving Wells.

http://www.torontosun.com/sports/col...88066-sun.html

"The Chicago Cubs would like to -- have to -- deal disgruntled outfielder Milton Bradley. And one player they are eyeing as a target destination is the Blue Jays, with centre fielder Vernon Wells going to the Cubs in return. "

CaramonLS · 10-31-2009, 12:03 PM

We can pray.

I think Bradley is a good baseball player, who can be manipulated into playing good ball - We'll see if Cito is the right man to do that.

I'd love to be able to deal Wells and get out from under that contract. At least Chicago can bury their problems with more money.

I personally think it is a pipedream.

cross16 · 10-31-2009, 12:04 PM

As much as i would like to see them rid themsevles of Wells' contract, not for Bradley. I'll take the salary hit over Brandley's head case attitude. Considering multiple teams have had a problem with Bradley, i woudln't put any confidence in toronto or Cito being any different.
I like Arnsberg's dissimal/resignation. I've read some other people's opinions on this, but I think the jays pitching staff (outside of Halladay) has not had good injury history under Arnsberg. I have a hard time believing that somehow Arnsberg's pitching program isn't related to that.

Sylvanfan · 10-31-2009, 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

We can pray.

I think Bradley is a good baseball player, who can be manipulated into playing good ball - We'll see if Cito is the right man to do that.

I'd love to be able to deal Wells and get out from under that contract. At least Chicago can bury their problems with more money.

I personally think it is a pipedream.

Bradley is a really moody character, but it seems like he performs reasonably well in markets where Baseball isn't a primary sport. Let's face it any deal where you can rid yourself of even 50% of the money owed to Vernon Wells would have to be viewed as a serious win.

moon · 10-31-2009, 12:54 PM

It would be an interesting move as it is obviously great to get rid of the Wells contract but if you are rebuilding is Bradley a guy you really want in your clubhouse?

In a lame duck year I don't see Cito getting up off the bench long enough to deal with Bradley when he seems reluctant to do anything when he doesn't have a cushy 4 year deal waiting for him regardless of what happens this year.

I guess though with a contract like Wells you can't really be picky about what you get back.

bluejays · 10-31-2009, 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flambers

Here is an interesting article from the Toronto Sun....first time I have read an article where it shows a specualated trade involving Wells.

http://www.torontosun.com/sports/col...88066-sun.html

"The Chicago Cubs would like to -- have to -- deal disgruntled outfielder Milton Bradley. And one player they are eyeing as a target destination is the Blue Jays, with centre fielder Vernon Wells going to the Cubs in return. "

I don't believe the Wells rumor whatsoever. Shortly after the Jays let Rios go, some writer wrote an article that the Jays should do a Wells/Bradley swap. This writer just seems to rehashing that same idea and calling it a rumor. Nobody will take the worst contract in baseball off the Jays' hands. Bradley's contract and attitude could be taken by some other team with Chicago paying a bit of it + prospects, so why would they want to take on $20M in Wells' albatross? Just makes no sense for any team to take the guy. He hasn't shown enough potential in years for any team to bother even taking the chance.

As for Arnsberg, I haven't read anything bad about the guy, so I don't know if he was part of the problem, but so many players have attributed their positive improvement to the guy. So from that perspective, I think his leaving is a loss to the team. Cito, I can understand why they want him just to finish out his contract, but what I don't understand is why they offer him a 4 year consulting contract when he may be involved with the team on a day-to-day basis, and we don't know how he'll interact with his players next year (have all the wounds healed?).

I like the GM selection because from hearing the guy speak, he's a down to earth person, and being a no-name guy, I'm sure will work his butt off to improve the team. I'm very curious to see what the guy does, and for the sake of us fans, I hope he does a good job.

moon · 10-31-2009, 01:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fleury

I don't believe the Wells rumor whatsoever. Shortly after the Jays let Rios go, some writer wrote an article that the Jays should do a Wells/Bradley swap. This writer just seems to rehashing that same idea and calling it a rumor.

Bob Elliott is a pretty respected writer and not a guy that would throw around a rumour just because another writer put it out there.

I am not saying it is true or not but I would give Elliott the benefit of the doubt.

Quote:

Nobody will take the worst contract in baseball off the Jays' hands. Bradley's contract and attitude could be taken by some other team with Chicago paying a bit of it + prospects, so why would they want to take on $20M in Wells' albatross? Just makes no sense for any team to take the guy. He hasn't shown enough potential in years for any team to bother even taking the chance.

Chicago doesn't really have to care about money since they make so much already.

Why give up prospects if you can get a player that may be able to get back some form and help you out?

Look at the other guys they are looking at they aren't exactly all-stars with great contracts either.

flambers · 10-31-2009, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fleury

I don't believe the Wells rumor whatsoever.

.

I am hopeful something could happen but the Jays would need to send lots of $$$$...... It probably a long shot at best but to see the rumour, shows the GM is being active which is a great thing to see....

Sylvanfan · 10-31-2009, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flambers

I am hopeful something could happen but the Jays would need to send lots of $$$$...... It probably a long shot at best but to see the rumour, shows the GM is being active which is a great thing to see....

Yeah, I read a SportsNET artical and it said the Jays would pay half of the 86 million dollars difference between the Wells and Bradley contracts. Basically they'd have to pay Bradleys 10.5 salary for the next two years, plus about 7 million of Wells, than for the last 4 years more or less 7 million of Wells.

