What is wrong with our Canadian male atheletes? - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

Rerun · 02-26-2010, 08:55 AM

Now I know winning isn't everything in this world, but when you compare what Canadian women have done so far in in this Olympics (5-1/2 Gold, 5 Silver, 3 Bronze) to what the men have accomplished (2-1/2 Gold, 1 Silver), our women are far outshining our men and they certainly are doing their part to "Own the Podium".

Are we not putting enough $$$ into training our men? Or is it something else? There have been high hopes for a number of our men to medal in these games but on race day, the men seem to fold like a cheap suit. Do we need to hire some top notch sports shrinks? Whats the answer? Better training? Better facilities? Better coaching? Better programs to encourage male kids to get into Olympic sports?

Or, on average, are our females just better atheletes when it comes to competing against the rest of the world (ie competition isn't as tough in women's sports when you are competing against the rest of the world.... or at least the rest of the world that participates in winter sports)?

Anyways.... all I want to say is 3 cheers for our women atheletes! If it wasn't for them our medal performance, at these Olympics, would be pretty dismal.

GreenTeaFrapp · 02-26-2010, 08:57 AM

Two things.

One, our top athletes go to hockey for the most part. Two, other countries may not fund their female athletes to the same extent as they do their male athletes while here funding would be, I suspect, pretty equitable.

mykalberta · 02-26-2010, 09:02 AM

1 - our women are way to hot, and distract the men from training.
2 - we have the 34th most people of any country in the world and people need to take that into perspective
3 - elite athletes for the most part follow the money and the fame. In canada is any of these sports covered to any extent except durring olympics? Who dreams of winning gold speed skating, cross country skiing etc?

Bootsy · 02-26-2010, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreenTeaFrapp

Two things.

One, our top athletes go to hockey for the most part. Two, other countries may not fund their female athletes to the same extent as they do their male athletes while here funding would be, I suspect, pretty equitable.

Yeah that's the big one right there, I seen a Canadian female athlete talking about it, I think it was Clara Hughes and she basically said after witnessing all her international events over the years she feels very fortunate to be from Canada seeing the support the women get here compared to many other countries who fund the men much more.

ClubFlames · 02-26-2010, 09:08 AM

I don't know what's wrong but let's hope we can trade them for a couple of US prospects and a couple of draft choices.

/green text

JayP · 02-26-2010, 09:09 AM

Is this a growing trend or are we looking at one Olympics here? What was the ratio of men's medals to women's medals in Turin and Salt Lake City?

North East Goon · 02-26-2010, 09:09 AM

They are busy with creating condom shortages nationwide!

Pinner · 02-26-2010, 09:12 AM

Beat me to it Goon

Rerun · 02-26-2010, 09:16 AM

Lets take skiing/snowboarding for example...

We have a lot of male skiers & snowboarders in this country. We used to be a country to be reckoned with (ie Ken Read, Steve Podborski, and the other Crazy Canucks) and now... on average, we win nothing (with one or two notable exceptions)

Surely we have the talent in this country to consistantly win in all or if not most of the skiing and snowboarding disciplines... why don't we? What's gone wrong? Where are our New Crazy Canucks?

Rerun · 02-26-2010, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayP

Is this a growing trend or are we looking at one Olympics here? What was the ratio of men's medals to women's medals in Turin and Salt Lake City?

In Turin (2006) the women won 16 medals and the men won 8.

nieuwy-89 · 02-26-2010, 09:28 AM

Huge generalization here, so don't flame me too much...

The Canadian women appear to be more focussed and determined. The female athletes have to work harder to get where they are, and then continue that hard work to stay on top. They have to overcome gender stereotypes and in many cases defy the expectations of family and friends to make sacrifices for their sport. It makes them more disciplined. I'm an engineer and you also see this with females in engineering - they make great engineers because they have to work harder to overcome those obstacles.

The men seem aloof and cocky. I think being an elite male athlete in North America opens a lot of doors for these guys and gives them a sense of entitlement. Of course this doesn't apply in every case. Bilodeau, for example, seemed very focussed coming into his event and really wanted to win that first gold for Canada. But in general, high performing male athletes are pandered to, and don't need as much discipline and dedication as the ladies do.

troutman · 02-26-2010, 09:28 AM

Nothing's "wrong". The talent pool is just much deeper in men's winter sports.

For example, I imagine there are far more men bobsledders than women, world-wide. Same with hockey, ski-jumping etc.

Bring_Back_Shantz · 02-26-2010, 09:29 AM

It's already been said, but I'd support the two part theory that
1) Hockey is the dominant sport, so the best male athletes go there, leaving a smaller pool of elite athletes for other sports
2) I'd be willing to bet that Canada is well above average for the level of support given to female athletes vs male athletes. In amateur sports like speed skating, I'd be willing to bet that it's at least equal to the money/support the men get, which is probably well ahead of the support female athletes get in other countries.

habernac · 02-26-2010, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rerun

Lets take skiing/snowboarding for example...