No wonder they got rid of Ricciardi, people are hoping the Jays can find a way to make that Wells contract into a 43 million dollar mistake! That just blows my mind how much money he ended up wasting when you consider Ryan, Thomas, and now maybe Wells probably a few others I'm not thinking of.

flambers · 11-04-2009, 07:55 AM

http://toronto.bluejays.mlb.com/news...=.jsp&c_id=tor

Jays make a minor move on Tuesday, claiming Jarrett Hoffpauir off waivers

ShaolinFlame · 11-04-2009, 05:30 PM

This team will go nowhere unless somebody takes Vernon "fishing"; and by fishing, I mean shoot him the back of the head and dump him in Lake Ontario.

OILFAN #81 · 11-07-2009, 01:13 PM

Not a big baseball fan but I thought this should be posted:

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/story/?id=297543

Overbay for Snyder is being discussed.

Romanrules · 11-07-2009, 01:18 PM

Well during the season they have been talking about moving Lind to 1B. Maybe this move is with the intention of moving Lind over to 1B.

flambers · 11-07-2009, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OILFAN #81

Not a big baseball fan but I thought this should be posted:

http://www.tsn.ca/mlb/story/?id=297543

Overbay for Snyder is being discussed.

I like the idea of trading Overbay... then convert Lind to first.

Snyder is a risk for sure........ Has had serious injury problems.

JayP · 11-07-2009, 01:31 PM

Wouldn't be a bad trade for the Jays.

Overbay simply doesn't provide enough offense from the 1B position. Moving Lind there would be ideal as he simply isn't a good enough OFer.

Synder is an above average offensive catcher. Before last season's injury-plagued season he put up years of .800 and .775 OPS which is usually around 10th in the league for catchers. Obviously it's a question mark whether he can bounce back from his injuries, but Overbay is gone after next season anyways so the risk is worth it as far as I'm concerned.

CaramonLS · 11-08-2009, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayP

Wouldn't be a bad trade for the Jays.

Overbay simply doesn't provide enough offense from the 1B position. Moving Lind there would be ideal as he simply isn't a good enough OFer.

Synder is an above average offensive catcher. Before last season's injury-plagued season he put up years of .800 and .775 OPS which is usually around 10th in the league for catchers. Obviously it's a question mark whether he can bounce back from his injuries, but Overbay is gone after next season anyways so the risk is worth it as far as I'm concerned.

Not a good trade IMHO.

Trading one of your best hitters vs. RHP (75% of the pitching) is backwards thinking. Even at his Peak, Snyder has big splits, and it wouldn't help this team.

Lyle Overbay hit 282/396/509 vs. Righties this year. That's great and a major benefit to one of this teams biggest weaknesses. Just give him a good platoon partner and you're set (not Kevin Millar).

bluejays · 11-08-2009, 08:35 AM

I'm not with you on this one CLS. On a day to day basis, Overbay, Wells and Rios stood out as the guys who were just not pulling their weight when it came to offence. Overbay is a very very good fielder, but how often does that really benefit the team at his position enough to keep him in the everyday lineup because of it? I don't think they can get much, if anything for him, but if he's gone, I'd like to see what Travis Snider can do at 1st. Despite his injuries he has to get regular playing time to prove what he can do; and Lind in LF (Snider isn't good enough to play the OF). Millar will be gone, that's already been said, so that's 2 spots where the Jays can hopefully add a big bat - DH and RF. This team isn't that far off from being a very good competitor. Pitching is probably good enough, IMO, power wasn't good for them last year, and they can quite easily correct that this year.

Edit: just read the article and I just realized the Jays are discussing Overbay for Snyder (duh on my part). I've only seen Snyder a couple time and nothing in particular stood out for me. His numbers look pretty bad too. I'm not sure what he brings to the Jays though. Hopefully Andropolopoloulouolos knows what he's doing here.

CaramonLS · 11-08-2009, 10:35 AM

Ok, check this out.

Our 2nd best hitter vs. RHP (vast majority of the pitching we face over a season) by a wide margin.

We can't trade him without trying to find a suitable replacement. Snyder isn't it.

Will Adam Lind be the *only* player to get a hit vs. RHP if we trade Overbay? Most players in MLB are right handed and tend to have fairly large splits stats. I.E. they "stat pad" vs. LHP and suck vs. RHP.

Sylvanfan · 11-08-2009, 11:24 AM

I see what you're saying Caramon. If you could find a way to combine Overbay and a guy like Ruiz into a platoon at first base than maybe you can get your .900 OPS, and 25 plus home runs with more than 100 Runs driven in.

Also how is Snyder going to do playing in the American League East where he's gotta go up against the BoSox, Yankees, and Rays pitching staff on a regular basis?

But I think money and age have to come into play and can you use the money you'd pay Overbay to find a corner outfielder or DH who will give you better production? What type of catcher can the Jays find for the coming year and can Snyder give you decent value? Is Overbay going to produce like that against right handed pitching next year or is he likely to slide again given that he'll be 34?

I really don't know the answers to those questions. Catcher is a tough position to fill and it sounded like the Jays weren't that keen on bringing Barajas back. So I'm not sure who they can get to play there for them.