We have a lot of male skiers & snowboarders in this country. We used to be a country to be reckoned with (ie Ken Read, Steve Podborski, and the other Crazy Canucks) and now... on average, we win nothing (with one or two notable exceptions)

Surely we have the talent in this country to consistantly win in all or if not most of the skiing and snowboarding disciplines... why don't we? What's gone wrong? Where are our New Crazy Canucks?

Our best male skiiers blew out knees mere months before the Olympics. John Kucera would have had a great shot at the podium. We've had a few great years leading up to the Olys, we just caught the injury bug at a bad time.

Rerun · 02-26-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bring_Back_Shantz

It's already been said, but I'd support the two part theory that
1) Hockey is the dominant sport, so the best male athletes go there, leaving a smaller pool of elite athletes for other sports
2) I'd be willing to bet that Canada is well above average for the level of support given to female athletes vs male athletes. In amateur sports like speed skating, I'd be willing to bet that it's at least equal to the money/support the men get, which is probably well ahead of the support female athletes get in other countries.

So are basically saying that our women perform the way they do because they get more money than women of other countries.

It would follow that once other countries increase their spending, or we decrease our spending towards women, the Canadian women's medal count will go down towards the men's totals?
Somehow I just don't believe that.

We have plenty of men in winter Olympic sports who are ranked in the top of their disciplines (particularly if its a sport they can make $$$ at), but when it comes to performing in the BIG SHOW, our men tend to crash and burn when the chips are down. I think its a psychological problem myself.

Frankly, I think our women are just tougher mentally than our men.

Bob · 02-26-2010, 10:24 AM

How many Canadian males have finish 4th or 5th in their events? Seems like a bunch are just missing out on medal opportunities ...

Rerun · 02-26-2010, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob

How many Canadian males have finish 4th or 5th in their events? Seems like a bunch are just missing out on medal opportunities ...

Exactly my point. Usually the difference between finishing 4th or 5th as compared to medaling... is in your head. Performing when the pressure is on or cracking and finishing out of the medals

Edit:

Take for example Kyle Nissen of Mens Freestyle aerials...

After the first jump he was in first place with 126.92 points (he had a 6.34 pt lead over the 2nd place guy who went on to win the gold). On his second jump he folded like a cheap suit and scored the second lowest of all the second jumps (112.39 pts) and ended up falling to 5th place. In order to win, all he had to do was score 121.5 points to win the gold, 120.3 pts to win the silver, or 115.62 pts to win the bronze.

tkflames · 02-26-2010, 10:29 AM

Part of it has to do with the importance of Women's sports in North America. Womens sport is funded here much better than most of the world. It is only recently that countries like China and many European countries have funded their female athletes.

Canadian Women therefore have an advantage until the rest of the world catches up.

Canadian Men are competing in a much greater talent pool, because the funding for men has been in place many more years. Canada tends to excel at newer sports (ski/snowboard cross, skeleton etc.) come to mind. This is the advantage to being a developed multicultural country where many citizens have the opportunity to try a variety of different sports.

In the long term I think we will see Canada win LESS overall medals, but continue our dominance in newer sports and traditional sports such as Curling and Hockey. I think if anyone were to do a study, they would find the funding to success (with a 10-20 year time delay) trend line would show significant correlation.

Russic · 02-26-2010, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rerun

So are basically saying that our women perform the way they do because they get more money than women of other countries.

It would follow that once other countries increase their spending, or we decrease our spending towards women, the Canadian women's medal count will go down towards the men's totals?
Somehow I just don't believe that.

We have plenty of men in winter Olympic sports who are ranked in the top of their disciplines (particularly if its a sport they can make $$$ at), but when it comes to performing in the BIG SHOW, our men tend to crash and burn when the chips are down. I think its a psychological problem myself.

Frankly, I think our women are just tougher mentally than our men.

I believe it. Every athlete that has won has said that the support from OTP was a big help. I have to imagine without that support many athletes would have the same shot.

As for the men, are our men (that have lost out) really in the top 3 in their fields? I'm not arguing, I'm unaware of the world ranking in most sports.

Rerun · 02-26-2010, 10:47 AM

We need more of this in our non hockey playing male atheletes....

Quote:

"I hate them," said Ryan Kesler, U.S. center and a player for the Vancouver Canucks. "It's a big rivalry. I wouldn't say I hate them; you have respect for the other team. Canadians expect to win the gold, and anything less is not good enough. It's going to be fun to try and knock them off."

Too often we seem to be just happy with showing up. Just getting to the Olympics is good enough. Every Olympics Canada sends one of the largest contingents yet ends up with a very poor percentage of medals... particularly in the mens sports.